Talk:Yen and yuan sign

Keyboard input

Might be worth adding that on Macs ¥ can be typed by Option-Y —Preceding unsigned comment added by 137.205.251.2 (talk) 08:43, 16 May 2008 (UTC)

The whole Computing section is confusing. In particular, the part talking about Alt codes is excessively verbose: it just needs the actual codes plus a link to Alt code, not a description of the whole procedure. Furthermore:-

• 157 is the OEM alt-code (as opposed to the ANSI alt-code) and OEM alt-codes are region-specific; for example, Alt+157 produces the symbol on US systems (which use OEM code page 437), while Western European machines (which use CP850) should use the Alt+190 instead, and machines that use other CPs may have different codes still.

In any case bias towards Windows operating systems should be avoided. These characters can be produced on any modern operating system. Some operating systems do not use Windows Codepages at all. My version of Debian for example is set up to use UTF-8 encoding.203.56.127.1 (talk) 21:04, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

• In addition to that, 02213 is just 165+2048. You can get the same result with 04263 (165+4096) and 08357 (165+8192) etc. Due to the way the encoding works, it only looks at the lowest 8 bits of whatever value it gets, so 02213 being a code for ¥ is more a side-effect of the system expecting an 8-bit value than anything else, and that's a topic for another article, not for ¥.

--Thegooseking (talk) 18:37, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

Here be dragons

Eleven years later but an update in case anyone reads this for the answer: Windows users need to be aware that it contains a trap for the unwary. Because Windows still uses code pages, the answer will depend on which code-page you have loaded – in effect, where in the world you are – as well as which app you are using. As of September 2020, here is a long (and not really resolved) discussion at talk:Unicode input#Decimal input (Windows). --John Maynard Friedman (talk) 11:24, 21 September 2020 (UTC)

Same character? Really?

In what sense are 元 and 円 the same character? In Japanese, 元 Chinese yuan and 円 Japanese yen. They're two different characters with distinct and non-overlapping meanings. (The third character 圓 appears not to be used in Japanese, according to WWWJDIC.) I believe a Chinese reader may have been generalising, but I'm not going to fix this myself because I don't know how to phrase this in a way that's accurate for both character sets.--62.58.152.52 (talk) 11:02, 22 February 2010 (UTC)

圓 is the formal one, 円 is just the Japanese simplification of 圓, 元 is the informal and fork, but most common, written of 圓 in China. --刻意(Kèyì) 11:18, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

yeah, just to expand: 圓 and a few variants are the OLD forms; 元 and 円 are modern, simplified versions. japanese use 円 exclusively, except for some formal/financial contexts where they still use the old ones (comparable to english spelling out numbers on a cheque). similar in china, but using the char 元 instead. taiwan and hong kong, meanwhile, more likely to use the old/fancy version than either japan or the PRC, as they both use way fewer simplified chars in general. ALL of these places pronounce them yen yuan or yuen, at least on paper (see final note), but hong kong and taiwan call theirs "dollars" when using english. USUALLY using dollar symbol to match -- often placed AFTER the number -- but not always (some use of ¥ on handwritten signs, for example).

also, taiwan and hong kong sometimes add "NT" and "HK" on theirs (NT$, HK$), even in shops, whereas "J¥" and "CN¥" are extremely rare outside of financial papers.

in other words:

japan: 円, rare occasions 圓 // ¥

PRC: 元, rare occasions 圓 // ¥

HK 元, 圓 // $, HK$, sometimes ¥

taiwan: 元, 圓 // $, NT$, sometimes ¥

i suspect there is some slight use of "HK¥" and "NT¥" as well, but again, mostly in informal, handwritten contexts.

btw, note that chinese read most all of these as "kuai" (diff character!) in everyday speech. so while a sign might say "50元" "¥50" or "50$", a person reading it will think, and say, "[fifty] kuai". teller at a bank or talking head on a financial show about the only time u will ever hear it as "[fifty] yuan".

it is comparable to reading "$20" as "twenty bucks". far more pervasive, tho. 66.30.47.138 (talk) 21:19, 13 April 2021 (UTC)

'Official' status of the single-stroke 'yuan' sign?

I'm not sure how the referenced article confirms the official status of the single-stroke 'yuan' sign for representing the Renminbi. Yes, it displays as a single-stroke 'yuan' on the webpage itself, but that is due to the font used; in the references it is displayed as a double-stroke 'yuan' on my browser. Furthermore, there is no image file attached to that page that could clear the matter up. 220.255.2.159 (talk) 15:05, 11 February 2011 (UTC)

• I can confirm that the two-stroke variation is used in mainland China today. I'm going to correct the article. --Xiaq (talk) 12:35, 23 February 2011 (UTC)
• The issue turned out more interesting and complex than I thought. The single-stroke version was officially specified but nowadays the double-stroke version is widely adopted. More investigation is needed. --Xiaq (talk) 12:43, 23 February 2011 (UTC)
• The single-stroke version is correct, although even the Central Bank of China also (wrongly) uses the double-stroke version in its bank notes. LR4087 (talk) 09:58, 13 June 2011 (UTC)
• It is possible that the Unicode Consortium, given its track record, screwed up again here and assigned the same character for the single stroke and double stroke variants. In Japan, a single stroke Yen symbol would likely not creep into their displays if it were not for the influence of a Unicode Consortium screw up. --Bxj (talk) 12:25, 12 July 2011 (UTC)
  • More likely, it was deliberate. The Unicode Consortium view of such things is that they are allographs, to use one or two strokes is a stylistic choice: the same logic was applied to the dollar sign (users of the Cifrao would beg to differ). But see also Pound sign#Double dash style. --John Maynard Friedman (talk) 11:24, 21 September 2020 (UTC)

Barcode / Price Label from "Hong Kong"

Shouldn't the description of this barcode / price label say from China not from Hong Kong. A quick websearch of the barcode number shows that the item the barcode belongs to is a greeting / Christmas card from China. Also the description on the image file itself says 'Chinese bar code, CNY9'. Troll-Life (talk) 04:19, 11 June 2012 (UTC)

• you are right, and Hong Kong use Hong Kong Dollar, no one use Renminbi in Hong Kong!--Samoht Nahc (talk) 16:48, 23 June 2012 (UTC)

Please don't misguide people! I urge you to change the indicated English proficiency in your profile. It definitely cannot be considered advanced level. --2001:16B8:3184:3600:D4B9:84E1:AEAD:A6FB (talk) 16:25, 26 September 2019 (UTC)

History

This article could be improved by adding information about history of the symbol. I haven't been able to find out much more than "The symbol for the Japanese yen was probably invented by analogy with the pound and dollar symbols, as it is a capital Y with one or two bars across it." [1] Can anyone else help shed light on this? Gareth Jones (talk) 12:01, 8 March 2013 (UTC)

Mention if there was ever any regret for using the same symbol for two major currencies. Or if "Well, '$' is used for more than one, so who cares?" Jidanni (talk) 06:37, 20 May 2020 (UTC)

Well who cares indeed? When there is s risk of confusion, the three letter codes JPY and CNR are used. Locally, each uses a different symbol anyway, in the local script. The ¥ sign is probably redundant but, well, history. --John Maynard Friedman (talk) 07:32, 20 May 2020 (UTC)

Article's title

There is a problem using a symbol which isn't appears on the keyboard as a title of an article, escpecially if an article about a symbol is named by the symbol and not by the symbol's name. Usually this type of titles are used as a redirect for another page. It's hard to reach and to find this article. I know it's a problem because it is both named "yen sign" and "yuan sign", but there should be another name, because not everybody knows how to check what are the redirects for the article, if they even know what a redirect is. Galzigler (talk) 17:51, 25 September 2013 (UTC)

(Yen,Yuan) (sign,symbol) all redirect to this article [2] automatically without a user knowing how redirects work. Did they not work for you?

By the Wikipedia naming conventions, the article title should be in Roman script, and a rename is in order. According to the article, the Yuan now uses 元, so perhaps Yen sign or Yen symbol would be the better title, but there are numerous other criteria that could be used to decide a name.--Wikimedes (talk) 18:59, 25 September 2013 (UTC)

In case someone wants to move the article to a Roman script title (Yen sign, Yen symbol, Yuan sign, or Yuan symbol):

• The New York Times seems to prefer "yen symbol", which would become "Yen symbol" for the article title . ("yuan symbol" here, with "yen sign" and "yuan sign" yielding zero meaningful hits.)
• The BBC and the Wall Street Journal don't appear to allow character string searches in the normal manner. Maybe there's a way I dont' know about?
• Google Ngrams only gets hits for Yen/yen symbol and Yen/yen sign, and none for Yuan/yuan symbol, Yuan/yuan sign, or any combination with sign or symbol capitalized. Yen/yen sign seems to have a slight edge over Yen/yen symbol [3], which would make the article title "Yen sign".
• Google Scholar has "Yen sign": 131 hits [4], "Yen symbol": 65 hits [5], "Yuan sign": 17 hits [6], and "Yuan symbol": 14 hits. So "Yen sign" again.

--Wikimedes (talk) 20:06, 25 September 2013 (UTC)

• Just a quick comment: "According to the article, the Yuan now uses 元" - not really, ¥ is still a common way to denote yuan, regardless of whether it's on a McDonald's menu, or when purchasing online on Taobao. The article currently reads "In mainland China, the Chinese character is more frequently written in everyday situations using the simpler character 元", emphasis added; the text refers to the Chinese character, not to be confused with the currency sign. What this means is, whilst the mainland uses the simpler 元, Taiwan still uses 圓. --benlisquare_T•C•E 10:14, 21 November 2013 (UTC)

Requested move 23 November 2016

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: Moved (non-admin closure) Fuortu (talk) 14:21, 1 December 2016 (UTC)

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¥ → Yen sign – Per consistency with dollar sign, pound sign, and euro sign. As for why "Yen sign" and not "Yuan sign", per WP:COMMONNAME, since "Yen sign" is the Unicode name of the character and the yen is more commonly traded on global markets than the yuan; the English-speaking world recognizes this symbol as a yen sign. ANDROS¹³³⁷_TALK 23:58, 23 November 2016 (UTC)

• Support. It is the only currency sign linked from {{punctuation marks}} that uses a symbol instead of words. It is also frowned upon by WP:TSC. I would recommend proposing this as a technical move request, since it seems uncontroversial to me. —Gordon P. Hemsley→✉ 06:04, 24 November 2016 (UTC)
• Oppose introduces the conflict between Yen and Yuan, as stated above, whereas the character has no such title conflict. I don't see what part of WP:TSC discourages this title. Pppery 15:39, 24 November 2016 (UTC)

The third and first points: "Symbols (avoid them)" and "Characters not on a standard keyboard (use redirects)". ¥ is a symbol that does not appear on most English language keyboards. —Gordon P. Hemsley→✉ 15:49, 25 November 2016 (UTC)

• Support using the spelled-out version which is in fact the name of the symbol. This won't introduce any conflict because the article already discusses its use as a currency symbol for both the yen and yuan. Besides, yen and yuan already redirect to pages which discuss the currencies. This page is about the symbol, not the currencies themselves. This is similar to dollar sign which is used to represent several different currencies, but the symbol itself is still called dollar sign (and dollar is a different article). kennethaw88 • talk 06:06, 25 November 2016 (UTC)
• Support per User:Andros 1337. The answer to the conflict point is (a) "Yen sign" is the common name per Unicode etc, and (b) both the article itself and redirects make clear that this is the sign for both yen and yuan. --MrStoofer (talk) 10:14, 28 November 2016 (UTC)
• Support – per consistency with similar articles per WP:CONSISTENCY – have the Unicode redirect to article. CookieMonster755 𝚨-𝛀 22:13, 28 November 2016 (UTC)

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Add 元 to the infobox?

I notice at renminbi, the symbol 元 is also used but the usage is unclear to me (who lives on the other side of the world) what its status is. Can anyone explain? Should it go in the infobox alongside ¥? --John Maynard Friedman (talk) 15:37, 22 November 2019 (UTC)

Charged in the center?

Can the persistent vandal at least explain what "charged in the center" means? Spitzak (talk) 12:32, 10 July 2023 (UTC)

Please don't feed the trolls. (But for a guess, see Charge (heraldry)). --𝕁𝕄𝔽 (talk) 15:44, 10 July 2023 (UTC)