Talk:103rd Street–Washington Heights station
Latest comment: 8 years ago by Number 57 in topic Requested move 3 February 2016
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Requested move 3 February 2016
edit- The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the move request was: no consensus. Whilst most participants were in favour of a move, there was no agreement on what the best alternative is. Number 57 19:29, 31 March 2016 (UTC)
Washington Heights (Metra station) → Washington Heights station – Per WP:USSTATION. My sense is that this is unambiguous, but there are numerous subway stations in Washington Heights, Manhattan which may be colloquially known as "Washington Heights station." I think a hatnote is enough for this article, but I welcome discussion. Mackensen (talk) 13:06, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
- Oppose - While you're right about Washington Heights (Metra station) being the only one in Washington Heights, Chicago, Washington Heights, Manhattan is just too well known, especially to New Yorkers and Long Islanders. Your proposal is kind of misleading. ---------User:DanTD (talk) 13:30, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
- @DanTD: Forgive me, but I specifically called out the possibility of confusion with Manhattan. It's the only reason I did a move request instead of just moving it. I then expressed my opinion that it was unambiguous, given that there are no other stations with the name Washington Heights, but allowed that I might be wrong and that disambiguation might be necessary. Mackensen (talk) 13:51, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
- Actually, New Yorkers don't usually call subway stations by their neighborhood (except some, like Woodlawn (IRT Jerome Avenue Line) or Flushing–Main Street (IRT Flushing Line)). No NYC Subway stations are called "Washington Heights". epicgenius (talk) 15:53, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
- epic genius is right about that, and your misunderstanding about my tone is perfectly reasonable. As much as I oppose these renamings, I never intended to sound hostile. But Washington Heights isn't a major hub like LaSalle Street Station. It's a local former Rock Island station used by Metra that nobody from outside of NYC or Chicago would be as familiar with. Also, regarding your mention of Metra's official names on the Beverly Hills Branch station thread, the official name for this one is "103rd Street, Washington Heights," which is also another reason not to rename "103rd Street – Beverly Hills (Metra station)." ---------User:DanTD (talk) 16:00, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
- This doesn't have anything to do with Beverly Hills. I have no idea why you think it does, nor will anyone else who reads this discussion. Please explain further on that discussion how the official name for this station has a bearing on that discussion. Regarding the name for this article, you're the one who created it at Washington Heights (Metra station) in the first place, apparently in defiance of both the signage and Metra's own usage. I'm not sure why you did that. If we no longer need to follow that usage then that's fine but Metra's convention of "Station, Neighborhood" in this case appears to be unique. I'm inclined to follow your original usage and ignore it as a strange outlier. Mackensen (talk) 16:15, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
- And I redirected 103rd Street - Washington Heights (Metra station) to this article, so it does have something to do with 103rd Street, which also has that Beverly Hills branch station. Somewhere along the way I thought everybody wanted to stick to the name "Washington Heights" for this one, otherwise I would've been fine with "103rd Street - Washington Heights." ---------User:DanTD (talk) 16:48, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
- You're ducking all the issues. What does or does not redirect to this article has little bearing on what the article is actually called. We have policies like WP:COMMONNAME and guidelines like WP:USSTATION which govern this discussion. Whether this has "something to do" with 103rd Street is irrelevant. Mackensen (talk) 19:15, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
- Are you even paying attention to what you're writing? I already told you that this station and the one on the Beverly Hills Branch BOTH include the name "103rd Street," and somehow you claim it's irrelevant. The relevance is right there in the names! I haven't been ducking anything. You're just trying to make an issue out of something that shouldn't be bothered with in the first place. I can't wait for you to screw up the Rail Runner stations with this crusade. The potential to rename Santa Fe Depot (Rail Runner station) and the trouble it's going to cause for all other Santa Fe Depots, including those in other parts of New Mexico, is sure to create the kinds of disasters I have been trying to thwart; the very thing that has happened to "Burlington stations." ---------User:DanTD (talk) 18:44, 5 February 2016 (UTC)
- I am reading what I'm writing, and I'm even reading what you're writing. And what I read was we shouldn't rename 103rd Street – Beverly Hills (Metra station) to Beverly Hills – 103rd Street (which is the proposal on the table), because this station is also on 103rd Street. Respectfully, I don't follow that argument. I also don't know what this has to do with Santa Fe. Perhaps we can stay in the Chicago area? Mackensen (talk) 19:02, 5 February 2016 (UTC)
- Dan, contrary to your opinion, opposing every single move is not going to be a winning matter. While I disagree with moves, at some point we gotta suck it up and change them. While I don't like Mackensen's original title and proposed my own, we're not going to win, aside of jumping around to other systems.Mitch32(I can have oodles of charm when I want to.) 05:34, 6 February 2016 (UTC)
- Are you even paying attention to what you're writing? I already told you that this station and the one on the Beverly Hills Branch BOTH include the name "103rd Street," and somehow you claim it's irrelevant. The relevance is right there in the names! I haven't been ducking anything. You're just trying to make an issue out of something that shouldn't be bothered with in the first place. I can't wait for you to screw up the Rail Runner stations with this crusade. The potential to rename Santa Fe Depot (Rail Runner station) and the trouble it's going to cause for all other Santa Fe Depots, including those in other parts of New Mexico, is sure to create the kinds of disasters I have been trying to thwart; the very thing that has happened to "Burlington stations." ---------User:DanTD (talk) 18:44, 5 February 2016 (UTC)
- You're ducking all the issues. What does or does not redirect to this article has little bearing on what the article is actually called. We have policies like WP:COMMONNAME and guidelines like WP:USSTATION which govern this discussion. Whether this has "something to do" with 103rd Street is irrelevant. Mackensen (talk) 19:15, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
- And I redirected 103rd Street - Washington Heights (Metra station) to this article, so it does have something to do with 103rd Street, which also has that Beverly Hills branch station. Somewhere along the way I thought everybody wanted to stick to the name "Washington Heights" for this one, otherwise I would've been fine with "103rd Street - Washington Heights." ---------User:DanTD (talk) 16:48, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
- This doesn't have anything to do with Beverly Hills. I have no idea why you think it does, nor will anyone else who reads this discussion. Please explain further on that discussion how the official name for this station has a bearing on that discussion. Regarding the name for this article, you're the one who created it at Washington Heights (Metra station) in the first place, apparently in defiance of both the signage and Metra's own usage. I'm not sure why you did that. If we no longer need to follow that usage then that's fine but Metra's convention of "Station, Neighborhood" in this case appears to be unique. I'm inclined to follow your original usage and ignore it as a strange outlier. Mackensen (talk) 16:15, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
- epic genius is right about that, and your misunderstanding about my tone is perfectly reasonable. As much as I oppose these renamings, I never intended to sound hostile. But Washington Heights isn't a major hub like LaSalle Street Station. It's a local former Rock Island station used by Metra that nobody from outside of NYC or Chicago would be as familiar with. Also, regarding your mention of Metra's official names on the Beverly Hills Branch station thread, the official name for this one is "103rd Street, Washington Heights," which is also another reason not to rename "103rd Street – Beverly Hills (Metra station)." ---------User:DanTD (talk) 16:00, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
- Actually, New Yorkers don't usually call subway stations by their neighborhood (except some, like Woodlawn (IRT Jerome Avenue Line) or Flushing–Main Street (IRT Flushing Line)). No NYC Subway stations are called "Washington Heights". epicgenius (talk) 15:53, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
- @DanTD: Forgive me, but I specifically called out the possibility of confusion with Manhattan. It's the only reason I did a move request instead of just moving it. I then expressed my opinion that it was unambiguous, given that there are no other stations with the name Washington Heights, but allowed that I might be wrong and that disambiguation might be necessary. Mackensen (talk) 13:51, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
- According to Metra the name of the station is actually 103rd Street with a disambiguation of Washington Heights, because of 103rd Street – Beverly Hills (Metra station). Oh boy! Secondarywaltz (talk) 19:56, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
- Which we can follow, though if we're following Metra's lead for this then we should for Beverly Hills (which I advocated). In that case I would suggest Washington Heights 103rd Street station or Washington Heights – 103rd Street station as the best fit for existing practices. Mackensen (talk) 20:59, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
- Use the hyphen. Mitch32(I can have oodles of charm when I want to.) 21:50, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
- Which we can follow, though if we're following Metra's lead for this then we should for Beverly Hills (which I advocated). In that case I would suggest Washington Heights 103rd Street station or Washington Heights – 103rd Street station as the best fit for existing practices. Mackensen (talk) 20:59, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
- Conditional support – To Washington Heights – 103rd Street station. The current proposed name will definitely confuse people. Mitch32(I can have oodles of charm when I want to.) 22:02, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
- Support as proposed, per WP:USSTATION. There are no other stations of this name, leaving no where for the base name Washington Heights station to go. If anyone is confused, add a hat note.--Cúchullain t/c 18:23, 10 February 2016 (UTC)
- That's going to be an extremely long hatnote as there are at least 5 NYC subway stations in Washington Heights, if not more. Mitch32(I can have oodles of charm when I want to.) 04:23, 16 February 2016 (UTC)
- Move to 103rd Street – Washington Heights (Metra station) or 103rd Street – Washington Heights station. The main name seems to be 103rd Street, while Washington Heights is a sort of neighbourhood marker, similar to 103rd Street – Beverly Hills (Metra station) etc. — Amakuru (talk) 17:11, 10 March 2016 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.