Talk:1974 Anti-Ahmadiyya riots

Unsatisfying...

This is an important article on an important subject. Unfortunately the article is currently sub-par, especially the quality of the language.

I hope that someone with some knowledge of the subject could

a) improve the language

b) put some meat on the "Background and Reasons" section

c) maybe put the timeline in a box? And only keep the more important events within the text of the article? The way it is now, it looks confusing.

d) add some sources

Cheers

Otto von B. (talk) 04:32, 8 September 2012 (UTC)

Yes, it's an important topic, but regrettably written in a sloppy, poor, subjective way with no sources presented. A remarkably poor article. Muhammad Mughal. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Muhammad Mughal (talk • contribs) 19:47, 16 October 2016 (UTC)

You are correct. I’ve added the historically correct reason and sources. See The 1974 ouster of the “Heretics”: What really happened? https://www.alhakam.org/the-1974-ouster-of-the-heretics-what-really-happened/ “On May 22, 1974, some 160 members of the Islami Jamiat-i-Talaba (IJT — the student of the Jamaat-i-Islami), boarded a train headed for Peshawar in the former NWFP.

On its way to Peshawar, the train stopped for a while at the Rabwa railway station. The city of Rabwa was predominantly an Ahmadiyya town and also housed the community’s spiritual headquarters.

As the train stopped at Rabwa, IJT students got out and began to raise slogans against the Ahmadiyya and cursed the community’s spiritual figurehead, Mirza Ghulam Ahmad.

The train then left the station taking the charged students to Peshawar. No untoward incident was reported apart from the slogan-chanting and cursing.

However, when the incident was related to some Ahmadiyya leaders in Rabwa, they ordered Ahmadiyya youth to reach the station … when the train stops again at Rabwa on its way back from Peshawar.

After finding out that the students would be returning to Multan from Peshawar on the 29th of May, dozens of young Ahmadiyya men gathered at the Rabwa station.

As the train came to a halt … a fight ensued …” CamillRose (talk) 02:30, 1 July 2022 (UTC)

See also https://www.dawn.com/news/1057427 CamillRose (talk) 02:40, 1 July 2022 (UTC)

Lede

I removed "Mass massacres of Ahmadis were done, while their boycott was also hold. Mosques were destroyed and every type of damage was given to the community." The phrase "mass massacres" is not only redundant, it is extra overly redundant. "boycott was also hold" has no meaning. --Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ) (talk) 02:41, 15 November 2014 (UTC)

Number of Deaths ??

There should be a figure, or at least an estimate, with a source, in the first line of the article. This should be the first concern for anyone wishing to improve this article, as otherwise noone knows the scale of the event. 37.11.56.13 (talk) 08:56, 31 August 2020 (UTC)

Pro-Ahmaddiya/Request to english wikipedians....

You seems to be Pro-Ahmaddiya just like you are "guarding" Ahmaddiya-related pages like 1974 Anti-Ahmadiyya riots and 1953 Lahore riots. In the blind favour of Ahmaddiya, you wrote or reverted in 1974 Anti-Ahmadiyya riots: Jamaat e Islami is Congress backed. but actual reality is totally different. JI is/was ideolgical oppenent of Congress till its birth and also its founder Maududi wrote a series of articles to support two nation theory (which is totally opposite to Congress's Composite Nationalism) which later published in his book Nationalism Problem or Nationalism Question (Urdu:مسئلہ قومیت, pronouncation:Masala Qomiat) and also left the authorship of Aljamia (magazine) of Jamiat Ulema Hind when it started supporting Congress in the stance of Composite Nationalism and in politics. İ suggest you to read the above stated book to know real history instead of reverting or writing blindly in favour of a specific party.By your attitude, the first impression of English Wiki on me is very bad and I seriously feels that on Eng wiki Propagandists have the full right to wrongly interpret the history of his own choice without any intervention from any other Admin author of wiki. I request the admins of Eng Wiki that if they are really serious to improve reputation of Eng Wiki, they should must read my this comment and should take the appropriate action needed to be done for the authenticity of the parties I mentioned and should penalize the people that are trying to do propaganda in favour of one party without knowing the complete fact. This guy Pepperbeast from his edit history is wholely seems to be a vocal propagandist in favour of a party and no solid action is taken against him till now. Condemns this policy of Eng Wiki, Who becomes the champion of Authenticity infront of other wikis. اقبال کا شاہین (talk) 01:09, 15 June 2021 (UTC)

Mate, relax. I don't profess to be any sort of expert. I just reverted some unexplained deletions that looked to be wp:pov, complete with deceptive "fixed typo" edit summaries. If you want to improve the article, don't make unexplained deletions, do use article talk pages to discuss proposed changes, and do add reliable sources as necessary. PepperBeast (talk) 02:03, 15 June 2021 (UTC)

The information in the article should be factual and historically correct

I’ve edited the article to make it factual and historically correct. I’ve added links for evidence. However some editors keep reverting to the incorrect information.

The major difference between Ahmadiyya and mainstream Muslims is not that Ahmadiyya believe Mirza was Jesus. The major difference is that Ahmadiyya believe Mirza was a separate prophet and that prophets can come after Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him. See https://ahmadiyya.ca/public/what-are-ahmadiyya-beliefs

Muslims believe that Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him was the last and final Prophet and Messenger of God, https://www.iium.edu.my/deed/articles/finalprophet.html. Ahmadiyya reject this faith. Ahmadiyya believe that Mirza Ghulam Ahmad was a Prophet. See https://ahmadiyya.ca/public/what-are-ahmadiyya-beliefs For these reasons, Ahmadiyya are considered a heretic sect and unbelievers by mainstream Muslims. See https://www.jstor.org/stable/26377347

The historic information about the Rabwa incident is also incorrect. The incident and riots weren’t started by Muslims. They were started by Ahmadiyya students when the Ahmadiyya students attacked and beat Muslim students who were passing through Rabwa rail station. See the article The 1974 ouster of the “Heretics”: What really happened? https://www.alhakam.org/the-1974-ouster-of-the-heretics-what-really-happened/ for details.

The article states: “On May 22, 1974, some 160 members of the Islami Jamiat-i-Talaba (IJT — the student of the Jamaat-i-Islami), boarded a train headed for Peshawar in the former NWFP.

“On its way to Peshawar, the train stopped for a while at the Rabwa railway station. The city of Rabwa was predominantly an Ahmadiyya town and also housed the community’s spiritual headquarters.

“As the train stopped at Rabwa, IJT students got out and began to raise slogans against the Ahmadiyya and cursed the community’s spiritual figurehead, Mirza Ghulam Ahmad.

“The train then left the station taking the charged students to Peshawar. No untoward incident was reported apart from the slogan-chanting and cursing.

“However, when the incident was related to some Ahmadiyya leaders in Rabwa, they ordered Ahmadiyya youth to reach the station … when the train stops again at Rabwa on its way back from Peshawar.

“After finding out that the students would be returning to Multan from Peshawar on the 29th of May, dozens of young Ahmadiyya men gathered at the Rabwa station.

As the train came to a halt … a fight ensued …“

The Ahmadiyya students who gathered at the rail station beat and injured the Muslim students. When news of this incident spread in the country, anti-Ahmadiyya riots started. CamillRose (talk) 02:28, 1 July 2022 (UTC)

See also https://www.dawn.com/news/1057427 which gives the full historic account. CamillRose (talk) 02:41, 1 July 2022 (UTC)

@CamillRose: Ahmadis regard themselves as Muslim, and that is enough for Wikipedia. We don't take sides in sectarian disputes. To do so would be a violation of the neutral point of view policy. PohranicniStraze (talk) 03:27, 1 July 2022 (UTC)

Let the article be factual and historically correct. The major difference between Ahmadiyya and mainstream Muslims is not that Ahmadiyya believe Mirza was Jesus. The major difference is that Ahmadiyya believe Mirza was a separate prophet and that prophets can come after Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him, while Muslims don’t believe this. See https://ahmadiyya.ca/public/what-are-ahmadiyya-beliefs CamillRose (talk) 03:37, 1 July 2022 (UTC)

The information in the article about why the riots started is also incorrect. CamillRose (talk) 03:38, 1 July 2022 (UTC)

Wikipedia wants accurate and unbiased information presented on its platform. The article as it is is biased and not a neutral presentation of the facts. CamillRose (talk) 03:41, 1 July 2022 (UTC)

Again, Wikipedia does not take sides in sectarian disputes. Your beliefs on whether Ahmadis are Muslim or not are not relevant, and attempting to add your opinions on the issue to the article is a clear NPOV violation. PohranicniStraze (talk) 03:48, 1 July 2022 (UTC)

Also, while there is definitely room to flesh out the details of what happened and add more details, your additions are quite clearly one-sided. From the Dawn article you added, the initial provocation was a group of IJT students who started to "raise slogans against the Ahmadiyya and curse the community's spiritual figurehead", which you reduce to "the students made anti-Ahmadiyya statements". In an earlier edit, you added allegations that the Ahmadis maimed the IJT students, including cutting off their noses and ears - allegations which are specifically called out by a source on the page as false and fictitious. You will need to be more objective with your additions if you are going to reach consensus here. PohranicniStraze (talk) 04:04, 1 July 2022 (UTC)

1974 Anti-Ahmadiyya riots in Pakistan - Real reason

The article needs to provide true and unbiased information about this incident.

The 1974 Anti-Ahmadiyya riots were the result of Ahmadi brutality against innocent unarmed Sunni Muslim students in Pakistan. The full account is given in the Dawn Newspaper article https://www.dawn.com/news/105742 as well as other newspapers of the time and also by eyewitnesses.

In evidence is the following timeline: May 22, 1974 - Muslim students passing through Rabwa rail station made anti-ahmadiyya statements. May 29, 1974 - when the students were again passing through Rabwa rail station on their way back home, Ahmadiyya students were waiting for them with hockey sticks and other weapons. The Ahmadiyya attacked the unarmed Muslim students and severely injured them, cutting off their noses and ears. When news spread of this attack on May 29, 1974, the people were outraged and country wide anti-Ahmadiyya riots started.

The riots started following the May 29 Ahmadiyya attack on the unarmed Muslim students. Riots did not start on May 22, when the Muslim students had initially passed through Rabwa rail station.

Wikipedia admins, please ensure that the correct factual unbiased historic information is in the article and not the biased Ahmadiyya version. CamillRose (talk) 11:41, 1 July 2022 (UTC)