Talk:Alan Ford (comics)

Racism

The article says: "The comic book ridicules aspects of American society, including capitalism and racism." I have all the Alan Ford classics (until #86), and I can't remember any number having anything to do with racism. The single sentence from "Don't vote for Notax" is hardly sufficient for justifying the claim in the article. By the way, the language in the "Yugoslav" translation is Croatian, not Serbo-Croatian. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 46.188.137.226 (talk) 16:15, 16 June 2021 (UTC)

Balkan issues

I'm from Croatia - and: it's Serbo-Croatian!

"They're not the same language, and if you think so you obviously don't now Croatian well."

With this you're obviously trying to insult people. Did you ever study Croatian language or literature?

"There are other languages which are very similar and mutualy understandable (eg. Czech and Slovakian, Swedish and Norwegian) but they are considered seperate languages (even by Wikipedia)"

Yes but those who separate them: they're not differentiated enough...if the'yre understandable in their semantics by their form, it's more like regionalism. there are only dia- or idiolects, even the "higher" languages are dialects. --134.2.213.43 21:50, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

Translations

The section on translations should be changed. Even if you could call the language in the initial translations "Serbo-Croatian", you can't in todays. I don't know what the translation is like in SCG but in Croatia it's in Croatian, I can only assume that in SCG it's in Serbian. A rewording is in order.

Please take a look at Serbo-Croatian. --Dejan Čabrilo 06:00, 21 July 2005 (UTC)

They're not the same language, and if you think so you obviously don't now Croatian well. There are other languages which are very similar and mutualy understandable (eg. Czech and Slovakian, Swedish and Norwegian) but they are considered seperate languages (even by Wikipedia). Just because politics tried to force these two languages together doesn't mean they realy are one language. The more time passes the differences become more obvious as new generations learn their own language rather than some hibrid.

I'm not trying to start a lingustic debate. I'm just saying that the original translations were in "Serbo-Croatian" because that was the inforced standard then, but now Croatian follows it's own standard (a work perpetualy in progress, as all languages are) and the current translations in Croatia are in Croatian not "Serbo-Croatian". Believe me, there is a significant difference, you may not notice it and I'll admit most Croats won't notice it, but some of us do! For instance, the scene in the article has Bob Rock saying: "...Ne naliči li ovo pomalo na pračku?". In Croatian that should be "...Ne izgleda li ovo pomalo kao pračka?". You may think that's splitting hairs, but I assure you it's not, "naličiti" is not a verb in the Croatian language.

My point is that the article should point out that it was originaly translated into "Serbo-Croatian" but with the break up of Yugoslavia new translations are in Croatian and Serbian.

I'm just saying that the original translations were in "Serbo-Croatian" because that was the inforced standard then, but now Croatian follows it's own standard (a work perpetualy in progress, as all languages are) and the current translations in Croatia are in Croatian not "Serbo-Croatian".

There ya go :) The article talks about the initial translation by Brixy. Also, you might want to consult some linguistic resources. --Dejan Čabrilo 09:16, 21 July 2005 (UTC)

Ah, whatever. I didn't come here to debate language. I do propose changing the sentence

Alan Ford was only translated into French and Serbo-Croatian.

to

Outside Italy Alan Ford was only published in France and the former Yugoslavia.

This would avoid any linguistic issues. Even if it was available in other countries it is still acurate as long as the edition wasn't published there.

Now to what I came here for. Serious Sam 2 (a FPS computer game comming out this fall) will have a weapon called the Klodovik bird which is a parrot with a bomb strapped to it's leg. This is obviously an Alan Ford reference (Croteam, the creators of SS2 are from Zagreb). If the game is as successfull as the original Serious Sam, it will make Alan Ford a (small) part of a wider pop culture. To most people this reference will be very obscure but I think it's worth mentioning it in this article, perhaps in a section called Alan Ford in pop culture. I'm not all that familiar with Alan Ford so I'm not going to mess with your work unless asked to.

Let's wait for the game to come out before we include that reference. --Dejan Čabrilo 20:49, 21 July 2005 (UTC)

Well, I changed that one sentence. If you don't like it, change it back, but I think it's much better now.

No, I don't like it. But I didn't change it back. My question is: why the hell does it matter??? Serbocroatian was one of three official language of Yugoslavia for years, and Alan Ford was translated as such. The article doesn't talk about either Macedonian or Slovenian translation. So help me out here... --Dejan Čabrilo 08:45, 22 July 2005 (UTC)

Well, you didn't change it but Rama has (I have no idea why).

The reason it matters is because that sentence says it was translated ONLY in French and "Serbo-Croatian" which isn't true. It would be acurate to say it was translated in French, "Serbo-Croatian", Croatian, Serbian, Macedonian and Slovenian. Now do you understand my objection?

I'm not aware of any translations into Macedonian or Slovenian. I'll try to address your concerns. --Dejan Čabrilo 20:11, 22 July 2005 (UTC)

You mentioned Macedonian and Slovenian translations so I assumed they existed, but even if they don't my point still stands. The rewrite is OK but perhaps a little confusing, maybe you should add wiki links to Serbian and Croatian.

There was an edition in Greek at one point (ca 1984?). I've only seen the first issue, have no idea how long it lasted — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.189.134.247 (talk) 21:22, 1 February 2012 (UTC)

Language

Alan Ford was published in Croatia (Vjesnik, Zagreb) where the term "Serbo-Croatian" or "Croato-Serbian" went out of official use in 1972 (coincidentally, the year the first translation was published). So Croatian, not Serbo-Croatian. --Elephantus 12:31, 11 November 2005 (UTC)

The language was refered to as srpskohrvatski or hrvatskosrpski until 1990s. If you went to school in late 1980s, you would still learn Serbo-Croatian. As you perhaps know, aside from ultranationalists, Serbo-Croatian was still the language in 1970s. --Dejan Čabrilo 13:34, 11 November 2005 (UTC)

I wouldn't know about the rest of Yugoslavia, but in Croatian schools the name "Croato-Serbian" or "Serbo-Croatian" wasn't in use after 1972. --Elephantus 14:39, 11 November 2005 (UTC)

Do enlighten us, and tell us what happened in 1972? --Dejan Čabrilo 15:26, 11 November 2005 (UTC)

The fifth amendment to the Constitution of the Socialist Republic of Croatia changed the definition of official language. Additionally, here is a quote I dug up, it's from a men's magazine named CKM (from Serbia, I believe): Što se tiče "Alana Forda" u Srbiji, publici je pored sjajnog teksta, neverovatno smešan bio i hrvatski jezik (emphasis mine) koji je koristio prevodilac, kao i pisanje imena u originalu (Bob Rock npr.). To je išlo toliko daleko da su čitaoci bili besni što su izdanja štampana kod nas (nakon rata) prevedena na srpski. Jednostavno, duh "Alana Forda" je bio povezan sa Brixyjevim prevodima. --Elephantus 16:27, 11 November 2005 (UTC)

Right, the language spoken in Zagreb, Zagorje, Belgrade, Nis or Pirot is different, and Brixy's translation was interesting to people outside of Serbia. However, do you mind providing us with exact text of the amandment? To the best of my knoweldge, the 1974 Constitution did not institute Croatian as a language, and I it's rather silly to say that the language was not called Serbo-Croatian in 1970s. You may think whatever you want about Serbo-Croatian, but that was the name of the language. Anyway, do provide us with the full text of that amandment. Also, give us reference to Croatian being the official language in Croatia at that time. Do also compare it to the 1974 Constitution, and prove that "Croatian" was in common usage. Until you do that, it's Serbo-Croatian. --Dejan Čabrilo 17:55, 11 November 2005 (UTC)

OK, this is the text of the amendment: U Socijalističkoj Republici Hrvatskoj u javnoj je upotrebi hrvatski književni jezik - standardni oblik narodnog jezika Hrvata i Srba u Hrvatskoj, koji se naziva hrvatski ili srpski.. Among Croats, in everyday life, the language has always been called Croatian (not Croato-Serbian, Serbo-Croatian or anything like that). --Elephantus 22:40, 12 November 2005 (UTC)

Sorry but you are lying Elephantus ! You can even see in your citation (original on Croatian) from constitution that language is called Croatian OR Serbian, more often Croatian-Serbian. You ignored that in english translation and made up that language is always called Croatian. Nothing changed in '72. I went to school in the 80's and there was no Croatian language but Croatian-Serbian. 94.253.230.26 (talk) 13:41, 31 May 2014 (UTC)

I find this funny, becuase me and my brother started our education in Croatia (80s). The school subject was called Croatian or Serbian language continuing with a sentence ...or better known as the Croato-Serbian language :)))) HolyRomanEmperor 18:41, 11 November 2005 (UTC)

The guy acused you of not knowing Croatian and compared it with Check-Slovak (completly different) and Norwegian-Swedish (similiar, although not that much) :OOOO The Serbian, Croatian and Bosnian languages have a similarity that is present in no case whatsoever elsewhere. Why? Because they are merely dialects of one language. British English and American English are more different between each other than Croatian and Serbian languages... HolyRomanEmperor 18:54, 11 November 2005 (UTC)

That is true HolyRomanEmperor94.253.230.26 (talk) 13:41, 31 May 2014 (UTC)

Serbo-Croatian

... for anyone's information existed from 1850 to 1993. I guess that all previous claims fall into water :). --HolyRomanEmperor 21:26, 3 January 2006 (UTC)

---> Enough of that language discussion? Please carry on to proper Alan Ford topics, like adding characters like General War, Bert, Great Caesar, other bad guys, etc. Martin 17:18, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

Copyright Infringement?

Can't believe this hasn't been mentioned yet. One of the external links is a site with scanned issues of the comic....isn't that technically copyright infringement?

No, it's technically their problem. --Vitriden 23:58, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

Requested move

Propose that It be moved per the Wikipedia:Naming conventions (comics) guideline, to fall in line with all the others using (comics). Anyone have strong feelings and good reason why not? MURGH ^disc. 23:16, 27 March 2007 (UTC)

Move completed, thanks for the prompt admin action :) MURGH ^disc. 09:54, 28 March 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Alan Ford.gif

Image:Alan Ford.gif is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in Wikipedia articles constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

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I was set to add a rationale for the image, but when looking closely at it, I thought the quality actually was too poor to represent the article illustration, so I opted to let the above image be orphaned out, and replace the it with a more reasonable low-quality image with rationale. I haven't yet looked into the status of the other images in this article. Murgh^disc. 22:08, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

That sounds good. Other images I uploaded have standard fair-use rationale for comic book frames. ★čabrilo★ 10:34, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Magnus-MaxBunker-AF1.jpg

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BetacommandBot 04:01, 1 October 2007 (UTC)

Done

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BetacommandBot (talk) 07:35, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

The WP:NFCC#10c issue has been addressed. MURGH ^disc. 11:15, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Alan Ford Numero Uno.gif

Image:Alan Ford Numero Uno.gif is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

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BetacommandBot (talk) 04:46, 12 February 2008 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Alanford-sc.png

Image:Alanford-sc.png is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

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BetacommandBot (talk) 19:03, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

B-Class Assesment required

This article needs the B-Class checklist filled in to remain a B-Class article. If the checklist is not filled in by 7th August this article will be re-assessed as C-Class. The checklist should be filled out referencing the guidance given at Wikipedia:Version 1.0 Editorial Team/Assessment/B-Class criteria. For further details please contact the Comics WikiProject. Comics-awb (talk) 11:27, 30 July 2008 (UTC)

Sir Oliver is John Steed?

If Alan Ford was inspired by Peter O'Toole, what about Sir Oliver?

My answer: John Steed (Patrick Macnee) from the TV series "The Avengers".

http://www.freewebs.com/earthden/John_Steed.jpg

http://www.mevproductions.co.uk/TV/Avengers2.jpg

http://imagecache6.allposters.com/LRG/27/2771/EEKTD00Z.jpg

—Preceding unsigned comment added by 161.53.149.242 (talk) 13:22, 31 March 2010 (UTC)

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