Talk:Albert A. Michelson

Birthplace

According to one bio: Born in Strelno, Prussia (later Strzelno, Poland), son of a Jewish merchant, ...[1] To my view that means he was born in Prussia. We don't say that Julius Caesar was born in Italy, or that Jesus of Nazareth was born in Israel. Later political boundry changes shouldn't affect the name of the original place of birth. -Willmcw June 30, 2005 20:07 (UTC)

• Hmmm ... I think that it helps the reader to get some idea of where a place is. Few will be familiar with historical geography though they probably are in the case of ancient Palestine and Rome. I think giving the original and contemporary locations is encyclopaedic. Like New Style and Old Style dates. Cutler June 30, 2005 22:50 (UTC)

• • I probably wasn't clear enough about that comment. My objection was to the edit that changed the lead sentence from: Albert Abraham Michelson, ...was a Prussian-born American physicist... to Albert Abraham Michelson, ...was a Polish-born American physicist.... I certainly don't object to listing both countries, as the article does later. Sorry for any confusion. Cheers, -Willmcw July 1, 2005 05:06 (UTC)

Not that I care, but it wasn't just "later Poland" and the example with Julius Caeasar is simply bad. Strzelno was Polish name before Prussians took over the area during partitions. It was still Poland, but part of Poland which was inside Prussia Szopen 13:43, 14 December 2005 (UTC)

read the Annus Mirabilis Papers. he knew ... the other paper cites it the same year!!!! 134.193.168.249 15:10, 21 April 2006 (UTC)

Albert Michelson was a Prussian Jew. He spoke German.

I speak Japanese and I'm British. What's your point, deutscher wanker. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.107.91.99 (talk) 14:56, August 30, 2007 (UTC)

"Born in Strelno, Prussia (later Strzelno, Poland)" Strzelno was Polish before, after, every time, only occupied some time military by Prussia. If the article says: "Born in Strelno, Prussia (later Strzelno, Poland)". Then I say: BEFORE said the Poles as a greeting in Strzelno: HELLO Then the Germans: Heil Hitler, and after that Poles again: HELLO. Would you like only the German point of view to apply in this Wikipedia article? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:4CA0:6FFF:2:2:2:1:1016 (talk) 04:47, 16 December 2022 (UTC)

Objecting to refering Michelson as "German-American"

As a descent to a Jewish family which is "Prussian" I can tell that not only Jews that were born in Germany spoke German, but also Jews which were born in Austria and Switzerland, and not only them-But many Hungarian as well as Romanian and Czech Jews (and etc)-and, yes, German speaking Polish Jews are not uncommon, especially if their occupation was like this of Michelson father and were born in places which were under Prussian occupation (it doesn't mean that somebody who was born there is a "German" in the same way that some body who were born in Libya under the Italian occupation wasn't an Italian). If someone is speaking German it dosn't mean that he/she is actually a German (actually, Yiddish, which was, for centuries, the primary language for most of the Jews all around Europe is originally made of ancient German language) in the same way that a Jamaican English speaker is not an American /British by his nationality or by his ethnic Identity.Polish-born (optionally :Jewish)-American scientist is much accurate formulation.Michelson wasnt a German by his residence nor by his birth place or by his ancestry (i.e he was an Ashkenazi Jew, so he "had" historical roots in Germany in the same way that , lets say, Richard Feynman, which his parents were Jews from Russia, had ;Actully, as one might notice, most of the Askenazi Jews have a German surname), so I cant find even one good reason to refer Michelson as "German", in fact, its a very bad style.--Gilisa 08:22, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

It´s not up to wiki to find good reasons, that woud be OR. |Britannica´s guide to nobel prizes calls him German-born, here [2] he´s called German-American. --134.93.47.103 (talk) 22:54, 20 November 2007 (UTC)

It doesn't matter where you were born. You are only someone where you are going to study for two years. No matter what you think about yourself, where your parents come from, I determine what concerns your nationality. Why, because this is Wikipedia and I can cite it from dubious information from an Imperial book, The View of Imperial Germany, or other Imperial books (Britannica). Did you also quote from the book that the white race is better than anyone else (irony) - Britannica said something like that 100 years ago. Have fun with fake sources like that. 2001:4CA0:6FFF:2:2:2:1:1016 (talk) 04:30, 16 December 2022 (UTC)

Missing the Point

I'm afraid user Gilisa is missing the point. It doesn't go around, that someone speaks german or not, it goes around, if the area in question is claimed by a nation or not. Therefore this topic is a controversial. One knows the boundaries of Mitteleurope were constantly changing ("territories" were always "occupied" by its neighbour.) Also, jiddisch is no more a different language from high german as bairisch or badisch is from german. Even this differentiation really goes around the same sort of claiming (or us-versus-them). So the conclusion "in fact, it's very bad style" shows itself to be somewhat biased.

Georgie

Historic Irony

"If in the future you will give less attention to scientific matters and more attention to your naval gunnery, there may come a time when you will know enough to be of some service to your country." -Rear Admiral David D. Porter, US Civil War hero and Naval Academy Superintendent, upon a review of Michelson's performance at the Naval Academy
added on 15:40, 27 September 2007‎ by/from 38.117.162.35

I wish there was a reference/ citation also. Wfoj3 (talk) 01:55, 21 January 2019 (UTC)

I feel a theme (article, cathegory or something somewhere in commons...) would be welcome about this.

Einstein's gimnasium teacher of Latin and Greek (dr. Joseph Degenhart, who - by sources - was later also headmaster of that gimnasium for a decade or so) also, repeatedly and publicaly (to the class, to parents...) and through several years, declared that Einstein will be no good at anything. The then Luitpold gimnasium in Muenchen is now Gimnasium Albert Einstein, and mention of dr. Degenhart - a man from his time, and IMO an example of the type of how a teacher should not teach, that current teachers should learn from - is hard to find. Marjan Tomki SI (talk) 10:45, 24 December 2022 (UTC)

Nationality Polish?

He was born in Prussia, and lived in America since he was three. I see no claim for polish nationality, Poland didn't exist for most of his lifetime, and he certainly never lived in a Polish state. I'm putting it as American. (Lucas(CA) 17:35, 6 October 2007 (UTC))

Michelson moved to America from a point now in Poland when he was two and some months. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.27.109.117 (talk) 08:21, 19 June 2013 (UTC)

He might have had American nationality legally. Some sources and proof are needed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.27.109.117 (talk) 08:31, 19 June 2013 (UTC)

• Indeed, Albert A. Michelson is known as American physicist. Why Polish? The place of birth is not really relevant. My very best wishes (talk) 03:08, 6 July 2017 (UTC)

  According to the American Constitution, if you are BORN in America, you are an American. Was he born in America? NO. He was born in Poland, occupied by Prussia (NOT GERMANY). Read your constitution! 2001:4CA0:6FFF:2:2:2:1:1016 (talk) 03:45, 16 December 2022 (UTC)

I think (didn't check recently) you are citizen of US not only by being born in US, but also by being born to parents that are citizens of US when they were elsewhere, and by naturalization. If Michelson was (and probably was, but I didn't check yet) naturalized, he could be described as American physicist of Jewish/Polish (ethnic, and by current location of birthplace, properties) descent.

Is place of birth relevant? The answer might be yes or no. If you are born somewhere where your parents just got caught that day, not much; but if you are born in a place that defined how your parents grew up, got educated and took up cultural and religional etc. makeup and traditions, you are partially influenced by that growing up in that family even when you relocate and grow up far from your birthplace. Marjan Tomki SI (talk) 11:15, 24 December 2022 (UTC)

His mother was polish so he should be of a Polish descent BeniPL (talk) 10:28, 14 March 2024 (UTC)

WikiProject class rating

This article was automatically assessed because at least one WikiProject had rated the article as start, and the rating on other projects was brought up to start class. BetacommandBot 14:01, 9 November 2007 (UTC)

Biography

From article: Despite his family being Jewish by birth, his family were non-religious.

The use of "were" is the British method of treating a collective noun. American usage would be "was" — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.136.147.109 (talk) 20:26, 25 November 2012 (UTC)

I have improved the phrasing of the two sentences: from "Despite his family being Jewish by birth, his family was non-religious. Throughout Michelson's life, he was a lifelong agnostic." to "His family was Jewish by birth but non-religious, and Michelson himself was a lifelong agnostic."

I did this to remove repetition of family in the first sentence. In the second, we only need one life. If he was not an agnostic throughout his life, then clearly he would not have been a lifelong agnostic. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.3.255.103 (talk) 21:48, 7 March 2014 (UTC)

Harmonic analyzer

This (see https://www.asme.org/engineering-topics/articles/technology-and-society/return-of-the-harmonic-analyzer) probably deserves a mention. Snori (talk) 08:37, 4 July 2016 (UTC)

The four videos mentioned in this article are on Wiki Commons. I cannot upload and link to then because I created them! That's a conflict of interest by the rules (or better the "spirit") of wikipedia. The full list is here: Video 1: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:1_of_4_-_Intro_%26_History_-_Introducing_a_100-year-old_mechanical_computer.webm; Video 2: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:2_of_4_-_Synthesis_-A_machine_that_uses_gears,_springs_and_levers_to_add_sines_and_cosines.webm; video 3: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:3_of_4_-_Analysis_-_Explaining_Fourier_analysis_with_a_machines.webm; video 4: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:4_of_4_-_Operation_-_The_details_of_setting_up_the_Harmonic_Analyzer.webm

... Bill Hammack Hammack 2017-03-15  —Preceding undated comment added 15:08, 15 March 2017 (UTC) 

Assessment comment

The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:Albert A. Michelson/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.

Alberto Abraham Michelson whas a Polish jew, he had a cousin, also Abraham Michelson, polish who had among other children, Faiga (Fela) who maried Rafael Groswirt after emigrating to Mexico, then in 1931, when Alberto Abraham Michelzon died, they had a son they named Abraham Alberto in honor of Alberto Abraham in Nov, 1931, a few momths after he died.

Substituted at 18:07, 17 July 2016 (UTC)

Pronunciation of 'Michelson'

Excuse me if this is already covered somewhere, but I don't see it. How is the name 'Michelson' meant to be pronounced? Is there an authoritative version? As an English reader, I would probably take 'Mich...' to be pronounced 'Mitch...', that is, to rhyme with 'witch' or 'rich'. I think I have sometimes heard it pronounced this way (i.e. equivalent to 'Mitchelson'), but in various YouTube videos I have heard it pronounced with 'Mich...' equivalent to 'Mike...' as in 'Michaelson'. Presumably the original German or Polish or Yiddish pronunciation was not quite either of these, and in any case immigrants to the US often changed the pronunciation of their names, e.g. names ending in '...stein' are often pronounced '...steen', instead of the original German '...stine'.109.149.2.65 (talk) 14:12, 9 December 2019 (UTC)

Every American who is of European descent is not an American but an European (irony)

If I say I'm Polish and you say I'm American. And then you write in Wikipedia that I'm an American. Then who is right? Me about myself or a stranger writing a Wikipedia article. Why am I writing this? Michelson is from an ethnically Polish town that was previously Polish and only conquered by Prussia (Prussia and not Germany). Moscow was also conquered by Poles, but nobody would ever think that all Russians born in the period are Poles, but wait. If Michelson writes in his entry documents that he is "Pole", then one would have to make up his own mind consider. If he then later accepted American citizenship, then he is of Polish nationality with American citizenship. If his mother was a Polish Catholic and he grew up in a Polish town, it would be pretty weird if he didn't speak Polish. His father was a Pole of Jewish faith. If an American believes in Islam, then he is still an American and not an Arab. Same with Mechelson - belief is something else. Arguing that Michelson is a German, or a Jew, or an American nationality is as odd as writing that Neil Armstrong is an alien from the moon who is also a Christian because his father was a Christian. And that he was born in the USA and called himself an American - doesn't matter for this Wikipedia page. He will remain an alian because someone once wrote like that. The Faraons once wrote that they come from the god sun and are gods... And you believe that because someone once wrote such nonsense. A source, even if significant, does not mean that it is correct. All the facts in the world say that Michelson is not German! But a Pole - after his mother even an ethnic Pole. From an objective point of view this is correct: "Albert Abraham Michelson FFRS HFRSE (surname pronunciation anglicized as "Michael-son", December 19, 1852 – May 9, 1931) was a Poland-born (at this time occupied militarily by Prussia) Polish-American physicist of Jewish religion, known for his work on measuring..." 2001:4CA0:6FFF:2:2:2:1:1016 (talk) 03:35, 16 December 2022 (UTC)

Michelson, Pease, and Pearson

DOI link fails

I was curious about Fred Pearson, and checked sources for section Michelson, Pease, and Pearson, and got "404 page not found" for ref to Michelson's Last Experimentin Science (journal). It seems currently working DOI is not 10.1126/science.73.1899.10, but 10.1126/science.73.1899.10.t - event if it is probably against the rules how DOI linksa are to be formed (and maybe .t should be removed from target URLs, not address of the source corrected in WP). Currently working link is here. pmid (PubMedId) also resolves to the same DOI without .t and doesn't work (404 page not found). At first glance it looks as accidental change in Science IT namespace (typo), but at the moment, I am not sure if change should be done at WP or at Science. I'd prefer change (omitting .t) at Science, for the sake of keeping persistence of DOI (which is devised as persistent), but I am not yet sure if I can reach them. I'll try.

Fred Pearson

I tried to find something abut him, but on the disambiguation page didn't find any obvious kandidate, so I left link pointing ot disambiguation page.

In the Obituary, written by Robert A. Millikan I found Michelson was lucid till a day or two before death, but progressively paralyzed for about a month before, and knew he can't get better again. I also found he dictated synopsis for the article in Science 4 days before he died, but physical part, and debugging, of the experiment (for which Michelson was also famous) was this time done by his assistants, and that is currently not easily visible from this section.

I am interested who and how did it (and I'd like to see info either included in the article or giving a link to appropriate contents elsewhere). There is already something about Pease, but found nothing yet of Pearson. Marjan Tomki SI (talk) 15:35, 25 December 2022 (UTC)

References