Talk:Brendan Bracken

If anyone can find reference to a clash with George Orwell (Eric Blair) during WW2 it would be most interesting. It's sometimes suggested that the choice of an Irish name for the Inquisitor in "Nineteen Eighty-Four" and the elated calling of 'BB' were private digs at Brendan Bracken. Norvo 03:51, 15 October 2006 (UTC)

Interesting; I've just looked in Lysaght's book and there is no mention there of Orwell (or Eric Blair).194.125.131.56 11:39, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

On revisting the article I note that the whole paragraph on Bracken, the MOI, Orwell and Big Brother doesn't contain even one reference to any source. Norvo (talk) 02:25, 8 May 2013 (UTC)

Figure of Speech - Delete, Change?

"When Bracken became aware of Churchill's agreement to nominate Lord Halifax, he moved heaven and earth to convince Churchill that the Labour Party would indeed support him as Chamberlain's successor, and that Lord Halifax's appointment would hand certain victory to Hitler."

In a fact-based Wikipedia I think the metaphor should not have been used unless it was in the context of quotation about him which should be cited. Too near POV, and rather vague without any demonstration of the means by which he "moved heaven and earth".Cloptonson (talk) 20:56, 6 February 2015 (UTC)

I have deleted the silly metaphor. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.77.163.188 (talk) 08:46, 4 October 2016 (UTC)

Throwaway lines? - Comments about public image

If he had lived as a media mogul and politician in modern times, he would have been surrounded by an army of image and pr consultants. But Bracken did not appear to care about his personal image as much as he cared about fashioning an opportunity to contribute on the political and economic stage of his generation.

I think the sentences as they are make an unsubstantiated claim, without citation if (as it seems to appear) they were lifted from something written about him in a biography. Bit like saying if a 19th century general lived in modern times he would have had the benefits of 21st century military technology etc to fight his wars with. Also to say Bracken appeared careless with his personal image does not sit well with statements elsewhere he destroyed material to cover up aspects of his background he did not want to publicise - he cared enough to feel uncomfortable about them being seen by the wrong eyes. His claim his brother was killed in Narvik smacks of wanting to give himself a heroic link with the British war effort.Cloptonson (talk) 21:10, 6 February 2015 (UTC)

Peerage Extinct

I have removed the citation need against the statement that his peerage became extinct at his death. The next issue of Burke's Peerage and other such reference books ceased to feature him and counted his title as extinct. However, the fact he had a blood nephew of his own surname who tried to get him to take Last Rites, may make someone ask why the peerage did not pass on to the nephew, as his peerage was not a Life Peerage. Does anyone have an answer?Cloptonson (talk) 19:06, 17 October 2015 (UTC)

I ain't. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.77.163.188 (talk) 11:50, 28 September 2016 (UTC)

The letters patent should be studied. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.136.176.125 (talk) 10:27, 29 September 2016 (UTC)

Probably a question of citizenship. Nevertheless, another iota of Bracken's enigma. Shir-El too 05:12, 30 August 2022 (UTC)

Citizenship. There's one !!! He was born in Ireland in 1901, and would have been British by birth at that time. He had left Ireland for England before Independence, so was always a British subject ?? The nephew was a member of an austere Religious Order who would not have been interested. There were other nephews ad a niece, but I think succession may have to be claimed ? The letters of patent comment, and how they are effected is most likely the solution. Faulkt1a (talk) 11:10, 31 August 2022 (UTC)

Disembodied statement

In the fighting that occurred on the streets, Bracken was stabbed.

Does this relate to the preceding sentence about the by-election? Or does it refer to the General Strike? It needs clarifying. Valetude (talk) 00:08, 9 July 2019 (UTC)

Steinireyk (talk) 23:49, 20 January 2022 (UTC) The source referred to, W. H. Thompson: "Fifty Minutes With Churchill", is wrongly attributed to a 19th century scholar. It's really by Churchill's bodyguard, Walter Henry Thompson. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walter_H._Thompson Could someone correct that?

@Steinireyk: Fixed, thank you. DuncanHill (talk) 23:55, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

Election win

It doesn't say when he was elected MP for North Paddington. Valetude (talk) 00:11, 9 July 2019 (UTC)

Banking with Hitler

The lede says: He is best remembered for opposing the Bank of England's co-operation with Adolf Hitler. But this is not referenced in the article. (And the cite has been blanked because it's in copyright.) Valetude (talk) 17:22, 19 July 2019 (UTC)

Publication of the Financial Times

"His best-known business accomplishment was merging the Financial News into the Financial Times in 1945. The latter was published from Bracken House, London, clad in pink stone to match the colour of the paper, just east of St Paul's Cathedral, which was remodelled in 1989."

Obviously the last bit is wrong, but that's just clumsy phrasing which shouldn't be difficult to rewrite. The second sentence is misleading because it implies the FT was always published from Bracken House during this period, whereas looking at the Bracken House article, the building wasn't finished until 1958. This article surely needs a lot of work. (I suppose "the by-election at Westminster" might refer to the 1931 Westminster St George's by-election, but the sequence of events described seems to go against that notion.) Harfarhs (talk) 19:19, 9 August 2019 (UTC)

'Churchill's Secret Son'

The mention of this documentary ought to be followed by a statement as to truth of Bracken being a son of Churchill, not previously mentioned in this article. My own first hearing of the issue came from the 1980s series 'Winston Churchill: The Wilderness Years' in which I recall Churchill (played by Robert Hardy) reproaching Bracken with spreading 'rumours you are my bastard son' and calling him 'you Irish mountebank' - although it is not mentioned at all in the Martin Gilbert book on which that series was based.Cloptonson (talk) 11:11, 22 February 2020 (UTC)

I assume you mean 'the truth, or otherwise...' Valetude (talk) 21:32, 6 June 2021 (UTC)

Postwar Years

An entry citing a journalist's review of a book does not add to the article. The submission does not fit in with the subject matter nature, themes, submissions, and tenor. Wikipedia requires entries to adhere to five pillars, most relevantly that of "Reliable Source". Centrally there is no second supporting source to the originator, and his proposition has only surfaced seventy years later in the marketing of his book. The author is not a historian but a self-described story teller (https://www.luath.co.uk/david-campbell). The entry is prefaced as "an allegation", is a case of revisionism to a high degree. The entry should be removed as it is not reflective of the overall article; does not obviously meet group standards, nor ordinary standards or reasonableness. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 176.61.25.156 (talk) 08:54, 29 October 2021 (UTC)

But David Campbell's story was taken up by some mainstream newspapers who presumably found it credible. I don't know what is meant by "revisionism" here. The story doesn't reflect on BRacken's political or business careers but I believe it is of interest and was wrongly deleted. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 176.57.253.190 (talk) 13:00, 29 August 2022 (UTC)

The information is derivative from one, initial source. The Sunday Times source is a review of Campbell's book; and Irish Central quotes the Sunday Times as it's source. "Taken up" does not make a source more reliable. The tales of an 85-year old "story teller" flogging a book may be of interest; but not unarguably correct as the basis for an encyclopaedia entry Faulkt1a (talk) 10:55, 31 August 2022 (UTC)

@Faulkt1a: I'm inclined to agree with you, though - if truth be told - most "history" is based on hearsay. After all, how many societies were minimally literate before the mid-20th century? [Could this be called "write-say?"]. Cheers! Shir-El too 15:06, 31 August 2022 (UTC)

A burning question...

... to my mind is: where and how did Bracken get the capital to launch his English career? Where would an Irish-Australian vagabond, no matter how resourceful, get that kind of money? How were his funds transferred?

For that matter, what about his banking records throughout?

Does anyone else find his whole career more than a little suspect? Shir-El too 07:51, 27 November 2021 (UTC)