Talk:Dog tag

(Fatality procedure)

Im not sure about the US Army but in the Australian Army the pratice in the 60s and 70s. at least according the to Manual of Land Warefare (the MLW basically the Aussie verions of an FM) it was policy for an officer NCO or other person on finding a dead comrade to take one dog tag (the round one) and place the other (octagonal) in the corpse's mouth.
As for kicking the mouth shut, that was not in the published manuals, but it would nto surprise me if it was taught in the unnoffical teaching that goes on between offical instruction (called "a soldiers 5" in the Australian Army).
—Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.122.232.248 (talk) 11:07, 15 January 2006

• That seems to imply article language that was removed w/o discussion on this talk page. The version i heard, IIRC from a history teacher who was an American WWII vet, was a little more detailed than the above, leading me to infer the following: place the tag with the notch positioned against the notch between the biting edges of the two front upper incisors; position the opposite short edge against the lower incisors; kick the point of the jaw, with the intent to have the tag secured by the upper teeth. I always assumed this meant a new or existing gap between the upper incisors was exploited, but that's guesswork. Maybe a dentist or orthodontist can weigh in with plausibility.
  --Jerzy•t 16:30, 18 March 2010 (UTC)
  

A old story but untrue, in the US millitary you were never told to place the dog tag between the teeth of a deceased soldier. you take one tag and leave the other that is all. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.160.85.209 (talk) 07:39, 12 June 2011 (UTC)

History

This part seems a bit US centric, the origin of the name and the first coordinated military use are worth two sentences while there is lots of unsourced random history talk. 91.7.94.204 (talk) 09:16, 2 May 2009 (UTC)

---> A lot of Wiki articles are U.S. centered, however, generally only as an example of somethings. (i.e. example of Dog Tags.) Black Hat Man (talk) 14:08, 8 October 2011 (UTC)

Gas mask size?

I served in the U.S. Army, and we didn't have a gas mask size - what would it matter if you're dead? Mine specifically had: last name, first name, social, DOB, blood type and religion (possibly not in that order). PennyGWoods 11:36, 17 April 2006 (UTC)

If someone just lobbed a mustard gas grendade into your trench, and you've lost your gasmask, I'm guessing you'd check nearby allies for a replacement - and seeing as a size difference of even one size could be fatal, it would be fairly important you get it right.

I'm an active duty U.S. Marine. We have our gas mask size stamped on our dog tags. Biggest myth amongst West Coast Marines (where females are not trained) is that the standard "M" means male. As for its purpose, I have no firsthand experience but have heard stories similar to what was above along with fitting incapacitated comrades and making issue easier.

A gas mask alone won't save you from mustard gas.. it's a blister agent. 84.173.129.246 10:59, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

I'm active duty U.S. Army.. M40 Protective Masks come in Small, Medium and Large. The only situation I can see the size of the soldier's mask being relevant on dog tags is if the soldier is wounded or incapacitated but not killed and an NBC/CBNRD attack occurs while the soldier is being evacuated.. would kinda suck to be on morphine and blazed outta your mind, on your way to a cozy rear-rear hospital bed, and then die because of a freak coincidence like that. I'm not really sure they'd have the time to go searching for a spare mask in such a situation anyway (usually you've got a few seconds to don and clear and then shimmy into your MOPP/JSLIST suits as fast as humanly possible - read: not typically fast enough to avoid nerve agent contamination - and they're issued out to soldiers individually), but I guess it's more of a just-in-case thing. That said, the U.S. Army doesn't put mask sizes on dog tags now. Don't know if they did in the past. 84.173.129.246 10:53, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

Marine checking in. It's gas mask size, and we still have it on our tags. The order is last name, break, first initial, middle initial, tab, blood type, break, social security number, break, branch, half-tab, gas mask size, break, religious preference. I'm reading this directly off the tag I'm wearing right now, so there you go. Also, confirming earlier comment by unsigned, we all assumed the "M" was for "male" until we were told otherwise. --Johnny (Cuervo) 06:11, 15 September 2007 (UTC)

Ever since I got out of the US Army in the early 70's I have kept one of my original dog tags on my key ring as an identifier. I came to this article because I could not remember what its material was or when the switch was made from serial number to Social Security Number. My 1967 US Army dog tag has

LastName, FirstName MI

Serial Number

Blood type

Religion

There is no notch and the hole is on the right.

JimCubb 23:47, 12 November 2007 (UTC)

Arent soldiers at risk of identity theft with the Soc.Security number on their dog tags.71.176.134.94 (talk) 18:02, 10 January 2008 (UTC)

Troops are constantly at risk of identity theft. The thing that saves us is that nobody wants our credit ratings nine times out of ten. :-) --Johnny (Cuervo) 00:30, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

My father's Vietnam-era Marine Corps dogtags had the gasmask size and the side for the cannister. He was a small left, indicating that he shot right-handed. When I myself was in the Army during the Cold War, there was nothing about the gasmask on the dogtag (and they came in four sizes: Large, Medium, Small and Extra Small).Frank MacCrory (talk) 00:42, 3 November 2018 (UTC)

Fashion

No mention of dogtags as a fashion device emplyed recently? For shame. I'm adding, . --Switch 12:59, 30 May 2006 (UTC)

Refuting Snopes?

About the notch: http://www.armydogtags.com/PurposeNotch.htm This site speaks of having actual WWII era stamping equipment, and not seeing any reason for the notch in the stamping process, however they positively describe a use for the notch in aligning the tags for use by a 'carbon copy' gun-thing that would attach the individual's information to their medical records. (See the page I cited for the verbage and pictures.)

"The carbon copy thing" is a Addressograph Model 70. There were also desk top devices that were used to transfer the information from a dog tag to a medical record. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.160.85.209 (talk) 06:57, 12 June 2011 (UTC)

Citation

This article has a lot of information which is probably correct but it remains mostly unsourced. Angrynight 16:47, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

Much of this article is copied verbatim from a Straight Dope article. http://www.straightdope.com/mailbag/mdogtags.html

Agreed. The section about the 'notch' myth is a good example. If it was/is a recurring myth (and I personally think recurring is misleading - it sounds like something that happened over and over, when in fact it's been a persistent, commonly held belief amongst people unfamiliar with military practices) the there should be some record of it. Likewise, documentation of that rumor's end or dissipation. The way it's written, I can't tell if the author means the rumor applies only to dog tags from a certain time or if the rumor itself circulated during that time, but was debunked (was it?) after Vietnam. MandieJ1975 (talk) 02:33, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

365 balls

Refute me if I'm wrong, but I believe the US Military issued chain that goes along with the dogtags specifically have 365 little ball links in the chain, so if the Soldier is ever taken prisoner, he can count off the days in captivity. (unsigned comment)

I've heard that, too -- the little chain where the second tag hangs down is supposedly 52 links, one for each week in a year. Nobody I know has ever bothered counting, and I have one I just replaced that is *definitely* shorter. --Johnny (Cuervo) 23:07, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

I got bored and started counting my dad's set. I may have mis counted a couple times, but by the time i got all the way around i only counted 285 balls. I also think that the 356 balls would be illogical because the chain would be huge and could quite easilly fall of in the heat of battle.--CrazyOmega (talk) 11:29, 30 April 2008 (UTC)

Mine break all the freaking time in garrison. Not to mention the silencers slide off. And it's $6 a pair. !)#@(%*!!!! Don't assume the military doesn't do something because it'd make too much sense not to. ;-) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Cuervo (talk • contribs) 00:51, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

I have about 240 balls on the chain i just bought and about 300 on my old one and the smaller chains are both significantly less than 50 balls. I think the 365 and 52 is either no longer used or complete bs.70.91.211.209 (talk) 04:06, 21 March 2010 (UTC)

Religion

What about the refusal to put some religions on dog tags? // Liftarn

The U.S. Army typically only recognizes the same religions Republicans do.. i.e. all the flavors of Christianity. In basic training I was surprised to actually be able to get "Atheist" stamped on mine, when a buddy from another company there wasn't able to get what he wanted on his and had to settle for No Preference. Kinda funny when you think about all the religious observances they make us attend in permanent party.. always a mishmash of Christian services with a helping of Southern Baptist on the side. Do any other religions get any representation? Not really.

Same goes for the military chaplains.. they're Christian, Orthodox Jew and occasionally you might actually see a Muslim chaplain.. but that's about as far as representation goes. Not that I care, given my beliefs, but I think it's a little hypocritical of them to support only the belief systems that are compatible with theirs. 84.173.129.246 10:57, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

• A section is needed on religious discrimination - especially the difficulty in getting 'atheist' catered for. See here for an amusing description of the problem by Daniel O’Neal from America's Humanist council.Malick78 10:01, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

Just to weigh in... I'm an Air Force personnelist, and have had to make dog tags several times for people deploying. The machines used are free text, so whoever told your friend he had to put No Preference was either lazy or inept. Mine are currently typoed to show me as an "Athiest". You can put whatever you want on a set... Which tends to happen when you leave the night shift alone with one on a slow exercise. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 214.13.82.22 (talk) 00:54, 24 January 2009 (UTC)

Allow me to second the Airman's point from the Marine Corps side. Marine Corps ID tag standards are outlined in Chapter 7 of MCO P1070.12, [found here]. It states "religion or sect as designated by the Marine"; the only restriction is to avoid abbreviation unless there isn't enough space. IMO, judging by Mr. O"Neal's article, he is a victim of bureaucracy and ignorance, but not intolerance. I have also operated dog tag machines and have input non-Christian religions without regret despite my Republican voting record. A discussion about perceived religious intolerance does not belong with this article.138.162.128.52 (talk) 21:45, 3 January 2012 (UTC)

I'll second both of the above. Typically, to keep things easy, they ask the service member what they want on their dog tags. It used to be they were limited to catholic, protest, jewish, atheist or no preference. With today's machines they can put whatever the service member wants (within reason of course - there are no Jedis :D) --05:18, 15 June 2012 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Korentop (talk • contribs)

There was a rumor that, during the Gulf War, Jewish soldiers were issued dogtags that said "NO PREF REC" (no preference recorded) as a code for Jewish. I can't verify that rumor, but I know that our chaplains in theater were relabeled Morale Officers and printed information about religious services only mentioned Group C, Group P and Group J (for Catholic, Protestant and Jewish, respectively). Frank MacCrory (talk) 00:48, 3 November 2018 (UTC)

Civilian dog tags

Swedish civilian dog tag (1970s).

What about civilian dog tags? There is a brief mention about that all New York City public school pupils were issued dog tags in the 1950s. I'm a bit younger then that and is born in Sweden and both I and my younger brother got issued dog tags, probably quite soon after we was baorn altough they were of adult size. My kids never got them so there may be some cold war issue or something. There is a picture at http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/14054797/ and I'll try to find mine so I can make a free version of it. // Liftarn

• An article here talks about kids getting dog tags in the '50s. http://www.conelrad.com/duckandcover/cover.php?turtle=01

This is definitely true about the New York City public school kids. I still have mine on my key chain since elementary school in Brooklyn.

Catholic schools in Brooklyn also issued dog tags in the 50's. i recently found mine among my Mother's keepsakes. I asked a friend who grew up in Queens,NYC if they recall wearing them.She did not wear one . John141 (talk) 22:13, 30 May 2009 (UTC)

the hole

today, where does the hole go on the real dog tags, the left or right side? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 63.215.27.201 (talk) 03:16, 11 March 2007 (UTC).

El lefto

Looking at my tags: the hole is on the left. --Johnny (Cuervo) 01:01, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

on US Identification tags it depends on how the tag was placed in the machine. The hole can be on the right or the left.

Dog tags

What about real dog tags????

The dog tag issued in WWI & WW2 were issued with Service Numbers and not Serial Numbers. The Tags in WW1 were round, Aluminum and contained the member's name, date of birth, and the branch of service; on the opposite side of the tag was the Service Number (now people are calling them "Serial Numbers.")

See dog tag. // Liftarn (talk)

US Navy Format

If I am wounded I would rather get the right blood type than someone saying the wrong prayer. The current US Navy Format example:

                                 SMITH, JOHN D
                                 (OPEN LINE)
                                 123456789USN
                                 O POS
                                 NO PREF or a RELIGION (of choice)

Medical tags!

Wow, thought there'd be some information on this. Several Marines I've served with and still serve with, from day one of boot camp on through to the fleet, wear a deep red, more squared-off dogtag alongside the aluminum one on their chain, commonly indicating diabetes, asthma, or some other medical condition that may require special attention on the field. --Johnny (Cuervo) 01:14, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

My mistake, I guess it's an allergy tag. I don't have one, and I only really know one other guy who does. Glad to see it's part of the article now. --Johnny (Cuervo) 07:57, 8 November 2008 (UTC)

USMC vs other Branches

Pretty much the only time I edit wiki is when the Army is mis-credited for things and usually given to the Marines. There was a line in there about Marines giving their dogtags to loved ones before deployment. I changed it to service member. I gave my dogtags to a girl before my deployment in the Army, which meant a lot to her family, because her dad (ex-Army tanker) gave her mom his tags. And her grandmother has her grandfather's (a sailor) tags. I also know other Navy personell who have given their tags people. Ocso john (talk) 19:40, 2 February 2009 (UTC)

National Variations

Assuming that most countries that have an organized military force would be issuing dog tags, the list of national variations appears to me to be very limited. Granted, the list of countries could be huge. Personally, I'd like to see the addition of France. However, it might be wise to collate countries with the same tag formatting.

Example: "3.4 Cypress, Greece" with any differences between the two countries' tags be noted within the combined section. Christopher, Salem, OR (talk) 06:56, 17 February 2010 (UTC)

Article title

There is a widespread misconception, or perhaps a failure of imagination, regarding disambiguating suffixes in article titles: they are often mechanically assigned as nouns of apposition even tho WP guidelines clearly say that identifying the relevant context is also normal. Since the tag on a dog collar is an identifier, the current title fails to disambiguate and is incorrect. Consider this note a courtesy if you like, but it is equally instruction needed to alleviate abysmal ignorance.
All dog tags are identifiers. The topic of the accompanying article has the context of the military, various militaries, and military affairs. Dog tag (military) successfully disambiguates, and Dog tag (identifier) does not, so a move is needed.
On the longer term, and needing discussion, being the origin of a term often, but not necessarily, makes a topic the primary topic. It may be better for Dog tag (pet) to be the new title for the content of the present Dog tag. IMO the accompanying article is a better candidate for primary topic than the pet-collar devices, but equal disamabiguation -- no primary topic -- may instead be the best approach. Opinions?
--Jerzy•t 16:53, 18 March 2010 (UTC)

Dog tag (human) – just an idea. --Helium4 (talk) 10:52, 8 April 2021 (UTC)

French army

There has been in inquiry elsewhere about French army tags in WW2 and the lack of information. I have looked without much success and can only suggest an e-mail to conservation-ma@invalides.org, which is the official site of the French Army Museum. Mikeo1938 (talk) 06:28, 21 April 2010 (UTC)

What about this?--78.128.176.54 (talk) 09:34, 21 April 2010 (UTC)

I'm a bit rough with the translation, but that link does help some. I still find it a little unclear, but that may just be my translation attempts. Thank you. As I have only just read this addition, I have not yet tried the email address.
Christopher, Salem, OR (talk) 11:12, 18 June 2010 (UTC)

I am a military (Army) brat. I have my own dog tags that were made and issued to my mother when we were preparing to go to Germany in 1957. I have no idea what the regulations were concerning tags for dependents. Over the years I have worn them as a sign of pride in my military background. Mine are the notched steel type. The imprint is: 1st line Last name First name Middle initial 2nd line: "F" (for female) 3 spaces "2 May 57" 3rd line: "Methodist" (my religion) 4th line: blank 5th line: "US Citizen" I believe there is an error. The date is probably supposed to be my birthdate. The date is correct, but not the year. 57 is the year they were issued. I have always assumed this was a typo on the part of the maker. Does someone know more about these tags? My younger brother never went overseas and does not have any tags.Schoolmarm55 (talk) 22:48, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

No Preference

Hey guys, in the U.S. format section it mentions that for USMC if you don't have a religion, you write "NO PREFERENCE" on it and for Navy if you don't, you write "NORELPREF", so...what do you write for AF or Army? Or Coast Guard? Is it the same thing? I'm confused... —Preceding unsigned comment added by ThatOneTallKid (talk • contribs) 23:25, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

There are not that many rules and regulations governing the US dog tag.

if there is no religious preference some will leave it blank others will put a variation of no religious preference.

I have also seen tags with

Wicca, Astru and Rock and Roll for religious preference — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.160.85.209 (talk) 07:21, 12 June 2011 (UTC)

FYI in USAF boot camp I put down "atheist" and the tags I got issued came back NO REL PREF. The idea of making a stink about it crossed my mind, but only for a few milliseconds since, well, I was just an Airman Basic and didn't want to stick out too far...fact was, I did have a preference, and that was atheist, because I can't stand the thought of some holy man uttering prayers over my corpse...Wikkileaker (talk) 15:33, 30 March 2020 (UTC)

I had the exact same issue in the Australian Army; those are my dog tags pictured in the 'Australia' section. I wanted to put down Atheist but 'NREL' was the only option if you didn't slot into any of the mainstream religions. Briefly considered causing a stink over it too, but, well, you know how it is. Damien Linnane (talk) 05:40, 31 March 2020 (UTC)

New section silencers?

Is it work putting in a section or sub-section on silencers? In the field, the last thing we want is the clank clank of the tags as we move around. --Korentop (talk) 05:20, 15 June 2012 (UTC)

Blood Type?

The sam image under United States (File:US Dog Tag with Surname, First name, Social Security number, Blood type, Religion.jpg) allegedly includes blood type but does not; it has only the rh factor. I smell a rat.--Jim in Georgia Contribs Talk 02:40, 15 November 2012 (UTC)

Well there can be all sort of rodents associated with blood type. During the 1960s I donated blood on several occasins, and so knew my type was O+. Imagine my surprise, when I was issued my dog tags when I was drafted, that it showed A+! When I protested this was in error, I was told the Army makes no mistakes. Fortunately, I had no need for a transfusion during my time in the Army, and miraculously returned to O+ when I again became a civilian. Wschart (talk) — Preceding undated comment added 20:21, 7 July 2014 (UTC)

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Turkey

dog tag is about military, right? then why i cant find info about the dog tags that using in the army that taking place in world's most powerful top 10 armies?(turkey) i cant even find the "turkey" word in article.

also, i want to know how letters in dog tag represent religion of military personel. i looked other sources, for example in turkey "m" represent "muslim", but dont know which letter represent irreligious? need info about that and it should be added to article. ----modern_primat ඞඞඞ ^TALK 00:06, 27 May 2022 (UTC)

Wikipedia is a collaborative project written by volunteers. I added information about dog tags from Australia as that was the only country that I was familiar with. It would be great if we could get a volunteer from Turkey or with knowledge of Turkish dog tags to expand the article, but as of yet, for whatever reason this has not happened. Damien Linnane (talk) 01:54, 27 May 2022 (UTC)

reason: Block of Wikipedia in Turkey ;(... almost 900 days of blocking... lots of people were cant reach wikipedia in these times..

also, the "irreligious" word is not what i mean. i mean "non-religion". also.. sorry for 1 month delay :/.. hello.. @Damien Linnane ----modern_primat ඞඞඞ ^TALK 14:24, 23 June 2022 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Historical Research Methods

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 22 August 2022 and 8 December 2022. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Millssteveh (article contribs).

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Dog Tags for Dependents born Overseas

I've looked all over (in this Wiki and on the internet) for information on Dog Tags issued to dependents born overseas. Both my older brother and I were born in Japan while my parents were there - stationed at Misawa Air Force Base from the late 1950s to October 1962. After I was born or before we were flown back to the U.S.(when I was 6 mos. old), both my brother and I were issued Dog Tags. I had mine until my last year of high school when I loaned them to a classmate to wear during a school production of the play "South Pacific" and he never gave them back. When confronted, he said he had lost them. I found a company that makes legit reproductions with the Vietnam Era (1954-1967) notch, but cannot find any info on what all was on the tag. I THINK it had AF D/DEP/DEPENDENT and my Social Security number on it (I'm pretty sure about the SS# as I memorized my SS# as a young child by frequently wearing and reading them. Does anyone know anything about these? Is it not done anymore? What was the exact format/wording? I can clearly remember the sound they made as I wore them often and the silencers had cracked and been removed after so many years... I've long wanted to replace them, but I want them to be RIGHT. 2600:1702:4640:6B50:D9B7:AE00:B7E2:6697 (talk) 09:34, 5 February 2024 (UTC)