Talk:Englyn

Use of plural

I think "8 types of englynion" should really be "8 types of englyn" - no need to pluralise both words. You would say "4 types of cat" rather than "4 types of cats".

Also, in the example section, does it make sense to say "2 englynion" rather than "2 englyn"? Welsh doesn't use plurals in the same way as English, so it would be "2 englyn" in Welsh. If "englynion" is being used here as an English word then it is OK as it stands. Longdehua (talk) 10:18, 26 May 2011 (UTC)

Robertson Davies Example

I don't think the Robertson Davies example ("The Old Journalist") is actually an Englyn -- there doesn't seem to be cynghanedd Groes, Draws, Sain or Lusg in any of the lines. Should it be removed? 90.221.88.99 (talk) 13:49, 31 March 2009 (UTC)

Hear hear. It just adds confusion. Flapdragon (talk) 11:00, 6 August 2009 (UTC)

The same is true of the Graves' example, although he at least gets the cynghanedd lusg right between the end of the first and the middle of the second line. Nicdafis (talk) 08:10, 5 March 2024 (UTC)

Cornish englynion?

Are there really Cornish englynion as stated at the top of this article? If so we should show an example. Flapdragon (talk) 11:00, 6 August 2009 (UTC)

scholar reference for Robertson Davies or elide

He could be, well, R.D.

He should not be cited where he had mere opinion. Do we we cite him on sex? It was not a hobby, but he had opinions. But this is not Massey College. Cite him on "Wild Geese", the novel his student-interviewer for CBC (later Gov-Gen if Canada) had not heard of - unless someone has come to Martha Ostensoe's defence (but see Pynchon's character in night's embrace with white corpse - did he have an opinion on that, as a Jungian amateur ? )

G. Robert Shiplett 18:07, 30 July 2012 (UTC)

I've deleted that section, as RD's enthusiasm for Welsh forms notwithstanding, it adds nothing to the article, repeating the description of englyn unodl union above, but introducing the falacy that the end of the first line must rhyme with the middle of the second (there must be cynghanedd here, but not necessarily rhyme). Nicdafis (talk) 08:05, 5 March 2024 (UTC)

Reference lost

? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 210.159.191.55 (talk) 08:54, 25 May 2013 (UTC)

English translations for the examples?

• @Alarichall: Is there any chance of including English translations of the Welsh examples? Either the examples are spelt very differently from modern standard Welsh, or the English to Welsh translater in Google Translate is not good: for example, for the first Englyn example (the englyn penfyr: Oer gwly pysgawd yng nghysgawd iäen; / Cul hydd, cawn barfawd; / Byr diwedydd, gwŷdd gwyrawd.), Google Translate in from Welsh to English mode produces "A cold wetsuit in the ice cone; / Back, we get a pardon; / Short date, summon watch.". - which reminds me of my early scuba diving ventures in north Wales - but does that interpretation fit the date when the poem was written? Anthony Appleyard (talk) 10:57, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

  Thanks for asking! My Welsh isn't up to much, sadly: the examples I added here I brought in using an old lecture handout I received when I was studying Welsh as an undergraduate, so I'm sure they're reliable, but it would take me a long time to translate them. Many are quite old, and are in any case in poetic language, so it's no surprise that Google Translate would struggle. If I get time I'll try to work on adding translations though :-) Alarichall (talk) 09:29, 26 March 2021 (UTC)