Talk:List of Sd.Kfz. designations

Abbreviation?

We have an inconsistency across articles, and often within them, regarding the abbreviation for this term. The two most common usages seem to be "Sd.Kfz." and "Sdkfz". I don't know which is the more common usage in our sources. Regards, DMorpheus (talk) 18:17, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

Sd. Kfz. as per official usage in wartime documents (Note the space inbetween). --Denniss (talk) 18:47, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

If that is correct (I personally have no idea so I don't contest it) we currently have a bunch of edits going on that change it to "Sd.Kfz" (note no space) that may not be productive. DMorpheus (talk) 18:59, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

Two abbrevations because of two words (Sonder Kraftfahrzeug, today it would simply be Sonderkraftfahrzeug). That's probably also the reason for the space inbetween. --Denniss (talk) 23:31, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

The spelling differs in war time documents. Some vehicles were officially Sd.Kfz.XXX, some were Sd. Kfz.XXX, some were SdKfz.XXX and so on. The germans accidentally messed it up severa times, resulting in inconsistently named vehicles. And many of the vehicles from 1 to 99 were officially called just "Kfz", with no "Sd". GMRE (talk) 16:05, 7 July 2014 (UTC)

Nope, Kfz. is kompletely different system of designations and shouldn't be messed with Sd.Kfz. one. To be honest this article needs serious review cleanup, for example there is a mess with "Maultier" vehicles, there are also wrong entries like tank "Maus", which had Porsche Type 205 designation, not Sd.Kfz.205. Calling it "Panzerkampfwagen VIII" is another error. Piotr Mikołajski (talk) 22:45, 10 July 2014 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure Maus would have ended up being called Panzerkampfwagen VIII. Löwe was the cancelled VII. Unless they would have called it something like E-190, because the E designation system would have been the standard by the time it would have been in proper production. Anyway, good luck cleaning up the list, but be sure to add a reference to the just Kfz. list. That's exactly the sort of thing that would cause more confusion. The use of multiple parallel designation systems, each with very long names is exactly why they came up with the E naming. GMRE (talk) 19:10, 13 July 2014 (UTC)

The Maus was for all practical purposes cancelled in 1943, so it would never have been ready. The E-series of vehicles was largely still on the drawing boards, with only a few partially completed E-10 Hetzers, the E-100 having been abandoned before the end of the war. To state anything about whether the series would have entered series production, not to mention which name they would have had in series production, is pure speculation. Christian Ankerstjerne (talk) 12:23, 7 August 2014 (UTC)

By far the most common abbreviations in printed wartime documents were Sd. Kfz. (with periods and with space) and Sd Kfz. (without periods and with space). There seems to be a general trend in the later years of the war to not use periords, but the usage still varied. I can't recall seing Sd.Kfz., though in some cases the typography makes the letters appear very close together, and I am very certain that SdKfz was never used. Christian Ankerstjerne (talk) 12:23, 7 August 2014 (UTC)

Work on new vehicles was obviously stopped before the war ended. Duh! That doesn't mean that the naming documents are officially void. And work on the Maus and E-100 never stopped. They just decreased the priority to the point where only 1 Maus was finished and approved for production, but by then the war situation made production impossible. There was literally 3 guys working on the E-100 hull until they stopped fooling themselves. In fact the 1 finished Maus was even sent on its way into the approximate eastern direction, but it allegedly broke. My guess is that the crew only said it broke, to stop their suicide mission, because it shouldn't have been possible for it to break after passing extensive testing at the plant. But I'm not saying that we should put speculation into articles. GMRE (talk) 18:28, 18 August 2014 (UTC)

In regards to the name: Cancellation of the project would of course not make a document with an official name void. That is not the point. The point is that, unless you can actually refer to such a document, your argument has no standing.

In regards to the production status: Note that I wrote that the Maus was cancelled for all practical purposes. Whether a few people kept working on the project does not mean that it was going to enter production. A lot of projects saw minor work, without ever materializing. If it was intended to bring the Maus into production in any forseable future, why was the planned production not listed in the monthly production summaries, as was the case for other future projects?Christian Ankerstjerne (talk) 21:31, 21 August 2014 (UTC)

Sd.Kfz. naming format?

There's a large change in progress at the moment [1] et al. to reformat all occurences of this as "Sd.Kfz." (no space). I can't see any discussion for this, and given the thread above, is that the correct form or should there be a space? Andy Dingley (talk) 20:16, 23 January 2019 (UTC)

At least it's better then Sdkfz or SdKfz. I barely have a problem with it if the change made en wiki articles use a uniform abbrevation for the vehicles. --Denniss (talk) 12:54, 24 January 2019 (UTC)

references?

This list could do with some references - some of the more exceptional claims such as "Sd.Kfz. 172 -proposed assault gun variant of Panther tank" I have been able to find very little information about.

If someone wants a place to start, I understand the Panzer Tracts books are a well-researched series of books covering the designations in order, although I don't have a copy myself

Translation

@Denniss: you recently reverted my changes to the translation saying it was incorrect. How can sonderkraftfahrzeug translate to special purpose vehicle. Kraftfahrzeug (kraft-fahr-zeug) literally translates to "powered travel thing", aka "motor vehicle". All my German to Swedish word books from the 1940s translates sonder- as "särskild", which translates to "distinct" or "specific" in English. Special as a translation has a different connotation today than its intended meaning. Blockhaj (talk) 09:35, 21 September 2022 (UTC)

Do not cut words into parts, translate these parts and expect a proper translation. Kraftfahrzeug is a common civilian term for any motor-driven vehicle. Sonderkraftfahrzeug is a term/designation for military vehicles of the Wehrmacht designed and built to fulfil special tasks. Typically used for armored or at least tracked vehicles.--Denniss (talk) 19:04, 21 September 2022 (UTC)

Translation and meaning are not the same thing. The translation should be a translation of the term, while its meaning is explained afterwards.--Blockhaj (talk) 19:59, 21 September 2022 (UTC)

Yours is no translation. As said only the whole word can be translated not piecemeal. According to your method the Sturmgewehr is to be translated as Storm Rifle which is not correct either. --Denniss (talk) 23:13, 21 September 2022 (UTC)

Storm rifle is correct in my books?--Blockhaj (talk) 23:22, 21 September 2022 (UTC)

Then throw these books away as those are trash (or had a very bad translator). --Denniss (talk) 12:32, 22 September 2022 (UTC)