Talk:Lynching of Michael Donald

Similar Execution in 1913

Does anyone know which White person was executed for the murder of a black person in 1913?

Smb2a (talk) 17:15, 15 August 2008 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.151.110.72 (talk)

A photograph of the street sign at http://www.splcenter.org/news/item.jsp?aid=185 named after Donald, would greatly contribute to the article.

This need a lot more about the investigation, Beuleah, the trials etc. Rich Farmbrough 16:45, 24 November 2005 (UTC)

removing image

i'm removing the image of him hanging from a tree its direspectful, however if someone wants to add it back just say so here and i'll will leave it alone untill then i'll continue to remove itLotharsrevenge (talk) 09:47, 15 May 2008 (UTC)

More discussion, yes

I concur. Morris Dees' autobiography is a good place to start on the civil suit. But there are, as yey, no scholarly discussion of the Donald case(s). There were 5 court cases involved, so the study is complicated. The Mobile Register has covered the case admirably in the last six months as the renaming process occured. Also, Michael Wilson's five articles, June 1-5, 1997, leading up to Henry Hays' execution are also very good and re[present the most original research done on the case to date.

Bennie Hays?

The first or second sentence says "Bennie Hay's son" as though we should know who Bennie Hays is. This seems like an editing oversight, but does anyone know the significance of this Bennie Hays person? Also, this article lists Michael Donald as the last lynching in American history. The article Lynching in the United States considers the murder of James Byrd a lynching, which occurred in 1998. So I am adding a "contradicts another article" tag to this piece. --Natalie 01:44, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

He was a Grand Dragon in the United Klans and his middle name was Jack. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.12.252.122 (talk • contribs) 21:10, 7 December 2006

How did you find out Donald's DOB, personally I believe that the death penalty was a slight overreaction, just a personal opinion, what do you think? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.12.252.122 (talk • contribs) 22:08, 7 December 2006

Respect

This article should be written with more respect for the Donald family, Michael's mother died after he got killed and with respect to the Hays family, Hays' did wrong but the fact he was executed doesn't make it any easier for his family.

82.20.21.73 11:04, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

At least Michael's mother gained justice in her civil suit against the UKA before her death; she won a judgment that bankrupted the UKA.Parkwells (talk) 13:19, 8 April 2015 (UTC)

Surviving Relatives

Does anyone have any information relating to the surviving members of the Donald family or Hays family?

82.20.21.73 11:05, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

How old was Bennie?

How old was Bennie Hays, the closest I could find on the social security death index was a guy who died in 1984 registered to Jackson, Missouri.

82.20.21.73 11:08, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

Images

• Donald on an autopsy table

• Is the lynching picture used in this article (and others) really needed, it seems insensitive...Mwv2 08:24, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
• I completely agree. I was shocked when I saw this graphic image.
  • Wikipedia:NOT - Wikipedia is not censored. BTW it is common to see photographs of other incidents - i.e. see Lynching in the United States WhisperToMe (talk) 01:24, 30 October 2008 (UTC)

Confusion over Hays

At first, this article states that Bennie Hays died before his trial began. Then there is this:

The elder Hays was tried some years later but the first case ended in a mistrial. Hays died of a heart attack before he could be retried.[

Did Bennie Hays die before his first or second trial?

God bless. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.147.242.164 (talk) 02:23, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

Unnecessary image. Removed. It is disrespectful.86.155.10.250 (talk) 09:13, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

• It is not "disrespectful" - It is a historical image that is crucial. Look, we have other photos of lynching incidents in these articles. Wikipedia is not censored. I say that showing what happened shows people the gravity of such incidents. You know what Emmett Till's mother did, right? She showed people what happened to her son. WhisperToMe (talk) 01:37, 30 October 2008 (UTC)

Is it really necessary to have a picture? Does it add to the article? Can we not have an external link instead?--Vindicta (talk) 01:19, 10 November 2008 (UTC)

Image

I don't think the photo of Donald being hanged needs to be there. I know Wikipedia is not censored, but consider that the title of the article does not give any clue as to what might be in it (unlike Lynching in the United States, which is pretty obvious). A person who innocently clicks on the link is going to be faced with a very disturbing image. We want to encourage people to read about the subject, not close the window in disgust. A hypertext link to the file would at least allow the reader to make a decision about viewing the image. ... discospinster _talk 03:37, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

i disagree i think the picture needs to be there. when i first saw the pictured i cried. i think it shows how far blacks have come. people need to know the truth. Micheal Donald was my father's uncle. so I guess he was my great uncle. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.214.43.248 (talk) 05:20, 22 March 2009 (UTC)

the image of Michael Donald needs to be here. It is tragic that this happened as recently as 1981, and still happens in the U.S. As i understand it, the Donald family wants the picture here to show what happened to their family. I cried when i saw it, but this happened, it will not go away just because it isnt something pretty in Mobile history. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.134.11.246 (talk) 19:39, 20 April 2009 (UTC)

I'm not disagreeing that it's tragic, but it's also a punishment to casual Wikipedia readers to see such an image with no warning beforehand. Anyway, the point is moot because the images was deleted. ... discospinster _talk 22:54, 20 April 2009 (UTC)

Lynching

Why is Michael Donalds death described as a "lynching"? Lynchings are extrajudicial punishment for proved or accused crimes. If someone is plucked off the street and killed, that is a regular murder, not a "lynching". —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.105.170.98 (talk) 04:02, 20 June 2009 (UTC)

Agreed. The term "lynching" is inaccurate and should be removed from the article. Hays and Knowles were never charged with lynching; they were charged and found guilty of murder.Richardkeefe57 (talk) 11:12, 30 June 2009 (UTC)

This certainly was not a lynching although it appears that at least one AP article called it that. An encyclopedia should not be sensationalistic and calling this murder a lynching is being that. Testimony at the murder trial indicated that Donald was strangled with a rope and had his throat cut before he was ever hanged by the 2 men. To be called a lynching, one necessity is the involvement of a mob and 2 people doesn't qualify as a mob.--TL36 (talk) 22:27, 29 August 2009 (UTC)

This case was described as a lynching by Geraldo Rivera when he covered the case, because the sensationalism of a lynching in the post Civil Rights era would get him more viewers. It is an appellation that has stuck.

absolutely agree. This is a brutal murder on a random victim, but no "lynching" (extrajudicial punishment by a mob) at all. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 194.230.160.30 (talk) 13:12, 26 February 2023 (UTC)

Deleting sentence that says Hays confessed

Not only is this unsourced but according to the NY Times, Rev. Bob Smith only made the claim that a confession had been made to him after Hays was executed and thus incapable of refuting it. I'm not suggesting there is doubt to Hays' guilt by my deletion.--TL36 (talk) 22:16, 29 August 2009 (UTC)

RfC

BAn RfC: Which descriptor, if any, can be added in front of Southern Poverty Law Center when referenced in other articles? has been posted at the Southern Poverty Law Center talk page. Your participation is welcomed. – MrX 17:01, 22 September 2012 (UTC)

More on Michael Donald

This is an article on Michael Donald. He may have been known for being murdered, but he lived as a person in the world whom his family and friends knew and loved. There needs to be more bio content about him, to acknowledge his life. He wasn't just a victim whose mother won a civil suit (as noteworthy as that was).Parkwells (talk) 13:23, 8 April 2015 (UTC)

Proposed merge with Henry Francis Hays

This murder case is in US news because of the nomination of Jeff Sessions to national office. He was apparently a prosecutor in the case, although the article does not say that. Something to be remedied perhaps, but what I propose here is to move the article to Murder of Michael Donald and merge Henry Francis Hays into it. The reason is that while both articles are ostensibly biographies, both are structured entirely around the murder case, and so they substantially overlap. Both perpetrator and victim would also not be notable without the murder (see WP:BIO1E). Pinging substantial contributors: @Hitcher vs. Candyman, Parkwells, and WhisperToMe: Comments?  Sandstein  22:24, 9 January 2017 (UTC)  Sandstein  22:24, 9 January 2017 (UTC)

I have no problem with this proposed merger. Roger 8 Roger (talk) 22:47, 9 January 2017 (UTC)

I agree and I support your proposal. After all, there are many biographical articles in Wikipedia about murder victims that begin with "Murder of..." (e.g. Murder of Adam Walsh, Murder of Ennis Cosby). What do you guys @Aircorn and Daniel Case: think? I ask you guys because you redirected Mikhail Markhasev to Murder of Ennis Cosby and you moved Neil Entwistle to Murders of Rachel and Lillian Entwistle. Hitcher vs. Candyman (talk) 23:05, 9 January 2017 (UTC)

Unless the murderer and victim were notable before the murder or reach a lasting level of notoriety following the crime (i.e. Ted Bundy) it is standard practice that we title the article after the event and redirect all the involved biographies there. Without looking too closely at the details here the merger seems like a reasonable proposal. AIRcorn (talk) 06:11, 10 January 2017 (UTC)

Thanks, all, for your input. i'll go ahead with the merger.  Sandstein  09:04, 10 January 2017 (UTC)

+1 to Aircorn, belatedly. Daniel Case (talk) 16:00, 10 January 2017 (UTC)

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Proposed merge of Beulah Mae Donald into Lynching of Michael Donald

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

---

Beulah Mae Donald is a WP:BLP1E biography; she is known only for her role in seeking justice for the lynching of Michael Donald, her son; and the article is almost entirely about that event. The two articles should therefore be merged. Sandstein 13:07, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Oppose stand alone notability is lent from the Candace Award, inclusion in Notable Black American Women (1992), and Contemporary Black Biography (2018), profile in The New York Times etc. There's relevant biographical information that wouldn't fit in the lynching article. She has also recently been the subject of a cnn op ed, indicative of continuing interest. It's not clear what benefit a merge would have. Eddie891 ^Talk _Work 13:45, 25 March 2021 (UTC)

Oppose Beulah Mae Donald easily meets notability guidelines. Absolutely no reason to merge the articles.--SouthernNights (talk) 15:00, 28 March 2021 (UTC)

Oppose CNN is planning to air a four-part docuseries called "The People vs. the Klan: The Untold Story of Beulah Mae Donald" that is being promoted as telling "the little-known true story of Beulah Mae Donald, a Black mother in Alabama who took down the Ku Klux Klan after the brutal murder of her son, Michael". It's clear from this series being promoted as the story of Beulah Mae Donald and her activism, especially 40 years after the crime, that she has attained notability in her own right. TheBlinkster (talk) 16:38, 7 April 2021 (UTC)

Oppose CNN Special Report showing tonight warrants stand alone notability. Jeff Sessions involvement is also notable as recent U.S. Attorney General, who was involved on the state level.--Ooligan (talk) 03:05, 12 April 2021 (UTC)

• Oppose per WP:BIO1E - If the event is highly significant, and the individual's role within it is a large one, a separate article is generally appropriate. Her role within it is a large one, evidenced by the sustained coverage, and additionally, her lawsuit set a precedent for other legal actions against violent white supremacist organizations and other groups who commit hates crimes. Isaidnoway (talk) 14:32, 21 April 2021 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.