Talk:Murder of Otávio Jordão da Silva

Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the proposal was moved to Death of Otávio Jordão da Silva. Deletion, of course, can be discussed at WP:AFD. --BDD (talk) 18:50, 17 July 2013 (UTC)

Otávio Jordão da Silva → Otávio Jordão da Silva incident – per WP:SINGLEEVENT. 209.6.114.98 (talk) 20:30, 10 July 2013 (UTC)

I disagree. Single event says "if an event is of sufficient importance, even relatively minor participants may require their own articles". This event has changed many people's views as to the safety of the Rio world cup in 2014, and has lead to concerns being raised about safety. Matty.007 20:41, 10 July 2013 (UTC)

That wouldn't quite apply here. That's for when there are separate articles for the event and the participant, which isn't the case here. --BDD (talk) 22:03, 10 July 2013 (UTC)

Side point about your final sentence: the article currently contains no such information about the impact of this event, and it would be improved with well-sourced analysis beyond simple factual reporting. 209.6.114.98 (talk) 00:01, 11 July 2013 (UTC)

• I'm not sure whether we should move or not, but if we do, Death of Otávio Jordão da Silva would be a better fit, in accord with how we usually title articles about individuals primarily notable for their deaths. --BDD (talk) 22:03, 10 July 2013 (UTC)

Note: This discussion has been included in WikiProject Football's list of association football-related page moves. --BDD (talk) 22:06, 10 July 2013 (UTC)

• I agree with BDD, Death of Otávio Jordão da Silva would be a better option.--Labattblueboy (talk) 22:49, 10 July 2013 (UTC)
• I (original requester) agree that "Death of ..." is more appropriate. 209.6.114.98 (talk) 23:52, 10 July 2013 (UTC)

• Delete article - whatever it's named - per WP:BLP1E. Seriously. GiantSnowman 23:15, 10 July 2013 (UTC)

WP:BLP1E doesn't apply because, alas, the subject is not a living person. I was at first inclined to suggest deletion, but WP:SIGCOV seems to permit an article about the incident. 209.6.114.98 (talk) 23:52, 10 July 2013 (UTC)

BLP does not stop applying the moment somebody has died. GiantSnowman 08:16, 11 July 2013 (UTC)

GiantSnowman is correct; WP:BIO1E essentially says the same thing as WP:BLP1E. It would be absurd if a person subject to BLP1E were considered notable as soon as he or she was no longer living. --BDD (talk) 18:43, 14 July 2013 (UTC)

Response added, I still think that this article should be kept, but have been partially persuaded, perhaps it should move to Otávio Jordão da Silva incident. Matty.007 10:16, 11 July 2013 (UTC)

• I agree - if kept, article should be moved to Death of Otávio Jordão da Silva as per other articles on people who are only famous for dying -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 20:07, 12 July 2013 (UTC)
• Support move to Death of Otávio Jordão da Silva; oppose move to Otávio Jordão da Silva incident. "Incident" is not descriptive enough. --Article editor (talk) 02:50, 13 July 2013 (UTC)
• Support sound good:descriptive, I think Article editor is right... Matty.007 08:36, 13 July 2013 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Combine article regarding soccer beheadings?

A few things: Does anyone think we should do a combined article about this incident and the death of João Rodrigo Silva Santos? I think if we did a "Brazil soccer beheadings" or something, it would get more views and we'd have more to write about regarding the safety concerns. Also, this page needs more redirects. I know the articles I've seen in America have a more Americanized form of his name as well as references to "soccer" instead of football. if I google football, I get very difference search results, so redirects (and probably the article itself) needs to include soccer references too. I had actually done a wikipedia search for the guy and found nothing. I tried soccer beheading and "Octavio da Silva Catanhede Jordan", which is how the guy's name is spelled in several American articles and got no results, so we definitely need some more redirects! :-)

I would do the redirects myself but I wanted to wait to see if anyone else thinks we should do a combined page with both soccer beheadings.

Also, the edits I made are very Americanized. My apologies. I'm assuming the primary creator is British(?). I don't know how to write in British English, so you have my full permission to go back and translate what I've written for the sake of cohesiveness.Bali88 (talk) 02:07, 16 February 2014 (UTC)

I would not merge, the circumstances are completely different: one was killed by an infuriated mob, while the other was kidnapped and killed by criminals. BTW, none of them has an article on the Portuguese wikipedia, because they didn't meet the notoriety requirements. —capmo (talk) 05:33, 16 February 2014 (UTC)

I would agree with capmo on this one (you are correct about the language, I am British). However, please go ahead and create some re-directs. Thanks, Matty.007 11:27, 16 February 2014 (UTC)

Okay cool. I will do so. I'm not sure how other articles handle the regional differences and I myself do not follow the sport, but it may be worth noting that the football that is being referenced is "soccer" and not American football. There are still plenty of Americans who do not know this and for the sake of clarity, it may be worth including. Bali88 (talk) 15:05, 16 February 2014 (UTC)

2014 World Cup

Regarding the safety of the 2014 FIFA World Cup, perhaps it should be mentioned in the article that Maranhão is the poorest Brazilian state, having been dominated for decades by a local oligarchy (the Sarneys, who are still in power). Besides that, Pio XII is a small ville with one of the country's lowest HDI. [1] The situation is much better in the capital cities where the matches will be held. —capmo (talk) 13:50, 16 February 2014 (UTC)

I'm quite busy at the minute making pages for Winter Olympians, but you could add it to the article, it seems like relevant info. Thanks, Matty.007 12:52, 18 February 2014 (UTC)

Thanks, will do it. —capmo (talk) 04:09, 21 February 2014 (UTC)