Talk:Piñata

doesn't define the word fully in the firs tsentence

it seems that in the first sentence it should tell people what people DO - as I'm aware, you hit it with a stick until candy or treats comes out - the first paragraph makes it clear there is joy involved, but doesn't fully define what it is by explaining the purpose or action involved that kids like so much. Since I'm not a writer, I thought I'd leave that comment for others to adjust. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.18.214.100 (talk) 15:52, 15 October 2009 (UTC)

References

comment

Last paragraph could use some rephrasing (and substantiation perhaps; seems a little POVish but it's hard to tell for sure) ;Bear 23:30, 2004 Apr 27 (UTC)

Sentance makes no sence

"Traditionally, people would get blindfolded and spun in circles to make it harder to have good balance. Or 'pin-yah-ta' in English."

The last sentance in that passage seems misplace, so I removed it. If you feel the need to explain the pronounciation, feel free to put it someplace more appropriate. 193.44.6.146 (talk) 17:51, 11 June 2008 (UTC)

On a second look, the sentance about spinning has no place in the etymology section either. 193.44.6.146 (talk) 17:53, 11 June 2008 (UTC)

Blas Bunny

Who is "Blas Bunny"? --Menchi 18:42, 13 December 2005 (UTC)

"Conejo Blas" is a Mexican folk character. Popular because of a song by Francisco Gabilondo Soler, who was a very much loved writer of songs for children. -- Rune Welsh | ταλκ 18:53, 25 January 2006 (UTC)

Extent of use

This article could do with saying more about which countries pinatas are used in, and how widely used they are within those countries. I assume their use is not restricted to Mexican and Italian communities. AdorableRuffian 20:30, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

I agree. "Beating the barrel" is very old in Europe, however not so much in English-speaking Europe, hence it's low profile around here. This article meanwhile owes everything to the cultural voguishness of the piñata in the U.S. Hakluyt bean 21:14, 21 April 2007 (UTC)

This may be coincidental cultural similarity, but it bears investigation. How old is the beating the barrel tradition? From what I gather, it was a Scandanavian tradition centered in Denmark. The Latin country of Spain had no such tradition. It seems unlikely that a Danish tradition would somehow influence the Mexican pinata, and far more likely that it came from the indigenous clay water pot. The pinata today is usually made from papier-mache, but not so long ago it was also made from clay pots, more like the Tlaloc pots than a barrel.Tmangray 00:58, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

The article on Danish carnival here on Wikipedia implies that the beating-the-barrel tradition is actually not so old, but is related to a Catholic carnival celebration. The Spanish were in the Low Countries and certainly had much influence on Catholic practices in the region in the era following their conquests in the Americas. If the beating-the-barrel tradition cannot be reliably traced further back than this period, it raises the possibility that the pinata may have been the inspiration for beating-the-barrel, by way of the Spanish. Tmangray 01:04, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

A little online research brought to light some interesting speculations, all of which are unreferenced and seemed to be repeating each others' stories, with some instances of glaring misinformation (eg "the Maya god Huitzilopochtli", or "pignatta means pineapple" (if this were so--it isn't of course---this would clinch the post-Columbian origin since pineapples are indigenous to Mexico). I found that the pinata was in fact used in Catholic Lenten festivals, but not before the European discovery of America. The African and Chinese stories seem particularly far-fetched, but maybe someone can come up with something substantial. The fact that the pinata does not occur in former Spanish colonies other than Mexico is particularly suggestive that it is indigenous to Mexico.Tmangray 18:07, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

Very good final point there, I agree with you. I asked on the Fastelavn page to see what they had to say. Beating spirits out of a barrel is maybe distinct from putting sweets in there for children. I would generally associate sweets (candy, fruit) with the New World. Hakluyt bean 23:56, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

there is a error on the ryme instead of "quitenle la prenda" should be "quitenle la venda"

is there any information on how the piñata arrived in Europe? Any evidence that it came from China. Indeed any evidence that it was known in China before is was seen in 14th century Europe?203.184.41.226 (talk) 07:11, 30 April 2013 (UTC)

I wrote most of the current version of the article. With the name "piñata" the association is Mexican although similar traditions exist elsewhere. "Piñata" should refer only to the Mexican tradition as it has its unique aspects. By all means add an article on "beating the barrel"! By the way, "pineapple" is not indigenous to Mexico. The Spanish brought it to Mexico along with sugar cane in the early colonial period.Thelmadatter (talk) 13:26, 30 April 2013 (UTC)

The Rhyme

There is no official rhyme I'm phitm it varies from place to place. The chant I know of goes like this:

Dale, dale, dale, No pierdas el tino, porque si lo pierdes pierdes el camino ya le diste uno, ya le diste dos, ya le diste tres y tu tiempo se acabo!

Which would be

Go, go, go Don't loose your aim, because if you loose it you will loose the path, you just hit it once, now u've hit it twice, now you've hit it thrice and yer time is up! Mike^(Talk)/_(Cont) 00:26, 19 September 2007 (UTC)

problems

ok this a part of WikiProject Mexicoand i have a problem with that. Mexico is not the only place with Piñatas.

There also should be an other section about Cuban Piñatas in particular cause they are different. You can read about them here: http://www.awe-yes.com/pinapinatas/pinata_history.htm Wikid00d88 (talk) 21:36, 26 January 2008 (UTC)

Cuban pinatas are derivative from Mexico, and a much later development. Cuba and Mexico have always had very close maritime ties. Tmangray (talk) 16:17, 8 February 2008 (UTC)

Article also says that ther eis no evidence that piñatas are used elsewhere... I dont know where the authors have been looking for cause I have seen many piñatas at least in COlombia and in Argentina —Preceding unsigned comment added by 171.64.23.210 (talk) 17:31, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

 Best Pinatas ever are at The Cascaron Store in San Antonio, Tx 
 ==Picture==

]

What's up

What's up with the "pin-yah-ta" comment in the "etymology" section? 82.169.112.106 (talk) 22:06, 24 May 2008 (UTC)

Insulting Picture

The current "themed park" picture from Germany should be removed and replaced with an picture from a celebration with authentic ties to the tradition. Would it be acceptable to place a picture under the "Japan" Wikipedia section depicting Florida Epcot's Japanland? It would be an insult. Same goes here. Kim —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.161.151.116 (talk) 04:20, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

Making love

When creating life the wand pounds the bag until it "breaks" (sperm penetrates ovum as well), and from this abundance comes ;) The wand is the active principle and the bag the resting one...

What is a piñata

I think this article would benefit with 1 or 2 lines before the contents simply explaining what a piñata is It gives some hypotheses of where they come from and what to sing while playing but doesn't ever say "A piñata is..." —Preceding unsigned comment added by Stonysleep (talk • contribs) 18:04, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

What is a piñata

I completely agree with the above. I came to this page hoping to find out what exactly a piñata is, but am only slightly the wiser. I can sort of speculate about what it might be after reading through the "Origins" and "Making a piñata" sections, but the article would benefit greatly from a "A piñata is..." section. Unfortunately, I am clearly not qualified to provide such a section, so I hope someone else (who knows what one of these things might be) can! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.35.21.95 (talk) 17:07, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

Pinatic Surgery

Is the whole stuff about pinatic surgery true? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.109.108.166 (talk) 12:46, 20 December 2008 (UTC)

I think it was vandalism, so I've removed it. It was unreferenced anyway - come back with a reliable source and it can go back in. Astronaut (talk) 17:48, 20 December 2008 (UTC)

It's definitely not true. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.90.128.226 (talk) 09:24, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

I have received pinatic surgery. It is illegal and not widely known about, so I have no 'relaiable source'. I am trying to spread word of it on the internet so that it can be clamped down on. I tried reporting it to the police. They did not believe me. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.80.9.150 (talk) 14:30, 22 April 2010 (UTC)

Safety

Please consider rewording or deleting the sentence that says safety precautions include keeping a wide space around the baseball bat being swung.

Fact: by the nature of the game, the kids are going to be excited, and the onlooker kids are going to be trying to get close, to be the first to grab any candy the moment a single piece falls. Fact: being struck in the head by a baseball bat can cause severe or fatal injuries to a child. Therefore, letting children use a real baseball bat to break a pinata at a party and relying on "keeping a wide space around it" is grossly negligent and reckless per se. Wykily (talk) 16:37, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

Self contradictory

Much of the part of the article about the history of the piñata contradicts itself. The (unsourced) part about it coming from the Mayans, Aztecs, etc. is not compatible with the (perhaps unreliably) sourced part about it originating with the conquistadors, and that the first piñatas were shaped in a way that symbolized a Christian concept. Should we remove the part about the "legends"? Or are there better sources? Kansan (talk) 01:42, 25 November 2010 (UTC)

Agreed. Also, as far as I know, there is no evidence of such concept in Classical Nahuatl or Mayan languages. Some indigenistas would try to coin something like pinatatzin, but such is a calque of Spanish. Otherwise, such lines referring to "pre-Columbian origins of piñatas" should be removed, as they are blatantly unsourced. Big-latigo (talk) 07:16, 27 June 2023 (UTC)

The issue here is the lack of sources rather than the contradiction. There may be a variety of explanations of the origin of something, which may be contradictory. Our job is to report in a balanced, neutral way what the reliable sources say, not arbitrate the contradictions. Cullen328 (talk)`

I don’t find it neutral at all. Piñata came to all America specially to the South, so why is it mentioning just Mexico many times? This is not about the piñata in Mexico only. Should show general words talking about piñata coming with Spain/Asia etc. I didn’t even see the very famous known song “¿Quién rompe la piñata?” Made in South America that everybody knows and it’s played every time piñata has to be broken. Please add this song every Latin Hispanics knows about it, report in a balanced. Figaro Cheshire Cats (talk) 00:51, 16 March 2021 (UTC)

Blatant errors

"The Spain brought the piñata to Mexico during the beginning of the 15th century." Really? THE Spain? Also, apparently the SPANIARDS brought the piñata to Mexico before Columbus arrived. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Schepeler (talk • contribs) 23:59, 25 January 2012 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 15 September 2014

Please change the following sentence in the first paragraph from: The Spanish brought the European tradition to Mexico, to: The Spanish brought the European tradition to Latin America,

Because the way it is written now, the article still gives the false impression that Piñatas arrived to America exclusively in Mexico.

Thank you.

108.7.5.127 (talk) 02:47, 15 September 2014 (UTC)

Not done: as you have not requested cited reliable sources to back up your request, it could well be that it first arrived in Mexico. - Arjayay (talk) 21:05, 19 September 2014 (UTC)

Origins

The summary of the origins is unclear. The word is Spanish, and the earliest references are to Europe (Spain, presumably) in the 14th century. Is that the earliest known instance of that is now known as piñata? Presumably it spread to Latin America from Spain. If it started in Spain, why is there no reference to pinata in Spain today? But what about China? How does that fit in? Apart from the throwaway suggestion that it originated there, there is no reference to China.Royalcourtier (talk) 02:15, 8 January 2016 (UTC)

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Says nothing about italian origins, only references spanish origins.

Multiple sources online say that piñatas were brought over from Italy to Spain by Roman soldiers, and then used in a christian context. This article makes no mention of any of that happening, nor does it say anything about piñatas in Italy in general. Bongi347 (talk) 19:24, 30 June 2023 (UTC)