Talk:Pierre Mendès France

Spelling and derivation of name Mendès France

Just a remark. Mendès France has no hyphen as it is the Frenchified version of the original Portuguese name Mendes de França. The common ancestor of all the Mendès France was Luis Mendes de França who arrived in France in 1683( having escaped from the Inquistion after having been tried for judaizing). Firstly he signed the Portuguese name then adopted Mendès France.

For more information it is possible, under certain conditions, to consult the genealogical and historical archives of Pierre Mendès France at the Alliance Israelite Universelle,Paris. Signed82.125.235.242 11:44, 6 October 2005 (UTC)Joan Mendès France

Pronunciation

"(pronounced Man-dez-Fronce)" -- I removed this as it is neither fish nor fowl.

• "Man" as in English or as in French? (well, it's as in French, since in that language "en" rhymes with "an")
• "dez" as in English or as in French? (well, this time it must be as in English, since "dez" in French is pronounced "dé")
• "Fronce" as in English or as in French? (well, neither, since in English the last part of the man's name rhymes not with "once" but with the second syllable of "seance" -- and in French "on" certainly does not rhyme with "an")

If we are to have any pronunciation shown it really ought to be in IPA. -- Picapica 21:26, 2 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Except that hardly anyone will be able to understand it. There is no way of giving pronunciations for foreign names which is both 100% accurate and accessible to non-linguists. I think my version is reasonably accurate. But you'd rather leave readers with no help at all, that's up to you. Adam 00:33, 3 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Indeed, no help is better than misleading help, in my view. My ordinary desk dictionary, by no means a specialist publication aimed at "linguists only", uses IPA to indicate pronunciations. Ideally, all foreign-language names in the English-language Wikipedia, as well as English-language proper names with unusual pronunciations, will eventually have attached sound-files, as an increasing number already have. In the meantime, IPA is our best tool. -- Picapica 22:20, 3 Jun 2005 (UTC)

I would prefer "Mon-dez-Fronce." I'm not sure how "Fronce" would be pronounced except as rhyming with the second syllable of "seance". Certainly it wouldn't be pronounced "Fr-wunce", and that isn't implied by the pronunciation given. john k 02:01, 3 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Well, that's precisely the trouble with using individually "made-up" pronunciation schemes. I don't pronounce "once" as "wunce". (You are right, though, that I chose badly since that word is pronounced "wunce" in US and some varieties of, especially southern, British English). For me, "once" rhymes with "bonce", "nonce", and "ponce". "Seance", however, does not rhyme with any of those words: the anglicized pronunciation of séance is -- eschewing IPA -- "sayahnss". -- Picapica 22:20, 3 Jun 2005 (UTC)

To Govern is to Choose

When or where did he say or write this?Paulturtle (talk) 17:30, 24 December 2014 (UTC)