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Talk:Results of the 2012 Republican Party presidential primaries

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Ron Paul status in this article

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Latest comment: 12 years ago10 comments4 people in discussion

An editor marked Ron Paul as "out" at some point, and the article was left this way for several days. However, an astute editor noticed that technically Ron Paul never stepped down or out during the primaries, and continued his race all the way to the Republican National Convention. Several contests were decided *at* the convention itself, and unless someone has a reliable secondary source showing where Ron Paul actually declared himself 'out', I don't see how we can declare it here. The primaries are over, the RNC is over, Ron Paul is not the nominee, but that doesn't change the fact that he never went 'out' during the "2012 Republican Party presidential primaries", which is the focus of *this* article.

Back up the change with reliable secondary sources or leave the article be. This is a silly thing to be edit warring over, and the fact that Ron Paul's delegates were still being contested during the RNC speaks very clearly to the idea of whether he was out. The Republican National Convention is not a primary (or a caucus). The RNC is the gathering of the delegates that were elected or appointed during the primary process. It is not a "POV" to indicate that Ron Paul was still 'in' after all primary contests were over, and delegates were credentialed and seated. -- Avanu (talk) 16:46, 3 September 2012 (UTC)Reply

How about this - we put "Defeated" or "Lost" instead of out? Unquestionably Paul is out of the race. He lost, badly, at the convention. Every other candidate that is out of the race is tagged as such. I see absolutely no reason not to remain consistent. Ravensfire (talk) 17:01, 3 September 2012 (UTC)Reply
Defeated or Lost is clearly quite POV. You might lose individual primaries or caucuses, however, the Republican National Convention is where votes are taken and a candidate is "defeated" or "nominated". You are conflating two separate events into one. "Republican National Convention" does not equal "2012 Republican Party presidential primaries"-- Avanu (talk) 17:05, 3 September 2012 (UTC)Reply
Almost all the candidates earned votes from delegates from different various states except for Rick Perry? So they were all "OUT" before the convention even started so the logic can hold the same for Ron Paul. Besides, there's nothing about ambiguous about the word "OUT". It just means that they can't fight for the nominee spot of the party anymore. However Ron Paul is free to declare his own independent ticket but I doubt he would do so. I don't see why this is a controversial issue? ViriiK (talk) 18:58, 3 September 2012 (UTC)Reply
Based on your statement, I'm not even sure what you're talking about. Primaries/caucuses occur BEFORE the convention. Based on reliable sources, at what point did Ron Paul drop out? Also, what does "Ron Paul is free to declare his own independent ticket" have to do with anything? This article is about the Republican primary process for 2012. It is not about the convention, it is not about the selected nominee. Show a reliable source that demonstrates Ron Paul dropping out during the primaries. Otherwise, remove the 'out' and recognize what this article is about. -- Avanu (talk) 19:30, 3 September 2012 (UTC)Reply
At this point, what purpose does the "Out" dot serve? It was useful during the course of the ongoing event as a quick visual indicator of which candidates were still active. But with the primaries over, all the candidates are technically "out", since there are no more contests for them to be "in". This is true even of Romney. Remove all the markers as historical relics that are no longer needed. Fat&Happy (talk) 20:11, 3 September 2012 (UTC)Reply
The convention is the termination/or conclusion of the primary & caucuses since the delegates are now allowed to cast their vote for their respective choices based on the results of each state-by-state primary or their unbounded delegate statuses. Once that's done, whoever is the respective nominee, they are then in general election mode. Yes, I'm aware that Romney has been in general election mode ever since Santorum dropped out of the running. ViriiK (talk) 21:16, 3 September 2012 (UTC)Reply
Figured I would wait a bit to see if more replies were forthcoming. Fat&Happy proposed a reasonable compromise here. The 'out' serves no further purpose. If editors insist on keeping it though, it should not be applied to Ron Paul, since this article ends at the primaries. The outcome of the convention can be said to relate to the primary process, but the vote taken by the delegates at the convention is not really a part of the primary process. But this entire question can be avoided by simply removing the 'out' from all of them, and just using the text to describe the outcome. -- Avanu (talk) 03:36, 5 September 2012 (UTC)Reply


So no one comments for 3 days, and the first moment I try to fix the article to reflect the facts, you guys are all over it to revert it. This is really lame of you. The title of this article is *not* the 2012 Republican Presidential Nominee. If it were, then Romney would be fully able to be listed as the only guy. But a quick check of what the title of this article makes it very clear what it is about. So either correct it to show Mitt Romney AND Ron Paul as both surviving past the primaries, or simply adopt the compromise proposed by Fat&Happy above. I've very disappointed to see that there is some hyperpartisanship occuring here that prevents us from having this article be accurate. The fact that several of you have stated things like "Paul is not still in the race" and "user continues to refuse to accept only romney is still in the race" shows that you simply are not reading what the article says, nor what the article is titled. No one is saying Ron Paul is still running for president, yet somehow you believe that tagging him as not 'out' in this article in some way relates to that. These are entirely separate things. Please gather a clue. -- Avanu (talk) 04:45, 7 September 2012 (UTC)Reply


You have had another entire week to comment. The page protection that I requested has now expired. No one has chosen to comment in this entire past week with the exception of Spiffy Sperry in the RfC below. I have restored the compromise language for the article that removes *all* 'out' designators. If you revert it at this point, especially without a strong set of reliable sources, I will immediately report you for edit warring. You've had more than enough time to comment, and you've had the entire week of having it be "your" version. I would have been ok with leaving the 'out' on everyone but Ron Paul and Mitt Romney, but as Fat&Happy pointed out there is really no reason for the designator to be on any of them at this point. -- Avanu (talk) 13:37, 14 September 2012 (UTC)Reply

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