Talk:Riley Motor

First car in Coventry

How can the car be the first to been seen on the streets of Coventry, when Daimler had already been producing cars there since 1896? (unsigned)

Very true. I have removed the un-supported statement. Malcolma 12:05, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Unknown Riley

Unrecognised (by me) Riley. Now thought to be 1939 Riley 12hp Adelphi saloon

This car has a Riley badge, but it is not a type of Riley I recognise (and Culshaw and Horrobin catalogue does not have a picture of it). Does anyone know what it is, please?Charles01 (talk) 16:34, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

1939 Riley 12hp in my opinion. Malcolma (talk) 06:39, 16 June 2008 (UTC)

Thank you. Hmmmrmph. Blending together information from the wiki Riley entry and Culshaw & Horrobin data table (page 246 in my edition), this would presumably be a post Nuffield acquisition model, most likely the one C & H list as a 1½ [litre] with a precise cc of 1496 cc and a 9 foot wheel base. C & H doesn't have space for much more, however, (I think he may even have a crucial line or some missing from his text) beyond pointing out that the war put an end to whatever commercial prospects the car otherwise might have had. Which I guess we sort of knew.

And it looks a bit early for your own collection of Motor magazines, as far as I can judge. Ah well, I suppose someone somewhere will gather together enough info for an entry on the model sooner or later. I hope... Doesn't look as if it was ever a major seller, so presumably surviving contemporary source info would be correspondingly hard to find. Regards Charles01 (talk) 16:09, 16 June 2008 (UTC)

I think it must have been known at the time as the 'Adelphi' saloon. That's the name someone gave to another pciture of what looks like the same model on the preceding page. There was this 1½ litre saloon and an even rarer 2½ litre saloon with an extra diamond shaped something on the side of the bonnet. (I've been going through old Autocars...) Charles01 (talk) 15:07, 18 April 2009 (UTC)

It's not an Adelphi, though there are many similarities in the styling. I've never heard of C&H, but Malcolm has it right: it's the Nuffield-sanctioned interim model produced from late 1938 to early 1940. Contrary to myth, this wasn't a Morris/Nuffield design, but a last desperate throw of the dice by the Riley brothers which wasn't quite ready for production when the Receivers were called in. This doesn't stop Riley people from referring to these cars as the "Nuffield models". Presaging the post-war approach, essentially the same body was available as a four-door saloon or a two-door drophead coupe, on either a short 1 1/2-litre chassis or a longer-wheelbase frame with the 'Big Four' engine. But not the bonnet-side 'flash', alas. The former was called simply the 'Twelve', and the latter was the 'Sixteen'. The dark blue badge and relatively short bonnet identify this one as a Twelve. None of this matters much, though, as I seem to remember that the Riley Register only knows of half a dozen "Nuffields" worldwide. The model/s were not re-introduced after the war due to the bodywork factory being bombed flat in December 1940. (johnny-nemo@hotmail.co.uk.) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.112.245.161 (talk) 16:19, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

Another unknown Riley

Can anybody indentify this Riley? I have seen it in Germany. --Berthold Werner (talk) 06:38, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

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I'm afraid it's a 'Special'.

In the 1950's and 1960's the timber-framed bodies of old saloons fell victim to age and weather and the cost of repairs was prohibitive. But, in many cases, their seperate chassis were still in good order so it became fairly common for heavy saloon coachwork to be scrapped, and replaced with the lightest and most minimal bodies. This also usually meant shortening the wheelbase, partly to reduce weight further, mainly to disguise the car's true origins, and giving us the expression 'cut and shut'. Good fun for the impecunious enthusiast, and roughly the equivalent of hot-rodding in the U.S. This was particularly common with Rileys due to the fact that the factorys' genuine sports and racing models, though superb, were only sold in tiny numbers.

Excluding the very remote possibility that we're looking at an authentic works racer, this particular car, from what I can see of the chassis, seems to be based on either a 12/4 or 15/6 frame. (I can't make out the number of branches on the exhaust manifold.) It looks too long to be one of the smaller Merlin/Falcon/Victor family, and the holes in the chassis are (I think) too small and too many. If the radiator cowl is original it dates the chassis to 1935-1937. It's impossible to be certain from these photos (a side elevation would help), but I'll hazard a guess that this is the unshortened chassis of an early Adelphi/Continental/Kestrel, with modern bodywork.

Sadly, special-building has enjoyed something of a revival in recent years, driven by the inexorable climb in value of the genuine article. Some people cannot wait years for a real one to come onto the market, and then spend a fortune, when they can buy a tired saloon for very little and have it 'converted' into a rough approximation. It has become common for these cars to be referred to as 'Merlin Special' or 'Kestrel Special' to protect the constructor/vendor from being accused of "passing off" a fake, but this is absurd because these names referred to the style of the body, not the mechanical parts. Though the conversion process is not cheap, it is far cheaper than restoring the original body. And though a copy will never be worth as much as an original, the resale values of open-topped Specials are dramatically greater than the values of most of the saloons upon which they are based. So, in bald economic terms, it makes no sense to restore these cars as they were intended. Madness, in my opinion.

Germany seems to have become the hub of this dubious craft, so it's no great surprise that it was spotted there. Rumour has it that a few years ago a particularly fine Adelphi, which had been a special order for a celebrity when new and had many unique features, was bought by a German 'enthusiast' who broke it up for parts almost immediately. The usual justification for this sort of thing is that the car "was too far gone to save". The sad truth is that they were merely to far gone to save *and* make a profit. (johnny-nemo@hotmail.co.uk)