Talk:Saïd Taghmaoui

Currently missed movie is...

Author of the article forgot to put "Room to Rent" into his filmography. 89.110.221.89 (talk) 14:51, 30 July 2011 (UTC) Ivan from Krusevac, Serbia

Name spelled wrong

Diacritics are not allowed in English. Presidentbalut (talk) 10:22, 8 March 2014 (UTC)

Ethnicity vs. citizenship

Per long-standing consensus, a subject's current nationality/citizenship is included in the lead, not their ethnicity. As Taghmaoui holds dual American and French citizenship, this is what is used in the lead. His ethnicity is subsequently discussed in the body of the article. If one believes that consensus should not apply in this case, and that ethnicity as opposed to nationality/citizenship should be used in the lead of this specific article, they will need to gain consensus prior to making the change.--Jezebel's Ponyo^{bons mots} 20:46, 9 May 2016 (UTC)

@Ponyo: It's not just his ethnicity. Per Article 6, Chapter II of the Moroccan nationality code, "Est Marocain, l’enfant né d’un père marocain ou d’une mère marocaine.transl. Is Moroccan, the child born to a Moroccan father or a Moroccan mother." So under Moroccan nationality law any person born to a Moroccan parent (father or mother or both) is automatically a Moroccan citizen. "chaque enfant né d’un parent marocain est automatiquement marocain, même s’il est né en dehors du Maroc, et il n’est pas possible de renoncer à la nationalité marocaine., trans every child born to a Moroccan parent is automatically Moroccan, even if he was born outside Morocco, and it is not possible to renounce Moroccan nationality." This is just the legal stuff. There are many sources that describes him as Franco-Marocain (Franco-Moroccan). Usually the sources that mention him as "français d'origine marocaine" (French of Moroccan descent) or French-American of Moroccan descent don't know how Moroccan nationality law works and that you can't voluntarily renounce your Moroccan citizenship when it has been passed on to you by the right of blood. It is practically the only way (Jus sanguinis) to become Moroccan, (with some exceptions). Plus, he never publicly renounced (he can't) his Moroccan citizenship. I think the lead should be changed to "Franco-Moroccan actor, naturalised american in 2008" or French-American-Moroccan actor, etc. Ping @إيان: do you have anything to add? -TheseusHeLl (talk) 03:16, 25 May 2020 (UTC)

Definitely seems to me that his Moroccan background should be mentioned in the header. Personally not sure about how valid the argument is for the extraterritorial jurisdiction aspect of Moroccan nationality, but his Moroccan background seems relevant to the extent that it should be in the introduction. إيان (talk) 04:51, 25 May 2020 (UTC)

Ian, I think you misunderstood my points. I wasn't talking about ETJ. My point is, born to Moroccan parents, father or mother (since 2007) or both, is automatically a Moroccan citizen (per moroccan nationality code). I think this interview confirms my point that Said has three nationalities (French by birth, Moroccan through his parents and American via naturalisation)

Vous possédez les trois nationalités: marocaine, américaine et française...
Je suis un citoyen du monde et le ciel est mon toit.

trans.

You have three nationalities: Moroccan, American and French ...
I am a citizen of the world and the sky is my roof.

Ps: "«Depuis 1958, rappelle Moulay Abbès Kadiri, représentant du royaume chérifien à Paris, les Marocains ne peuvent abandonner leur citoyenneté même s'ils sont naturalisés ou nés à l'étranger.» Traduction: les Français d'origine marocaine ont automatiquement la nationalité de leur pays natal." transl. Since 1958, recalled Moulay Abbès Kadiri, representative of the Cherifian kingdom in Paris, Moroccans cannot give up their citizenship even if they are naturalized or born abroad." Translation:French people of Moroccan origin automatically have the nationality of their native country.

-TheseusHeLl (talk) 07:00, 25 May 2020 (UTC)

Makes sense to me. I support "French-American-Moroccan actor" in light of the sources provided. إيان (talk) 18:22, 25 May 2020 (UTC)

@Ponyo: Can you please take a look at my reply above. -TheseusHeLl (talk) 02:13, 28 May 2020 (UTC)

TheseusHeLl Maybe in the infobox we could say that his nationality or citizenship is French/Moroccan/American, whatever works, but Taghmaoui was born and raised in France and then moved to the US and got American citizenship in his 30s. His career and notability is mostly in France and America. Him being Moroccan is not important to his lede following MOS:BIOLEAD and WP:ETHNICITY. Clear Looking Glass (talk) 18:46, 9 February 2021 (UTC)

He has been featured in Moroccan movies too. Moreso, he was not born French, only acquiring French citizenship through his parents' naturalization later on. 2A02:8440:C128:D1D1:0:E:ACBC:C301 (talk) 03:08, 16 February 2024 (UTC)

Screenwriter and Co-writer of La Haine

https://youtube.com/pvmRSqKH6SQ At 1:09:24 (subtitles available) and this article https://mrfeelgood.com/articles/la-haine-to-hollywood-said-taghmaoui Please take a look and tell me what you think, because in my opinion there should be a trace of this on his Wiki page. TheAstarteWiki. (talk) 18:19, 16 July 2023 (UTC)

The article from mrfeelgood.com does not state that Saïd was a co-writer on La Haine; it explicitly credits Kassowitz (Filmmaker Kassowitz started writing La Haine in 1993). The YouTube video (above link should be [1]) has several issues as a source: 1) it is an interview with Saïd, and thus a primary source; 2) it is published on a YouTube channel with unclear editorial standards and 3) I don't speak French, but from what I gather, in the section in question Saïd isn't claiming to be credited as a writer on La Haine anyways, just talking about how acting decisions can work their way into rewrites and the finished product. Dylnuge ^{(Talk • Edits)} 19:26, 16 July 2023 (UTC)

1) Yes, the article credits explicitly Kassovitz, but it also indicates that Saïd co-wrote the script, and I quote “ I (Saïd Taghmaoui) co-wrote that movie, so there was my life, my soul, my blood in there.

2) I’m a fluent French speaker and in the interview at 1:11:04 he says and I quote “I have never asked anything from La Haine but credit (for the writing)”. @TheAstarteWiki. TheAstarteWiki. (talk) 19:40, 16 July 2023 (UTC)

Gotcha. Those claims are still both primary sources (specifically, quotes from Taghmaoui himself) and don't directly support his claim to have been a writer on the film ("Person X said they did Y" is not the same as "Person X did Y"). The best statement they could support would be one along the lines of "Taghmaoui claims to have been uncredited as a co-writer on La Haine," and even that likely requires a more substantial source. The article does contain the I co-wrote that movie quote, but it doesn't otherwise say anything about being unfairly uncredited—ideally the claim would be supported by a reliable source writing about it independently (i.e. not an interview) and in-depth.

I totally get what you're trying to do here, and I appreciate it. I think it helps to keep in mind that Wikipedia should include only statements which are verified by reliable sources. Even if you're certain the information you're adding is true, reliable sources are required. See the essay Wikipedia:Verifiability, not truth for a more in-depth exploration of that idea. Dylnuge ^{(Talk • Edits)} 20:01, 16 July 2023 (UTC)