Talk:Wade Wilson (American football)

Failed requested move

The following discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion section. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result was no move. Ace Class Shadow; My talk. 06:36, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

Rationale for move:

1. "Wade Wilson" redirects to a fictional character. I don't think that fictional characters should take precedent over real people.
2. It is my understanding that parentheses are to be avoided as much as possible, to be only used when necessary. This looks like a unnecessary case of parentheses.
3. We could add a dablink of "This article is about the football player. For the Marvel comics character, see Deadpool"

If not, I'll submit a WP:RM request. Hbdragon88 23:05, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

Wade Wilson (athlete) → Wade Wilson – There is absolutely no reason why a fictional character should take precedence over a real athelete. Appropriate dab notices were already put on both the Deadpool and the Wade Wilson page. The Google Test yields 1.3 million results for "wade wilson football" but only 15,000 for "wade wilson deadpool". Hbdragon88 18:16, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

Survey

Add "* Support" or "* Oppose" followed by an optional one-sentence explanation, then sign your opinion with ~~~~

• Oppose. ACS (Wikipedian); Talk to the Ace. See what I've edited. 04:40, 8 September 2006 (UTC)
• Oppose. Seems like a fairly straightforward disambig at Wade Wilson. And while the comic alter-egos are fairly obscure, I don't think anyone is going to have trouble finding the athelete's article if that's what they're looking for. --Satori Son 00:19, 18 September 2006 (UTC)

Discussion

Add any additional comments.

Try actually clicking on "Wade Wilson" rather than flying off the handle, dude. Also, check out "T-Ray". Needless to say, it's not a redirect anymore, but a dab page. The name could refer to sever characters in comics and only one person outside of them. In fact, I think I left a character out. Excuse me. ACS (Wikipedian); Talk to the Ace. See what I've edited. 04:40, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

Yes, I know that there are three entries, but it still looks rather pointless. I'd rather have dab notices on both T-Ray and Deadpool saying "For the other person claimed to be Wade Wilson..." as both Deadpool and T-Ray are aliases, while there is a real Wade Wilson out there. Also, the "Slade Wilson" looks pretty weak and could easily be removed. Note that I chose to be more reasonable and file a WP:RM request rather tahn do a {{db-move}}. Hbdragon88 05:05, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

I don't know that you could make a case for a straight up db, dude. Also, while you might have the POV that fictional characters come second, I'd like to point out that this is still three against one. Now, you might not want to count it as such, but, all three characters could arguably be "real Wade Wilsons". Heck, Deadpool, as I've learned, is already often assumed to be such. The only real other option that comes to mind is making a "Wade Wilson (comics)" page, but that probably wouldn't work. Besides, like you've come to believe, parenthesis should be used sparingly. Oh and BTW, "RM request" is redundant. Like, "ATM machine" or "PIN number". Work on phrasing that better. ACS (Wikipedian); Talk to the Ace. See what I've edited. 17:53, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

It wouldn't have hurt to try, but I instead took this alternate route. I disagree with the "three against one" unless you can actually prove that Deathstroke has in fact been called "Wade Wilson" when the article itself doesn't even have that nickname, except a WP:NOR suggestion that Wade Wilson comes from a combination of Slade Wilson and Walt DeForge. Hbdragon88 05:01, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

Well, this doesn't look like it's going to get anywhere - I support and you oppose. Should we enlist a WikiProject in here to weigh in? Hbdragon88 01:16, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

• Relisting for lack of consensus. --Dijxtra 11:57, 17 September 2006 (UTC)

Note that that was only changed to a disambiguation after this move was requested.[1] Gene Nygaard 18:49, 18 September 2006 (UTC)

I don't like the "Wade Wilson (athlete)" name, because as athlete says, "In British English this is often limited to athletics" linking the last word to athletics (track and field). Gene Nygaard 18:54, 18 September 2006 (UTC)

Firstly, don't post comments at the survey without voting. Second, no, it wasn't. The Wade Wilson automatically became a redirect as a result of the move to "Wade Wilson (athlete)". Standard practice. I turned it into a disambiguation page immediately after. Third, your POV alone isn't a good enough reason to change the title again. Forth, I can barely made heads or tails of your other "reasons", but they don't seem enough to justify a title change, either. ACS (Wikipedian); Talk to the Ace. See what I've edited. 01:27, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page, such as the current discussion page. No further edits should be made to this page.

Biography assessment rating comment

The article may be improved by following the WikiProject Biography 11 easy steps to producing at least a B article.-- Jreferee 23:01, 12 March 2007 (UTC)

Contested move request

The following request to move a page has been added to Wikipedia:Requested moves as an uncontroversial move, but this has been contested by one or more people. Any discussion on the issue should continue here. If a full request is not lodged within five days of this request being contested, the request will be removed from WP:RM. —Stemonitis 07:11, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

• Wade Wilson (football) → Wade Wilson (American football) — WP:D —Juan Miguel Fangio| ►Chat  15:03, 29 July 2007 (UTC)

There does not appear to be any consistency in the way this kind of article is named; "(football player)" is often used and seems sufficient until there is someone named Wade Wilson who plays a different type of football, but both the current and the proposed title seem to indicate that Wade Wilson is a ball. Dekimasuよ! 02:41, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

This is a surprisingly common misconception, but an absurd one nonetheless. The term in brackets denotes the general field to which the name applies. It indicates that this Wade Wilson is the one to do with football, not that he is a football. Whip (politics) does not suggest that the whip is (a) politics, but that it is the term in politics that is meant. Coach (sport) is not a sport, but a term in sport. Trial (law) is not a law, but a legal term. --Stemonitis 07:11, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

Yet we have Madonna (entertainer) (not entertainment), Jack Straw (politician) (not politics), Prince (musician) (not music), and the list goes on and on for any profession you choose: James Stewart (actor), Thomas Young (scientist), Gareth Roberts (physicist), Paul Cohen (mathematician), Pierre Cartier (jeweler), Bill Blass (designer), and a whole slew of articles on football (soccer) players with the disambiguator "(footballer)", of which I found more than 100 without really trying. I would like to point out that I did not contest this move; I simply asked for clarification because it's clear that no naming convention is being applied consistently. Dekimasuよ! 09:51, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

WP:D is pretty clear on this. Association football is most commonly referred to as simply football. Thus, American football is a necessary term. Adding the term player is a way of "over specifying" the title. That too is also in WP:D. Many other players have this type of disambig, and for those that don't, it is a failure of their name structure and not of the convention. Thus, this is a fairly "uncontroversial move". Juan Miguel Fangio| ►Chat  07:46, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

American football is also most commonly referred to as simply football (in fact, it's never referred to as American football in the United States), and all kinds of football (including the American version) are covered in the article Football. "Football player" is a noun phrase - a common, inseparable set - in American English. It is equivalent to the one-word "footballer" in Commonwealth English. If adding "player" is overspecification, so is adding "American". Dekimasuよ! 09:51, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

• More people in this world refer to Association football simply as football. Most english speaking people, refer to what the US calls soccer, as football. The only area of the world where football is the equivalent of American football is here in the US. This is exactly why the WP:D article addresses this. There really is very little room for interpretation on this one. Juan Miguel Fangio| ►Chat  12:21, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

The fact remains that "football" is not ambiguous within the context of the Wade Wilsons who have articles on Wikipedia. Only one Wade Wilson plays any of the games called "football". There were several other recent move requests in this vein, including moving things like Notre Dame Fighting Irish football to Notre Dame Fighting Irish American football, and they were all found to be unambiguous at the "football" title; the moves were reverted. Anyone referring to "Fighting Irish football" is referring to American football; anyone referring to a Wade Wilson who plays football is referring to American football. Dekimasuよ! 14:36, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

But I see you knew that already, as you were the one to make the Fighting Irish move. Having discovered that there has been some negative feedback on the issue of your changes to parentheticals for football players already at WT:CFB#Another issue with "American football" for the last 3-4 days, it now seems a bit disingenuous that you listed this move as an uncontroversial request. Independently, Johntex came to the same conclusion I did: *We should really stick with the simplest possible names. Virtually no one in the US says "football" when they mean "soccer". These teams in question are in the US and they call themselves "football" teams or "college football" teams, not "college American football" teams. Likewise, unless there is an American football player and a soccer player sharing the same name, we should stick to the simplest unambiguous name. In most cases, saying "football player" will accomplish this. Dekimasuよ! 14:40, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

Comment: In my opinion, the current name is slightly confusing, but we could simply use a version that would avoid these sorts of problems, like Wade Wilson (sport); for content, we've got the article, here we should simply avoid using potentially misleading titles.--Aldux 00:34, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

• The general consensus on this (which has been discussed at WP:NFL for example - is pretty much in line with WP:D. The problem is that football is not the same as American football. The agreement has been to move (football) to (American football) for that reason. Juan Miguel Fangio| ►Chat  23:38, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

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