Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2022 June 20

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June 20

Why do blocks often last 31 hours?

I've seen admins block for 31 hours. WP:31 says that this is to prevent them from coming back tomorrow and vandalizing, but is there any reason why it's 31, and not 30 or 32? weeklyd3 (message me | my contributions) 03:53, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

May because if it were 32 you'd ask why it's not 31 or 33? Bazza (talk) 08:33, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

If it were 32, I wouldn't complain as 32=2⁵ and 30 is a multiple of 10, but 31 seems an arbitrary number. —CX Zoom[he/him] ^{(let's talk • {C•X})} 08:44, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Also, suggesting to move to Wikipedia:Village pump (miscellaneous). This isn't really asking for help, is it? —CX Zoom[he/him] ^{(let's talk • {C•X})} 08:44, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

@Weeklyd3: This question was previously asked and answered at the Teahouse: see WP:Teahouse/Questions/Archive_872#Block length of 31 hours? Mike Turnbull (talk) 12:02, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

@CX Zoom 31 has the advantage of being a prime number. (Kidding) 73.127.147.187 (talk) 01:40, 21 June 2022 (UTC)

There's not really any 'magic' to it. The idea is that if someone has some sort of daily routine, the 31-hour block keeps them from resuming vandalism where they left off during the same 'session' the following day. (That is, if someone engaging in vandalism in school, then seven hours(-plus-a-day) later they'll be at home. Someone who screws around on Wikipedia at six o'clock after work will probably have gone to bed before their block expires. This reasoning also applied to anonymous (IP) vandalism, when the aim might be to head off vandalism from a school library or similar shared computing facility.

On a related theme, the 31-hour block is more likely to be noticed by the blocked editor, and more likely to draw a response from the blocked editor. They may be more likely to acknowledge a problem - and request an unblock, with a commitment to end their disruptive behavior - if they face losing their editing privileges for a second day.

As Bazza notes, it could have been 30 or 32 hours for the same purpose and similar effect. Which admin originally established the 31-hour tradition I couldn't tell you. There are regular mentions of 31-hour blocks on WP:AN(/I) running back to at least the beginning of 2006, and they seem to have been unremarkable even then. TenOfAllTrades(talk) 14:32, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

The first 31-hour-long block I can find is this. The first with a rationale similar to the above is this one. —Cryptic 10:14, 21 June 2022 (UTC)

Need help troubleshooting table sort

I can't figure out why this table here has one row (1.71m) sorted out of place for height. data-sort-type=number doesn't help. Anyone else able to identify the problem? —— 2406:3003:2077:1E60:D59D:E6EC:AEA9:4652 (talk) 03:59, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Seems to also affect articles for other seasons of the show: 2, 3, 4... always one row out of place, very odd. —— 2406:3003:2077:1E60:D59D:E6EC:AEA9:4652 (talk) 04:24, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

The use of Template:Height is adding extra information to some cells which is interfering with the sorting. I've added sort values to the affected cells which has made this work properly. Someone else might come up with a better explanation or solution. Bazza (talk) 11:39, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Among other things, Template:Height adds . Here is a simplified example using another templatestyles Template:Smallcaps/styles.css to show the problem is not in Template:Fraction/styles.css:

Height
3
2
1

It appears to happen for any templatestyles. It sorts correctly if the first and second row are swapped in the source:

Height
2
3
1

It looks like a bug in the table sorter. PrimeHunter (talk) 11:59, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

That's gotta be it. Had not suspected it since other cells with fraction values appeared to sort correctly. On closer inspection, in those Asia's next top model tables it's consistently only the first entry with fraction that doesn't work -- might be useful info for whoever has to debug this. {{Convert}} with |frac also won't work for the same reason, so workaround for now is to hack in data-sort-value on the afflicted cell, or use decimals instead of vulgar fractions. 2406:3003:2077:1E60:C998:20C6:8CCF:5730 (talk) 18:16, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

I reported this as phab:T311145. —TheDJ (talk • contribs) 14:39, 22 June 2022 (UTC)

Infobox is not working

Can someone fix the code on this link The infobox is not working

Thanks

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jordon_Hall — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nzs9 (talk • contribs) 06:10, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

@Nzs9: People may be happy to help, but you need to a bit of work yourself, like saying what's wrong with it. Bazza (talk) 08:43, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

The infobox wasn't displaying at the time of the post. It was fixed by adding a missing bracket.[1] PrimeHunter (talk) 10:53, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Although the bigger question is why this article as been re-created, 5 days after it was deleted by consensus. Joseph2302 (talk) 10:58, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

FYI

An admin has now re-deleted Jordon Hall. Mike Turnbull (talk) 11:53, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Why would you delete it? He's a professional footballer, makes no sense Nzs9 (talk) 12:01, 21 June 2022 (UTC)

@Nzs9: Please see Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Jordon Hall. FWIW, the former criterion of having made an appearance in a match between two professional sides is no longer valid. Eagleash (talk) 13:13, 21 June 2022 (UTC)

whats the criteria then lol Nzs9 (talk) 02:52, 23 June 2022 (UTC)

@Nzs9: The discussion linked to above pretty much details the needed coverage; I.e. WP:SPORTCRIT, WP:GNG, WP:SIGCOV, WP:BIO. In essence, in-depth coverage in multiple independent, reliable sources; not databases, fan-written sites without editorial oversight etc. Eagleash (talk) 03:57, 23 June 2022 (UTC)

Updating an SVG map

I just uploaded an updated SVG map of the countries with Ikea stores, but I'm unable to replace the old one as my account is quite new. Can anyone help me replace it? Thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Zingercombo86 (talk • contribs) 06:13, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

It's usually better to update the original file, under its original name, rather that create a split with an image with a new name, that way File:Map of IKEA stores.svg has a complete changelog in one place.- X201 (talk) 08:16, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Yes, but I can't even update the map due to my account being new. Zingercombo86 (talk) 20:02, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

The maps are likely not conformant with WP:ACCESSIBILITY. Bazza (talk) 08:30, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

I have uploaded the corrected version at the correct place, and nominated the second file for deletion.

Looking at it with the various filters of the color blindness empathy test, I can distinguish everything with any filter except in grayscale where yellow and gray are very close in luminosity. (But still slightly different; I have no idea whether people with total color blindness perceive luminosity the same way as I do with a grayscale filter on; maybe they perceive contrast better.) Not ideal, sure, but less of a deal than red-green issues. Tigraan^{Click here for my talk page ("private" contact)} 09:26, 23 June 2022 (UTC)

Jean Harlow

Your article says she was born in 1911, but that her father arranged her first marriage in 1908. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2603:8000:4E00:24A0:D53D:777F:3C63:4E68 (talk) 10:59, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Please bring this up at Talk:Jean Harlow. 331dot (talk) 11:01, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

No it doesn't, the infobox lists her first marriage as ​(m. 1927; div. 1929). If you're seeing this on a site that's not Wikipedia e.g. Google, then it's their responsibility to fix it. Joseph2302 (talk) 11:23, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Er, yes it does. In the article's second paragraph, after the lead: "In 1908, Skip Harlow arranged his daughter's marriage to Mont Clair Carpenter.". It looks like the article was subject to some unrepaired vandalism; I'll see if I can find the correct info. TenOfAllTrades(talk) 11:30, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Ah, I got it. The sentence is talking about Jean Harlow's mother - Jean Poe Harlow - not Jean Harlow herself. Skip Harlow was Jean Harlow's grandfather. Skip Harlow arranged the marriage of his underage daughter - Jean Poe, then 17 years old - to Mont Clair Carpenter. Jean Harlow (born Harlean Harlow Carpenter) was then born in 1911. TenOfAllTrades(talk) 11:44, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Jean Harlow#Early life says: "Her mother, Jean Poe Carpenter (née Harlow; 1891–1958), was the daughter of wealthy real estate broker Skip Harlow and his wife, Ella Harlow (née Williams). In 1908, Skip Harlow arranged his daughter's marriage to Mont Clair Carpenter." So the sentence is about the marriage of the subjects mother Jean Poe Carpenter. It gets a bit confusing because the mothers maiden name was Jean Harlow and the subject later used that as her own stage name instead of her birth name Harlean Harlow Carpenter. PrimeHunter (talk) 11:45, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

(Double edit conflict) It's the way the article is written. Its actually saying that Harlow's mother was forcibly married in 1908, which would tally with the 1911 birthdate for Harlow. - X201 (talk) 11:46, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Two points: Firstly, arranged marriages were/are not necessarily forced, and were and are common in many past and present cultures. Although the article says that Jean Poe Carpenter "grew resentful and unhappy in the marriage", it doesn't say that she was against the marriage in the first place. If references (such as the Stenn 1993 work cited for the article's relevant passage) say it was forced, perhaps the article should say so explicitly: otherwise "forced" (which the article doesn't state) is just speculation.

Secondly, she must have been either 16 or 17 at the time of the marriage: It seems unlikely that this was "underage" in Missouri at that date, where even today "With parental consent, a person can marry at 16". Perhaps someone with access to the cited source could check whether it actually says this, and if so what Stenn's rationale is. {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 90.201.73.64 (talk) 15:17, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

image uploading

i am facing problem in uploadig image to my article.when I click on point which is for image media hen after few seconds it appear

Failed to load the configuration for file uploads to the foreign file repository.

while when I tried to Wikipedia commons then

Running Windows Network Diagnostics Changing DNS over HTTPS settings DNS_PROBE_FINISHED_NXDOMAIN Check your DNS over HTTPS settings it appears.kindly help me in uploading image Ahsanfreelancer (talk) 12:19, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

@Ahsanfreelancer Hi there! What is the URL of the page that you're using to upload the image? GoingBatty (talk) 17:51, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

A Specific File

Is this file suitable for Wikimedia, and if so, under what license? User1042 (talk) 12:39, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Hello, User1042. If you open the "Ordering and Viewing Options" panel, it says

"Credit: Library and Archives Canada /

Restrictions on use: Nil

Copyright: Expired"

I beliieve this means that you can upload it to Commons as public domain. I believe you can use the template Commons:Template:PD-Canada. ColinFine (talk) 14:39, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

OK thanks! User1042 (talk) 15:07, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Two questions: please answer

So let's say someone asks a question or makes a request on a noticeboard or something but no one reponds and it is about to get (or is already) automatically archived. What would be the correct thing to do? Are there any good places to post elsewhere or rules about Template:pin section? I asked this earlier here but got no response. Should we make a page about that situation or add something about that to our current information pages?

Examples: [2] [3] (this page isn't watched that often it seems)

and also, why was my edit at m:Talk:Title blacklist reverted? is there any reason that page doesn't have an archive box?

67.21.154.193 (talk) 14:41, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Hello, IP editor. Volunteers answer questions that they freely choose to answer, and sometimes no one is interested. You can add a comment to delay the section from being archived. As for use of the template, just read the documentation. Personally, I never use that template. As for why your edit on Meta was reverted, ask the person who reverted you. This help desk is for English Wikipedia and volunteers here are not necessarily knowledgeable about Meta. The lack of an archive is presumably because no one has set one up. Cullen328 (talk) 15:26, 21 June 2022 (UTC)

Thanks. The page does have archives, however. Edit: I asked the guy. There was a notice on his talk page saying he was experiencing significant stress, but he has been replying on his talk page, so maybe we will see it.67.21.154.193 (talk) 16:16, 21 June 2022 (UTC)

@Cullen328: he reverted me. Twinkle, no explanation 67.21.154.193 (talk) 18:04, 21 June 2022 (UTC)

Having tried to add an archive interface and been reverted, and being brushed off by the reverter, you could try adding a discussion to the talk page about the idea of adding the box you want to. (Do you know that version works with that talk page?) - R. S. Shaw (talk) 22:03, 23 June 2022 (UTC)

British and American English Spellings

Hello, I came to the help desk because I was having some trouble trying to figure which spelling I should use for a page on A is for Allah. I noticed that there was a word spelled in British English, but there were no other words spelled that way. I was wondering if I should leave the British English spelling the way that it is or if I should change it to American English. My apologies if this is a frequently asked question.

sussybaka6000 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Sussybaka6000 (talk • contribs)

Sussybaka6000 the policy is at WP:ENGVAR. A is for Allah is an album by a British artist, released by a British label, so it has strong ties to the UK and should use British English. Generally a spelling variant should not be changed. TSventon (talk) 15:06, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Thank you for clarifying this for me and for providing me with the policy for spelling. Sussybaka6000 (talk) 15:13, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Just in case you run into this again, Sussybaka6000, there is a template {{Use British English}} (and other variants) that will often be found at the very top of articles when viewed in the source editor. These tend to get added to set a suggestion for later people to follow. That particular article wasn't tagged that way but is now.... Mike Turnbull (talk) 14:30, 22 June 2022 (UTC)

Manuel Belgrano

Sirs, "Serols" indicates me that my "recent contribution does not appear constructive". On the contrary, I find it highly constructive if you accept that a language must be as clear as possible. That "Serols" does not specify why my contribution is not constructive. Nevertheless, his point of view will be dully regarded. Regards. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.60.58.243 (talk) 15:09, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Hello 83.60.58.243, please note, Castilian is not a country, its a region in Spain. Regards --Serols (talk) 15:14, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Serols: but, more relevant, it is a dialect of Spanish, different from Catalan and from New World Spanish. Maproom (talk) 16:00, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Maproom but the corresponding sources for the changes are also missing, see here 1 2. US revolution is also not correct. --Serols (talk) 16:41, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

The issue is complicated further by the fact that Manuel Belgrano lived in the late 18th - early 19th century. This might mean that at the time regional variations of Spanish were more important that today. I know nothing about the subject, but according to Standard_Spanish#The_old_colonies_and_the_Royal_Spanish_Academy it seems the language was fixed in a standard form (in the old world anyway) during the 18th century.

At any rate, Serols, I think the canned templates left at User talk:83.60.58.243 were a bit harsh. I know those are automated and left by Huggle, but please remember that you are responsible for the edits you make through automated tools. Tigraan^{Click here for my talk page ("private" contact)} 10:26, 21 June 2022 (UTC)

Not a dialect; it is Spanish, the official language of Spain. Mathglot (talk) 01:58, 24 June 2022 (UTC)

IP 83.60.58.24, "Castilian" is just another word for the variety of Spanish that became the recognized and official one; i.e., "Castilian" and "Spanish" are synonyms. The word castellano is still used in Spain, but not so much in the Americas, but both terms designate the same language. But that's not the whole story; the other one is that you changed a template parameter, Spanish, which is recognized and is handled by template {{Family name hatnote}}, to the value Castilian, which is not a valid value for that template, resulting in a broken hatnote at the top of the article page. Hope this helps, Mathglot (talk) 01:24, 24 June 2022 (UTC)

ADA issue : Dark Mode?

Please how to turn on Dark Mode? I am legally blind and barely see the text in light mode. Is there a way to turn on the Dark Mode? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2603:9001:1E0C:7671:65CC:CAB8:C7EF:21EE (talk) 16:37, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

I hope this link: Wikipedia:Dark mode can be of some assistance. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 16:50, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

You may also want to try the (not specific to Wikipedia) browser extension Dark Reader, which usually works quite well on Wikipedia, in my experience. Rummskartoffel 20:01, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

American Comedian Jeff Klinger

To whom this may concern,

My boss, Jeffrey Klinger created a Wikipedia page in 2005 and it has recently disappeared. I would like to see how to recover the information so we don't have to create a new page. Thank you for any help.

Amber Phillips Executive Assistant to Jeffrey Klinger

Page created 2005 American Comedian Jeffrey Klinger Missing may 2022 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Amberpa820 (talk • contribs) 17:21, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Amberpa820 It would not be your "bosses wikipedia page" but a Wikipedia article about your boss. No article by the name Jeffrey Klinger has existed, in either the encyclopedia itself or in Draft space. Would it have been under another name? 331dot (talk) 17:26, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

@Amberpa820 and 331dot: An article about a American comedian named Jeff Klinger was deleted in 2020 - see Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Jeff Klinger. GoingBatty (talk) 17:48, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

GoingBatty I think we found it at the same time. :) 331dot (talk) 17:49, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

You all are amazing!! Amberpa820 (talk) 17:51, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Apologies, I have no idea what I am doing. American Comedian Jeff Klinger or Jeff Klinger American Comedian would have been the name. Amberpa820 (talk) 17:51, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Amberpa820 It was written in 2007, but there was an article at Jeff Klinger, deleted per this discussion. You can request that it be undeleted and moved to Draft space for further work at WP:REFUND. 331dot (talk) 17:48, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Thank you!! Amberpa820 (talk) 17:51, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Amberpa820, that deleted article was entirely unreferenced and therefore a policy violation. Please comply with the mandatory Paid contributions disclose. Cullen328 (talk) 18:57, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Hello, Amberpa820. It sounds as if you and your boss have a (very common) complete misunderstanding of what Wikipedia is. The article that was deleted did not belong to Klinger, and he should not have created it. If he meets Wikipedia's criteria for notability, then there could be an article about him. It would not belong to him or to you, he and you would not control its contents (though you would be welcome to suggest edits using the edit request mechanism), it should be based almost entirely on what people unconnected with him have chosen to publish about him, not on what he or his associates say or want to say. Promotion of any kind is forbidden anywhere on Wikipedia. If, given this information, you wish to go ahead and attempt the very difficult task of creating an article about him, you need to start by declaring your status as a paid editor, then read Your first article carefully. You will need to find several reliable sources, wholly unconnected with Klinger - reviews in quality papers might help, and then, having created a draft using the articles for creation mechanism, you would need to forget pretty well every thing you know about him, and write an article based purely on what those independent sources say about him. It is unlikely that the text of the deleted article would be of any help for you, because it is almost certainly based on what he knows and wants to say, and Wikipedia is basically not interested in what anybody wants to say about themselves. ColinFine (talk) 19:32, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Amberpa820 In addition to the good advice being given above, in general you can Google the subject's name with the word "Wiki" in the search string and sometimes a mirror sites comes up that made a copy of the article, but never deleted it. In this case, true to ColinFine's advice, there's almost nothing of use in the old article. TimTempleton ^{(talk) (cont)} 23:25, 22 June 2022 (UTC)

Account restart.

Help restarting my account. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 105.160.127.21 (talk) 17:46, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

It's difficult to help without knowing what your account is, but do you mean that you forgot the password? 331dot (talk) 17:49, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

Colour box border

Is it possible to change the thickness of a colour box border? For example, I would like to generate a colour box with a white background and 3px solid red border. Can I do this or are there alternatives? Thank you! Vesuvio14 (talk) 19:10, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

@Vesuvio14: Which feature are you trying to use and where? It appears to be about Template:Color box. That template doesn't currently have an option to change the border width. Where and how often do you want to do it? If it's just one place then it's easiest to make specific code there without using a template. Or you could use {{replace}} as a wrapper to modify the template output but such a solution can be unstable. {{replace|{{color box|white|text|black|border=red}}|1px|3px}} produces  text . PrimeHunter (talk) 19:56, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

@PrimeHunter: It is just one place. How would I make a specific code? Vesuvio14 (talk) 20:18, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

@Vesuvio14: One way is to enter code with {{color box}} at Special:ExpandTemplates and modify the result. PrimeHunter (talk) 20:26, 20 June 2022 (UTC)

@PrimeHunter: Thank you so much! I would never have come across that tool. Worked a treat! Vesuvio14 (talk) 20:34, 20 June 2022 (UTC)