Talk:2024 East–West MRT line disruption

Requested move 27 September 2024

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: moved. (closed by non-admin page mover) Bensci54 (talk) 16:48, 4 October 2024 (UTC)

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September 2024 East–West MRT line disruption → 2024 East–West MRT line disruption – While there are other train disruptions in 2024 (like a lightning strike on another line, most of the rest, if any, and if not all, are minor and likely not notable by our standards here. Therefore proposing the removal of the month here. Furthermore, adding the hyphen for consistency with the parent topic, East–West MRT line. – robertsky (talk) 05:17, 27 September 2024 (UTC)

I might keep the month but would add the dash. Also depends on how news sources would describe the incident.--ZKang123 (talk) 09:42, 27 September 2024 (UTC)

Comment: I would like to further propose that the word disruption be changed to derailment since the derailment was the main part of the incident that then led to all the subsequent damages and disruptions. Pentagon 2057 (T/C) 10:02, 27 September 2024 (UTC)

I have personally not named it derailment until news reports confirmed it is a derailment. There seems to be a lot of speculation of details.--ZKang123 (talk) 10:03, 27 September 2024 (UTC)

I would say that while I personally off-wiki would've called it a derailment (I mean we've seen the videos and photos), from a Wikipedia POV I agree with ZKang that if no reliable sources call it a derailment, we can't call it one either, because that would be original research. However, there is an SCMP article that calls it a "derailment" [1], and ST has said that a train bogie "derailed" as well [2][3], which might help Pentagon's case for calling it a "derailment". S5A-0043^Talk 10:47, 27 September 2024 (UTC)

The ST articles on the incident calls it a "disruption" in the headlines as well as most news sources such as AsiaOne, CNA, and the Business Times. Even though the train did technically derail, I think calling it a 'derailment' would give people the impression that the train flipped over when it came off the tracks. Furthermore, the articles covering the incident focused more on the impacts of the incident rather than the cause Imbluey2. Please ping me so that I get notified of your response 12:47, 27 September 2024 (UTC)

Oppose: I wouldn't keep the month unless there was a similar incident that occured a month after the previous incident. However, I agree with the dash Imbluey2. Please ping me so that I get notified of your response 12:53, 27 September 2024 (UTC)

you are opposing to keeping the month or? 🤔 – robertsky (talk) 13:28, 27 September 2024 (UTC)

Well for now unless if there was another accident that just so happened to occur on the EWL in 2024. I probably should have changed it to "Oppose to keeping the month" Imbluey2. Please ping me so that I get notified of your response 13:46, 27 September 2024 (UTC)

• Suggest renaming to 'September 2024 East–West MRT line disruption → Dover train derailment. To be consistent with previous incidents, and let's call it what it really is. The derailment started at Dover station and is responsible for causing all the subsequent damage [4]. Dover so that it won't be confused with the Clementi rail accident. - Mailer Diablo 11:50, 29 September 2024 (UTC)

  @Mailer diablo I would agree since it does provide clarity but I think calling "Dover train derailment" would make people assume that accident happened in Dover, England, despite occurring near Dover station in Singapore. Imbluey2. Please ping me so that I get notified of your response 12:51, 29 September 2024 (UTC)

  Or Ulu Pandan, where the train finally stalled. Either is fine. - Mailer Diablo 00:00, 30 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support to 2024 East-West MRT line derailment or 2024 East-West MRT line disruption only. The month is unnecessary disambiguation for an already non-ambiguous title - unless you're expecting another EWL derailment this year? I think the title "Dover train derailment" is more ambiguous than necessary, and the absence of a year seems to inflate its significance beyond reasonable. The Clementi rail accident was a major transport crisis event with injuries to over 150 people, whereas there has only been service disruptions caused by this derailment. Tim (Talk) 23:02, 29 September 2024 (UTC)

• Disruptions can also happen on the EWL in other months too, it doesn't just happen once a year. If we can't call it derailment, then I would call notability into question and it won't be long before it ends up on AfD. Singapore Airlines Flight 368 was deleted for something similar - big incident but no deaths = not notable. - Mailer Diablo 23:55, 29 September 2024 (UTC)

• From what I can tell, reading an archived version of the page, the impact was rather limited. Actually I myself was hesitant whether to start this article until the disruption was prolonged and there's quite a substantial impact, so I decided to start the article.--ZKang123 (talk) 03:23, 1 October 2024 (UTC)

• If there is another disruption on this one specific line that happens in the next ~2 months that is notable enough for its own Wikipedia article, we can always loop back and move but again, I'm happy to go with derailment - nothing is permanent :) Also, the title of the article isn't the basis of determining notability. Tim (Talk) 03:28, 30 September 2024 (UTC)

  @ItsPugle, @Mailer diablo I've changed my mind, I agree. Let's change it to 'derailment'. Imbluey2. Please ping me so that I get notified of your response 10:00, 30 September 2024 (UTC)

• Support moving to 2024 East-West MRT line disruption. I’d be a little more tentative to change to derailment exclusively since no major news article titles reference the derailment. I’d be less concerned about ending up on AfD though, @Mailer diablo - articles like Bishan MRT tunnel flooding are still up and investigation is ongoing. FamiliarFlareon (talk) 23:57, 1 October 2024 (UTC)

• Unfortunately I wouldn't rule out the possibility that the Bishan flooding won't survive an AfD either with today's standards. - Mailer Diablo 15:42, 2 October 2024 (UTC)

  There's more than enough coverage to push it above WP:NEVENTS that are not WP:PRIMARYNEWS: [5][6][7][8][9]. In any case, if there's debate about whether the flooding can survive AFD, it should be done at AFD itself, not on the talk page of a (somewhat) unrelated article. I rest my case. S5A-0043^Talk 08:44, 3 October 2024 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Help to update

@Imbluey2: Are you able to help update the page? Especially the details of the event. Sorry, been a bit busy lately.

• Timeline given to parliament
• Chee's statement

--ZKang123 (talk) 02:04, 16 October 2024 (UTC)

Sure. The PSLE part needs updating as well. Imbluey2. Please ping me so that I get notified of your response 03:31, 16 October 2024 (UTC)