Talk:3''-deamino-3''-oxonicotianamine reductase

Requested move 28 December 2023

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Moved to 3''-deamino-3''-oxonicotianamine reductase (i.e. from a double quote mark to a pair of apostrophes). Editors supported a pair of characters instead of a double quote or double prime character. There is no consensus at this time to switch to prime characters, in light of Talk:1,1'-Bis(diphenylphosphino)ferrocene#Requested_move_4_January_2024. (closed by non-admin page mover) Adumbrativus (talk) 05:14, 2 February 2024 (UTC)

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3"-deamino-3"-oxonicotianamine reductase → 3″-deamino-3″-oxonicotianamine reductase – The current title is using quote marks, not double primes or pairs of single primes or apostrophes. I'm not an expert on enzymes, but I'm pretty sure a quote mark is not proper. What is the usual convention on Wikipedia in such situations? —⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 17:50, 28 December 2023 (UTC) — Relisting. Vanderwaalforces (talk) 13:02, 11 January 2024 (UTC) — Relisting.  — Amakuru (talk) 14:08, 19 January 2024 (UTC)

• Also Flavanone 7-O-glucoside 2"-O-beta-L-rhamnosyltransferase, Gentamicin 2"-nucleotidyltransferase, Isoflavone-7-O-beta-glucoside 6"-O-malonyltransferase, Luteolin-7-O-glucuronide 2"-O-glucuronosyltransferase, Streptomycin 3"-adenylyltransferase, Streptomycin 3"-kinase, and Vitexin 2"-O-rhamnoside 7-O-methyltransferase. —⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 19:27, 30 December 2023 (UTC)
• I have put a notice at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Molecular Biology and on the article talk pages of all of the articles listed above, to encourage participation in this discussion. —⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 02:09, 31 December 2023 (UTC)

The enzyme is named after its substrate and as you might expect should follow IUPAC nomenclatures rules, which use the prime character (link to IUPAC blue book for examples). The suggested title uses two double prime characters and I'd say it should use four single prime characters as the html version of the Blue book does, but this level of detail is not described in the book. Perhaps whatever looks better in the title section should be used, but sticking to single primes would save the effort in figuring out what the double/triple prime characters are (″, ‴) and whether they're being used properly in titles. Here, single prime characters looks like: 3ʹʹ-deamino-3ʹʹ-oxonicotianamine reductase. Essentially identical on my screen. I wouldn't know how to test what it would look like as a title. ― Synpath 07:09, 31 December 2023 (UTC)

If the accepted convention is to use single-prime characters, then I suggest to do that on Wikipedia, so move to 3ʹʹ-deamino-3ʹʹ-oxonicotianamine reductase. —⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 16:02, 31 December 2023 (UTC)

Circling back to link the WP:OCHEMNAME guideline and the WP:MCBMOS essay, as what I find as the most relevant pages for the move. I support similar moves for the other listed articles as well. ― Synpath 17:31, 3 January 2024 (UTC)

There are two issues here. One is two singlecharacters (could just as well be straight apostrophe) vs a double-character (here a straight quote-mark). I support that. Separately is using prime-characters specifically, which I object to this local discussion because it is much broader scope than just a few enzyme pages (as for example has been expanded to Talk:1,1'-Bis(diphenylphosphino)ferrocene#Requested move 4 January 2024), and as you note the enzymes are just building on the substrate-chemicals. DMacks (talk) 19:40, 4 January 2024 (UTC)

Relisting comment: Consensus is yet to be established. Vanderwaalforces (talk) 13:02, 11 January 2024 (UTC)

The Talk:1,1'-Bis(diphenylphosphino)ferrocene discussion (use of prime rarther than appostrophe) was well-attended and has been closed not moved. Therefore, this should not get out of sync with that. DMacks (talk) 18:19, 11 January 2024 (UTC)

• Relisting comment - it would be good to get a definitive consensus for something here, rather than drifting into no consensus as it happening at present.  — Amakuru (talk) 14:08, 19 January 2024 (UTC)
• Suggestion: If we can't agree to use primes (or double primes), I suggest at least a move from the quote-mark titles to doubled apostrophe titles, since one aspect seems agreed (per above comment by User:DMacks), as follows:

  3"-deamino-3"-oxonicotianamine reductase → 3''-deamino-3''-oxonicotianamine reductase

  Flavanone 7-O-glucoside 2"-O-beta-L-rhamnosyltransferase → Flavanone 7-O-glucoside 2''-O-beta-L-rhamnosyltransferase

  Gentamicin 2"-nucleotidyltransferase → Gentamicin 2''-nucleotidyltransferase

  Isoflavone-7-O-beta-glucoside 6"-O-malonyltransferase → Isoflavone-7-O-beta-glucoside 6''-O-malonyltransferase

  Luteolin-7-O-glucuronide 2"-O-glucuronosyltransferase → Luteolin-7-O-glucuronide 2''-O-glucuronosyltransferase

  Streptomycin 3"-adenylyltransferase → Streptomycin 3''-adenylyltransferase

  Streptomycin 3"-kinase → Streptomycin 3''-kinase

  Vitexin 2"-O-rhamnoside 7-O-methyltransferase → Vitexin 2''-O-rhamnoside 7-O-methyltransferase

—⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 18:34, 19 January 2024 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.