Talk:4 Da Gang

Requested move 26 October 2022

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

No consensus to move. After much-extended time for discussion, there is no consensus for a move at this time. BD2412 T 02:35, 27 November 2022 (UTC)

4 Da Gang → 4 da Gang – lowercase, as "the" would be 162 etc. (talk) 05:42, 24 October 2022 (UTC) This is a contested technical request (permalink). Steel1943 (talk) 02:21, 26 October 2022 (UTC) — Relisting. — Ceso femmuin mbolgaig mbung, mellohi! (投稿) 04:26, 3 November 2022 (UTC) — Relisting. — Shibbolethink ^{(♔ ♕)} 16:23, 10 November 2022 (UTC)

I'm contesting this, as a quick Google search shows a mix of upper and lower, though predominantly upper. - UtherSRG (talk)

For titles, we would usually follow MOS:TITLECAPS and WP:NCCAPS, which state that short articles like "the" (or in this case, "da") are in lowercase. 162 etc. (talk) 19:20, 25 October 2022 (UTC)

Key word is usually. I think this needs to go to a formal RM. - UtherSRG (talk) 19:25, 25 October 2022 (UTC)

• Weak oppose due to the combination of the ambiguity of if MOS:TITLECAPS and WP:NCCAPS would apply here due to the ambiguity of the interpretation of the word "Da", and per the comment regarding sources primarily using the capitalized "Da". Steel1943 (talk) 02:21, 26 October 2022 (UTC)

@162 etc. and UtherSRG: Ping current participants. Steel1943 (talk) 02:38, 26 October 2022 (UTC)

• Oppose - the group and seemingly the majority of the media use the uppercase. While usually we would apply the lowercase, the use of the uppercase in sources (used or potentially usable) pushes for the alternative. - UtherSRG (talk) 10:41, 26 October 2022 (UTC)
• Comment I'll note the use of lowercase in titles such as In da Club, In da Getto, In da Name of Love, In da Wind, Who's da Man, Who's da Killer?... 162 etc. (talk) 16:16, 26 October 2022 (UTC)

Relisting comment: Does article-capitalisation rules apply if the definite article is fancifully spelled? — Ceso femmuin mbolgaig mbung, mellohi! (投稿) 04:26, 3 November 2022 (UTC)

• Support. WP does not capitalize the definite or indefinite articles in mid-phrase, and there is no reason that would not apply to alternative spellings of them. Also support to be WP:CONSISTENT with all the other "da" titles reported by 162 etc., above.  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  19:42, 5 November 2022 (UTC)
• Support—treatment of foreign-language items is sometimes difficult for policy; but here it looks like a straightforward case. Tony (talk) 01:27, 6 November 2022 (UTC)
• Support per MOS:CT. Darkday (talk) 21:31, 8 November 2022 (UTC)
• Oppose. Uppercase is used by the group and most media and can be seen in the use of uppercase and smallcaps in the cover art. Consistency with sources makes the uppercase "Da" appropriate (Recognizability and Naturalness). The song's title is already highly stylized with its own conventions, so insisting on particular formal rules of style seems out of place. Hydrangeans (she/her | talk | edits) 07:03, 9 November 2022 (UTC)

Relisting comment: to generate a more thorough consensus and to see how naive participants feel about WP:COMMONNAME vs MOS:NCCAPS — Shibbolethink ^{(♔ ♕)} 16:23, 10 November 2022 (UTC)

Note: WikiProject Hip hop has been notified of this discussion. — Shibbolethink ^{(♔ ♕)} 16:24, 10 November 2022 (UTC)

Note: WikiProject Songs has been notified of this discussion. — Shibbolethink ^{(♔ ♕)} 16:24, 10 November 2022 (UTC)

• Support - "da" = "the" ~ Hiddenstranger (talk) 23:52, 16 November 2022 (UTC)
• Oppose per MOS:CAPS' criterion of "consistently capitalized in reliable sources". If there are reliable sources that don't cap it, I've not found them. Dicklyon (talk) 04:50, 25 November 2022 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Follow-up comment: See Talk:Neo da Matrix#Requested move 7 December 2023 and its discussion of MOS:THEMUSIC. —⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 20:19, 10 December 2023 (UTC)