Talk:A Written Testimony

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Cwmhiraeth (talk) 07:11, 15 February 2020 (UTC)

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• ... rapper Jay Electronica began recording for his debut album A Written Testimony in December 2019, despite announcing a sequel to his debut project thirteen years ago?

• Reviewed: Reynhard Sinaga

Created/expanded by Nice4What (talk). Self-nominated at 13:24, 8 February 2020 (UTC).

• New enough (started Feb 7), long enough if only barely (1,560 characters), neutral, solidly cited, and free from copyvio issues/no close paraphrasing detected on spotcheck. Hook is short enough (173 characters) and interesting enough to a broad audience. Hook has two parts: that a sequel was announced in 2007 (stated in article, cited to source 2, mentioned in source 2) and that the new album began recording December 2019, (stated in article, cited to claims made by Jay Electronic as cited in source 6). However, per DYK guidelines, the sentence in the article from which the hook pulls its information needs to be followed directly by a citation, so ref 6 needs to be duplicated at the end of "beginning on December 26, 2020." (Also, I assume this is just a typo but that should be December 26, 2019, should it not?) QPQ technically done, no image to worry about. I might also suggest changing "debut project" in the hook to "first mixtape" to 1) decrease the repition of the word "debut" in the hook and 2) clarify what that initial project actually was. Nice4What, close, just a little bit still to do. —Collin^{t c} 15:53, 8 February 2020 (UTC)

@Bobamnertiopsis: Does this sound better? ALT1: "... rapper Jay Electronica began recording for his debut album A Written Testimony in December 2019, despite announcing a sequel to his first mixtape thirteen years ago?" Nice4What (talk · contribs) – (Don't forget to share a Thanks ♥) 16:42, 8 February 2020 (UTC)

Yep, looks good! Hook fact cited to 6 now and ALT1 looks good! —Collin^{t c} 02:21, 9 February 2020 (UTC)

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:A Written Testimony/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Kyle Peake (talk · contribs) 10:44, 25 May 2020 (UTC)

Good Article review progress box

Criteria: 1a. prose () 1b. MoS () 2a. ref layout () 2b. cites WP:RS () 2c. no WP:OR () 2d. no WP:CV () 3a. broadness () 3b. focus () 4. neutral () 5. stable () 6a. free or tagged images () 6b. pics relevant () Note: this represents where the article stands relative to the Good Article criteria. Criteria marked are unassessed

So we meet again... will review this article shortly. --Kyle Peake (talk) 10:44, 25 May 2020 (UTC)

Infobox and lead

• Switch hlist to being in * instead, since the former is not allowed to be used anymore
• Wikilink Arabic to itself instead of the redirect target
• Shouldn't the single release date be mentioned, not the non-single date?
• Wikilink Arabic to itself
• "follows the release of his debut mixtape" → "follows the release of Jay Electronica's debut mixtape" since we haven't said his name for two sentences
• "It was primarily recorded" → "The former was primarily recorded"
• "with Jay-Z and The-Dream" → "featuring vocals from Jay-Z and The-Dream"
• "Most of the album's tracks" → "Most of the tracks on A Written Testimony"
• "The album was met with widespread acclaim from critics" → "The album received widespread acclaim from music critics"
• Think you could add a bit in the sentence about what was praised often?
• Change anti-Semitic target to Antisemitism
• "A Written Testimony debuted at number twelve" → "It debuted at number 12" or could end up as "The former debuted" depending on how you change reception
  •  Done Languages kept with hlist because it doesn't work with *. Nice4What (talk · contribs) – (Thanks ♥) 13:33, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Background and recording

• On img: "on eight of the album's ten tracks" → "on 8 of the album's 10 tracks" per MOS:NUM advice on comparative values
• "Jay Electronica's debut project" → "Jay Electronica's debut mixtape"
• "with the follow-up being entitled" → "with the follow-up being set to be entitled" since it was never actually released but this change is not WP:OR
• "In September 2007," → "In September of that year,"
• "he planned to create" → "he planned to create both"
• Target Christmas Day to Christmas instead
• Introduce Just Blaze as an American record producer
• "confirmed that the album would miss this date" → "confirmed shortly later that the album would miss that date"
• "his birthday September 19, 2010" → "his birthday, September 19, within that year" since you need to separate for showing the birth date properly and 2010 has been stated already within this sentence
• "he signed to" → "Jay Electronica signed to"
• Mention Jay-Z as who signed him in this sentence briefly
• "Jay Electronica announced that" → "The former announced that"
• "shared a track list in 2012" → "shared a track list the following year"
• "Jay-Z, fellow American rappers" → "Jay-Z, fellow rappers" since no new nationality implies they're American
• "The album was never" → "The album was ultimately never"
• "on his album after" → "on his album, after"
• Mention that Hall of Fame is an album by Big Sean
• Target promotional single to Promotional recording
• "controversial verse for the song" → "controversial verse for it"
• "In 2017, he denounced the traditional roll-out of studio albums, stating" → "He denounced the traditional roll-out of studio albums in 2017, stating" to avoid too many sentences beginning with "In"
• "that he completed his debut album" → "that he had completed his debut studio album," since this is the best place to introduce the "studio album" term
• ""The Neverending Story" was" → "The track "The Neverending Story" was"
• "A Written Testimony as a result of a trip he took to Argentina with American rapper Eminem" → "A Written Testimony, as a result of a trip he took to Argentina with rapper Eminem" and make sure to remove the wikilink on Argentina as it is too obvious
• "the final track "A.P.I.D.T.A." on" → "the final track, "A.P.I.D.T.A.", on"
• "40 days after recording" → "which was 40 days after recording" to specify the meaning
• "to the album and that" → "to the album and"
  •  Done Note that I used the term "studio album" twice, first to refer to Hall of Fame. Is that alright? Nice4What (talk · contribs) – (Thanks ♥) 17:59, 27 May 2020 (UTC)
    • Yeah that's fine. --Kyle Peake (talk) 07:22, 28 May 2020 (UTC)

Music and composition

• Mention the sampled track's position on the album
• Wikilink refrain to itself
• "to Jay Electronica's earlier discography due to its" → "to Jay Electronica's earlier releases, due to the"
• "It incorporates ambient music, soul music, and samples of pop music." → "The album incorporates elements of ambient and soul music, and samples of pop music."
• AllMusic shouldn't have a space in it
• "the evolution of hip-hop"." → "the evolution of hip-hop.""
• "the album's "unorthodox sonic tapestries"." → "the "unorthodox sonic tapestries" of A Written Testimony"
• "uncredited appearance on eight out of ten tracks" → "uncredited appearances on 8 out of 10 tracks"
• "with Kanye West" → "with West"
• [18][22] should both only be invoked at the end of the sentence
• Wikilink Arabic to itself
• "throughout the album" → "throughout A Written Testimony"
• Introduce J Dilla as an American record producer
• "The latter sampled" → "The latter samples"
• "as a "a somber" → "as including "a somber"
• Remove target on Alchemist as you have already done that in the article
• "piano-laced Alchemist beat"." → "piano-laced Alchemist beat.""
• Target jazz to Jazz music
• "Vashti Bunyan and echoed vocals by" → "Vashti Bunyan, and echoed vocals by"
• "has been described as chaotic and messy.[13][14] It is built on a sped-up sample of Barbadian singer Rihanna.[14]" → "has been described as chaotic and messy, with the track being built on a sped-up sample of Barbadian singer Rihanna.[13][14]"
  •  Done Nice4What (talk · contribs) – (Thanks ♥) 15:26, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Themes and lyrics

• Mention the sampled track's position on the album
• "back-and-forth delivery has" → "back-and-forth delivery on the song has"
• Just keep as Kanye West without the introduction
• Put [21][26] both at the end of the first sentence
• "who appears throughout" → "the latter of which appears throughout"
• "as the album's opening" → "as the opening to A Written Testimony"
• "his own self-doubt while" → "his own self-doubt, while"
• God should be capitalised and wikilinked to itself
• "who suffered before them" → "who experienced unjustified suffering" since the source says nothing about those two suffering themselves
• Target skeptics to Skepticism
• "and aspirational.".[17]" → "and aspirational."[17]"
• "He opens on" → "He has the opening lines on"
• "and the former as prophets, rapping" → "and the former as prophets within the song, rapping:" and make sure to wikilink like I did here
• "Jay Electronica makes a tongue-in-cheek" → "the former makes a tongue-in-cheek"
• "in releasing his debut album, which took nearly thirteen years" → "in releasing A Written Testimony, which took nearly 13 years" since we know it's his debut already
• [21][19] put in numerical order
• "explained that he and Jay-Z" → "explained that him and Jay-Z"
• "His verse is based on advice given to him by Sean Combs" → "The former's verse is based on advice given to him by Combs"
• Wikilink political to Political hip hop
• "is due to Allah"." → "is due to Allah.""
• Put [14][17][26] at the end of the last sentence in this order
  •  Done However, I did not wikilink/capitalize god because the Pitchfork article isn't talking about God proper. Nice4What (talk · contribs) – (Thanks ♥) 16:33, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Release and promotion

• "parties for the album were" → "parties for A Written Testimony were" on the img text
• "with a March 18, 2020 release date" → "with a release date of that year's March 18"
• "in the studio with Jay Electronica" → "in the studio with the aforementioned" since you don't want to say his name too much but can't state the former
• "Jay-Z and Lawrence "Law" Parker" → "Jay-Z, and Lawrence "Law" Parker"
• Add Streaming media target on streaming service
• "three listening parties for the album" → "three listening parties for it"
• "parties on March 12" → "parties on March 12 of that year"
• "the album would be released on March 13, 2020 after the listening parties" → "A Written Testimony would be released the day after the listening parties"
• Remove Arabic language wikilink
• "included ten tracks with" → "includes 10 tracks, with"
• "on "Ezekiel's Wheel" and "Shiny Suit Theory"" → "on "Ezekiel's Wheel", as well as "Shiny Suit Theory""
• "Tidal revealed the album's cover art" → "Tidal simultaneously revealed the album's cover art
• "The cover art was photographed" → "The artwork was photographed"
• "previewed the album prior to its release through" → "previewed A Written Testimony prior to its release, via"
• Remove wikilink on Instagram
  •  Done Nice4What (talk · contribs) – (Thanks ♥) 16:38, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Singles

• This doesn't require its own sub-section as the section is only one para and there's just the one single that was released
• Mention the exact release date of the song and that it features vocals from The-Dream too (in the first sentence for both I mean)
• ""Dinner at Tiffanys (The Shiny Suit Theory)" featuring" → ""Dinner at Tiffanys (The Shiny Suit Theory)", featuring"
• "Jay-Z and The-Dream" → "Jay-Z, and The-Dream"
• Target string arrangement to String section
• "by Gainsbourg with production from" → "by Gainsbourg and production from"
• "remastered discography onto YouTube" → "remastered discography to YouTube"
• Mention the fact that it was released as a single in September 2018 and instate the exact date too.
  •  Done Nice4What (talk · contribs) – (Thanks ♥) 15:06, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Controversy

• This section belongs in-between Critical reception and Commercial performance
• "Jay Electronica had previously rapped" → "The former had previously rapped"
• Why does it say "also been" when she is mentioned as being accused sooner than Jay is? Either switch the order or remove "also" from prose.
• Target anti-Semitic to Antisemitism
• "Jay Electronica responded by accusing" → "He responded by accusing"
• "and invited him to a" → "and inviting him to a"
• Target public forum to Forum (legal)
• "on the album" → "on A Written Testimony"
• Target Complex to Complex Networks (company)
• "but that Jay Electronica was" → "though Jay Electronica was"
• Mention why The Jewish Chronicle noted the lyrics; i.e, the connection it has to the other ones written out somehow
• [39][40] should both be at the end of the sentence
• "has also been previously cautioned" → "had also been previously cautioned"
• "got smacked around by JAY-Z"." → "got smacked around by JAY-Z.""
• "Jay Electronica praising Budden" → "him praising Budden"
  •  Done Added that Harpin also discussed Farrakhan. I did not change "but that Jay Electronica was" to "though Jay Electronica was" because that would change the intent of the sentence. Nice4What (talk · contribs) – (Thanks ♥) 13:56, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Critical reception

• Change 4.0/5 to 4/5 for the HipHopDX review
• "was met with widespread acclaim from critics" → "was met with widespread acclaim from music critics"
• "this release received an" → "the album received an"
• "Rashad Grove of Consequence of Sound praised" → "Grove praised" as we already know who he is
• "worth the wait"," → "worth the wait,""
• "on Only Built 4 Cuban Linx"," → "on Only Built 4 Cuban Linx,""
  •  Done Nice4What (talk · contribs) – (Thanks ♥) 15:09, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Accolades

• Since it's only one accolade and there are no negative reviews to separate from, this sub-section is not needed; keep the wording the exact same but place it directly after NME review in the same para
  •  Done Nice4What (talk · contribs) – (Thanks ♥) 15:09, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Commercial performance

• There's some strong issues with the first three sentences right now; I'll address below
• Start with "A Written Testimony debuted at number 12 on the US Billboard 200 with over 31,000 album-equivalent units, of which nearly 11,000 were pure sales." and place the appropriate refs both at the end of this beginning sentence
• Change the second sentence to "It peaked at number eight and four on the US Top R&B/Hip-Hop Albums and Album Sales charts, respectively." with the appropriate refs
• So the first three sentences will be down to two sentences, though the rest can remain as sentences but I have fixes listed below.
• "It peaked at number 43 on the Billboard Canadian Albums" → "The album reached number 43 on the Billboard Canadian Albums chart"
• Either put "numbers" instead of "number" on this occasion or put the latter term before each listed number for the stats that succeed the above.
• Also, put the Canadian Albums ref straight after the comma in this sentence but keep the other three refs at the very end.
• Name the Switzerland and Belgium charts, with the targets.
• "peaked at number 9" → "peaked at number nine"
  •  Done

Track listing

• Target Eric Demarsan to Éric Demarsan
• Add a ref to verify Jay-Z's uncredited vocals at the end of the sentence
  •  Done Removed the note about Jay-Z because there's no source that explicitly singles out these two tracks. I believe the body sufficiently explains Jay-Z's contributions to the album. Nice4What (talk · contribs) – (Thanks ♥) 15:15, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Personnel

Musicians

• Good

Technical

• What track(s) did Tony Dawsey contribute mastering engineering to?
  •  Done All tracks but the intro. Nice4What (talk · contribs) – (Thanks ♥) 15:11, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Charts

• Use the proper album chart sourcing for the Canada peak
  •  Done Nice4What (talk · contribs) – (Thanks ♥) 18:30, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Notes

• Add a ref at the end of the note verifying this
  •  Done Dropped "November" because the source implies that the song could've been recorded as early as September when the birthday party took place. Nice4What (talk · contribs) – (Thanks ♥) 18:34, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

References

• To avoid confusion since refs may likely be switched, these suggestions are from [this revision.
• Copyvio score looks good, is flagged as high for one source but that one isn't cited in this article so it's purely a coincidence.
  • I just looked over the source marked at 71.5% and I can tell that it copied text directly from the "Controversy" subsection. Nice4What (talk · contribs) – (Thanks ♥) 13:39, 27 May 2020 (UTC)
• Make sure that all of the refs cite authors in the same order, rather than some citing last names first when the majority don't.
  •  Done Nice4What (talk · contribs) – (Thanks ♥) 17:24, 27 May 2020 (UTC)
• Target Complex to Complex Networks (company)
• Genius should be cited as publisher instead for refs 6, 10, 15 and 33
• Remove wikilinks for Pitchfork on refs 7, 24 and 26
• Cite Pitchfork as the website for ref 9 with no wikilink per WP:OVERLINK
• Remove wikilinks for Genius on refs 10, 15 and 33
• Remove wikilinks for Complex on refs 11, 28, 31, 34, 35 and 38
• Cite AllHipHop as publisher instead for ref 12 with the wikilink
• Okayplayer should be cited as a publisher instead for refs 17 and 42; solely wikilink on the former.
• Pitchfork should not be included in the title of ref 24
• Remove wikilinks for Billboard on refs 29, 51 and 57
• Cite YouTube as publisher instead for ref 30 and keep the wikilink
• Cite Complex as website instead for ref 31
• Cite HipHop-N-More as website instead for ref 37
• Cite Southern Poverty Law Center as publisher instead for ref 40 and remove Southern Poverty Law Center from the title.
• Okayplayer should not be OkayPlayer on ref 42; change to the former instead.
  •  Done All the above. Nice4What (talk · contribs) – (Thanks ♥) 17:46, 27 May 2020 (UTC)
• Refs 49, 50, 54, 55 and 56 should be used from ref names cited inside the chart table instead.
• Ref 60 is a useless duplicate; delete it and replace the Canada chart table info how I said to in the section advice.
  • @Kyle Peake: How do I access the ref names from the chart templates? And what is the appropriate source for the Canadian charts? I had used what was at Jay Electronica discography. Nice4What (talk · contribs) – (Thanks ♥) 17:46, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

@Nice4What: See Fortune (Chris Brown album) for an example of ref names from chart tables; also the source is reliable, but keep it solely in the Commercial performance and cite Billboard for Canada in the chart table's formatting. --Kyle Peake (talk) 18:00, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

What I was trying to point out is that there has to be duplicate references. For example, the Fortune article has Billboard 200 cited twice, one for Commercial performance and the other for Charts. Nice4What (talk · contribs) – (Thanks ♥) 18:22, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

Nice4What But those are not exact duplicate refs; you can cite the chart history from the table using a ref name. --Kyle Peake (talk) 07:22, 28 May 2020 (UTC)

I'm doing what was done on the Fortune article, still two references. Look at the Canadian album, it's both Ref 53 and 60. I used the <ref name="CanadianAlbums"> opening, but it renders no difference. Nice4What (talk · contribs) – (Thanks ♥) 16:07, 28 May 2020 (UTC)

 Done the fix for you. --Kyle Peake (talk) 19:53, 28 May 2020 (UTC)

Thank you! Nice4What (talk · contribs) – (Thanks ♥) 20:00, 28 May 2020 (UTC)

Final comments and verdict

• These are my initial comments, you are free to respond to them right now, but there's still more to come definitely. --Kyle Peake (talk) 07:50, 26 May 2020 (UTC)

•  On hold for now, good work but needs some changes before it's a GA. --Kyle Peake (talk) 16:17, 26 May 2020 (UTC)

• @Kyle Peake: I think I've done everything, let me know what else I might need to do. Thanks. Nice4What (talk · contribs) – (Thanks ♥) 18:35, 27 May 2020 (UTC)

• @Nice4What: ✓ Pass for this now! --Kyle Peake (talk) 19:53, 28 May 2020 (UTC)