Talk:Transport UK London Bus

This article

The following discussion is an archived debate from Talk:Travel London. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made below.

After saying they would keep the old name, NedRailways have decided to rebrand Travel London and Travel Surrey as "Abellio London" and "Abellio Surrey". However, the website just shows Abellio, and the URL is www.abellio.co.uk. It also looks like the bus fleetname will be just "Abellio". I therefore suggest creating a new article called Abellio, where both the London and Surrey operations can be detailed, rather than moving. This is also because the Travel London name is very complex, with it appearing in London two times before dieing out, and only staying successfully on the third time. Moving will therefore just confuse the matters. Any other ideas? Arriva436^{talk/contribs} 18:53, 30 October 2009 (UTC)

I think we should move both Travel London and Travel Surrey to Abellio London and Abellio Surrey.C.bonnick (talk) 13:23, 31 October 2009 (UTC)

But that would just cause confusion. There are a number of reasons why I think a new article is more suitable:

• The Travel London article needs more history details of the two previous attempts of running buses in London. While the first two tries are relevant to Travel London, they are not relevant to Abellio.
• Equally, the future history of Abellio is not relevant to the old bits of Travel London.
• The new website only carries one logo for Abellio (as opposed to thw two Travel London and Travel Surrey articles.
• The pictures shown look like they only show the Abellio name properly (presumably the line below it will say "London" or "Surrey". This contrasts with the distinct separate brands of Travel London and Travel Surrey beforehand.
• Therefore, a new article called Abellio will be able to have the Surrey and London operations together, rather than spreading it out, as it is all under the same legal address.

• Also, by keeping the old article separate, we will be able to keep the defunct names focuses on National Express, (after all it is their naming scheme) as NedRailways only operated under the Travel xxxxxx name for a matter of months (and they took all the fleetnames off much earlier).

Because of this, for now, I have created a new article at Abellio (UK bus company). This will therefore detail the current operation, while the Trvale London info can be scaled down to avoid duplicating it all.

I did want to wait for further concencess, but as usual with these kind of things, some editors who have no idea what the are doing just go round making random changes, causing a mess and confusing the matter, which is what had happened by this morning (despite me trying to encourage discussion here - they ignored it). A good example of this is that someone moved Travel Dundee to National Express Dundee as soon as NatEx even hinted they were rebranding. The new Dundee name came in a year after, so the Wikipedia article was wrong for a year. This is the sort of thing I'm trying to avoid.

I hope this all makes sense...! Arriva436^{talk/contribs} 13:49, 31 October 2009 (UTC)

Yes it does make sense and I agree with you now that Abellio London does needs it's own page.C.bonnick (talk) 11:55, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Abellio Surrey and Abellio London

Just to make it absolutely clear. Abellio Surrey is only a trading name of "Travel London (West)". Travel London (West) is part of Abellio London, and many Abellio London services are run off the Travel London (West) license. Therefore, it seems silly having two separate articles when the difference is so small. Please do not make huge changes without first getting consensus. Arriva436^{talk/contribs} 19:40, 7 February 2010 (UTC)

Route 35/N35

The transfer of routes 35/N35 is relevant, both occurred under Abellio ownership.Mo7838 (talk) 20:29, 3 September 2013 (UTC)

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Proposed split

With the last remnants of Abellio Surrey to shortly cease trading, should the article now be split into Abellio London (which will continue to trade) and Abellio Surrey? These are their actual trading names, can't find any evidence that they ever traded as Abellio (London & Surrey). Seems a bit strange why they were combined in the first place considering their immediate predecessors, Travel London and Travel Surrey, had stand alone articles. There has always been a clear and distinct difference between the two, much like Arriva London and Arriva Southern Counties. 11Expo (talk) 16:26, 3 September 2018 (UTC)

Oppose, as both did oficially have the Abellio London title, Abellio Surrey is/was a trading name of Abellio West London. Nightfury 09:49, 11 September 2018 (UTC)

• Support, clear distinction between current London operator and long defunct Surrey one. Hemerstoine (talk) 05:49, 10 February 2022 (UTC)

Support, as for the same reason above. Grandtubetrains (talk) 09:26, 11 February 2022 (UTC)

Proposed move

Nightfury is now proposing a move of this page to Abellio London. I think that if the proposed split (see above) is not going to happen, the page should stay on this title. (Looking at the company's website I got the impression that if a move is to be done, perhaps the new title should be Abellio London Bus.) — RHaworth (talk · contribs) 10:04, 31 July 2019 (UTC)

Requested move 9 November 2022

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Moved  — Amakuru (talk) 12:33, 17 November 2022 (UTC)

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Abellio (London & Surrey) → Abellio London – This is the correct, current name of this operation. As you can see from their website here they brand themselves as "Abellio London", with no mention of Surrey anymore. Therefore there is no need for disambiguation with brackets, as we can simply use the correct, full name. The Surrey services (which no longer exist) can be covered separately later in the article but there is no need to include them in the title. In any case, ampersand should not have been used in titles as per guidelines, unless in specific circumstances where it is part of the brand, which it clearly is not here as it has been put there for disambiguation). Elshad (talk) 11:57, 9 November 2022 (UTC)

• Support per nom and NATURAL.--Ortizesp (talk) 19:45, 9 November 2022 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Requested move 5 March 2024

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: moved. (non-admin closure) JML1148 ^{(talk | contribs)} 10:01, 13 March 2024 (UTC)

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Abellio London → Transport UK London Bus – Rename of the company to TUK London Bus has legally taken effect today per news articles; redirect is as a result of a reverted premature move. Hullian111 (talk) 07:47, 2 March 2024 (UTC) This is a contested technical request (permalink). Hullian111 (talk) 00:27, 5 March 2024 (UTC)

• Weak support, although proof per WP:NAMECHANGES should've been provided, rather than arguing WP:OFFICIALNAMES. News sources (not discussing the name change) do use it,[1][2][3][4] so meets WP:NAMECHANGES, as well as Abellio not being part of it anymore, leading to greater confusion, unless this article is split. DankJae 21:47, 5 March 2024 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.