Talk:AdvoCare/Archives/2014

Added Info to Business Section

Hey everyone,

I've seen some advertisement for AdvoCare recently and decided to check out the page. I noticed that the same source that was cited after including the number of employees in the infobox [1] also lists the company's total revenue, $12.8 million. Is this something that should be included in the business section, or do you guys think its not very relevant? Let me know Adamh4 (talk) 21:35, 20 March 2014 (UTC)

The current amount of revenue listed is $400 million. That's sourced to Direct Selling News, which is theoretically a WP:SECONDARY source. It's usually better to go with secondary sources when available. The source for the number of employees looks like it's derived from a press release, and is therefore WP:PRIMARY. Since the number of employees is fairly non-controversial, it's fine, but a secondary source would be better. The amount of revenue is a little more difficult, though. Businesses tend to report info like that in the way that's most flattering, rather than most encyclopedically useful. Both current sources are very light-weight, so finding a better source would be preferable to figuring out which of the current pair is most reliable. Grayfell (talk) 23:15, 20 March 2014 (UTC)

That makes sense. I think this page could use a little bit of updating; do you have any ideas for places to find sources with accurate information about these kinds of topics where the company might try to present more flattering information? Adamh4 (talk) 15:15, 21 March 2014 (UTC)

I don't. Searching is a little more difficult than usual because AdvoCare is an aggressive sports sponsor, so there are a lot of passing uses of the name, event-listings, and things like that muddying the waters. Wikipedia:WikiProject Business, or one of its many sister-projects might be a good place to check. Grayfell (talk) 23:56, 21 March 2014 (UTC)

Texas Bowl

Hello everyone, I found some information on the AdvoCare Texas Bowl that could be added. Its main website says that it will be sponsoring the Bowl through 2016, and the first game will be in December of this year. [[2]] I thought this might be worthwhile information to add, let me know if you think so too. Adamh4 (talk) 20:11, 28 March 2014 (UTC)

It's just a press release. These kinds of endorsement deals are rarely significant enough to warrant a detailed explanation. Basically, AdvoCare paid for advertising rights. If there is a secondary source indicating this is important to understanding the company as a whole, it might be worth going into a little more detail. If it's significant to the Texas Bowl, it might be worth adding to that page, but again, only with secondary sources. Grayfell (talk) 20:35, 28 March 2014 (UTC)

This Houston Chronicle article [[3]] comments on it, take a look at this and let me know if you think it has some information that could be added to the page Adamh4 (talk) 19:10, 3 April 2014 (UTC)

Huh? That's already in the article. That may not be a press-release, but it's still pretty vapid. It says very little about the actual company, or its connection to the event. This is a by-the-books sponsorship, and is not going to be noteworthy without some a source explaining why it's significant or exceptional. Grayfell (talk) 01:14, 4 April 2014 (UTC)

Hey Grayfell, here's another article about AdvoCare becoming the new title sponsor of the Texas Bowl. There is some more insight as to how it will affect the company, stated by the Director of Corporate Sponsorship. [4] Do you think this is notable enough to be added to the article, or still not quite? Adamh4 (talk) 16:37, 2 May 2014 (UTC)

What, specifically, does that say about AdvoCare that would belong in an encyclopedia article? The Houston Texans are a sports team, not a news agency. That, and a few other things, lead me to believe that this is yet another thinly veiled press-release. If I didn't know anything about AdvoCare, the only thing I would know about it after reading that press release is that it's the title sponsor, and that its "Director of Corporate Sponsorships" says it's all about integrity and character. How nice for him, but that kind of silly advertising doesn't belong on Wikipedia. Grayfell (talk) 04:50, 3 May 2014 (UTC)

I'm as active against promotional editing as anyone here, but we do add major sports sponsorships--it's something a reader might reasonably want to know. We certainly add sponsorship of major professional teams; I think we could add continuing sponsorship of a bowl also, though not necessarily sponsorship of a single year's game. DGG ( talk ) 05:08, 8 May 2014 (UTC)

To clarify, the Texas Bowl is currently mentioned in the article, and AdvoCare is currently mentioned at Texas Bowl. I haven't seen any sources that suggest anything else needs be said about the arrangement, but I tend to prefer extreme brevity for these kinds of things. Grayfell (talk) 06:29, 8 May 2014 (UTC)

Plain contradiction in the lede

"a network of approximately 60,000 active independent distributors,[3] who participate in a compensation plan based on a direct sales model.[4] As of July 2013, AdvoCare had over 334,000 distributors" Which number is correct? DGG ( talk ) 03:23, 12 May 2014 (UTC)

Good question. The lead originally said 50,000, but there was no source. The 3340,000 figure was added by a single edit account with the summary I updated the number of distributors that was reported to me at a recent AdvoCare event. I am a distributor myself.[5] Before that it had been inflated a couple of times by a SPA, but never with any sources. [6] [7] The 60,000 figure is at least supported by a source, although it's far from ideal. Grayfell (talk) 05:07, 12 May 2014 (UTC)

I have removed both mentions of 334,000. Right now, the article explains about how many distributorships AdvoCare has sold, and about how many are currently active. Grayfell (talk) 05:37, 19 May 2014 (UTC)