Talk:Akatsuki (Naruto)/Archive 2

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Mangekyo or mangekyou

how is it spelled?!?--71.199.154.43 16:13, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

Mangekyō, please refer to Romanji#Long_vowels for more information on why it is spelt with an ō -- Pedantic79 ^(talk) 22:15, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

When the syllables are spaced out, it would be "Ma n ge kyo u". So of the two, "Mangekyou" would be more correct, though it's usually preferred to change the "ou" to an ō as Pedantic79 said. The Splendiferous Gegiford 23:19, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

i see so it's magekyou or mangekyō--Geterdone 23:04, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

There are several systems that romanize japanese words differently. Articles about those systems can be found in the Romanji article. Also please consider reading Help:Talk pages, particularly "How to keep a two-way conversation readable". -- Pedantic79 ^(talk) 00:32, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

Why is Hidan left unknown?

You can tell that he's the one near the leader because the one near Kisame has a spike in his hair. Nemu 02:04, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

The other one also has semi-spikey hair. The best option is to wait until the last member is revealed so we can judge both their appearences next to the two remaining Unknowns to see which is the most similar to which. -The Splendiferous Gegiford 02:21, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

The one next to the leader has a weird protrusion from his head (which is why people call him "the pineapple") and the one next to Sasori has spiky hair. None of these silhouettes match Hidan. Grrblt 16:03, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

You know what? I don't think Kakuzu is the Giant. I mean, most have passed his size difference as an error, but I'm thinkin' that maybe Kakuzu is one of the two Unknowns. The Giant could still be an Unknown. The Wretched 12:40, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

Also, Hidan could be the one labeled as Itachi. That one has smooth hair (as Hidan does), and I think Itachi's is somewhat spikey. The Wretched 12:44, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

Kakuzu has been identified as the giant because of his ring. In this picture http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Akatsukihand.jpg the person occupying the left middle finger is the largest, right? Kakuzu is the one who wears his ring on left middle finger. The ring positions work for every other member, which is why this is a positive ID. Now, unless Kishimoto decided to scrap one giant and turn someone else into a new giant, the biggest guy in both pictures are the same person. About Itachi, he is one of the few who had a full introduction before the 238 group shot. Kishimoto would not screw up an already introduced character in that page. He might draw some silhouette that he later decides to change, but he would not leave out the silhouettes we already recognize. Itachi has smooth hair (look it up if you want to), and the only silhouette that matches him is the one between the giant and Sasori. Grrblt 16:03, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

I'm probably missing something here, but how do you make out who has which ring? I know that we know about Kakuzu's ring, but how do you notice the same ring on The Giant? The image of them all standing there is very dark in both the manga and anime. Unless they have more clear picture (to which we should upload it, since it would probably be more confirming). I can't see any rings in there. The Wretched 23:23, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

In fact I don't even know how anyone could see who's who in that pic. Kisame is obvious, what with Samehada on his back, but everyone else... The Wretched 23:28, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

The only other one that's obvious just by looking is Sasori, since he's the shortest. Well, and Kakuzu, since he's the tallest. The others come from actual hints in the anime and manga. When Deidara speaks, he is shown upside-down in both versions. When the leader talks, that hologram of his shivers in the anime, so that's how we know it that's him. Zetsu's pretty obvious too due to the shape of the head. And Itachi... I guess it's just because of the shape too. The Splendiferous Gegiford 23:33, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

But I'm saying that the Giant could be the last unknown. Kakuzu, as evident in recent chapters, is not much taller than Hidan. If he was the Giant, Hidan would have to be much taller than he is. I guess it's still possible that it's an error by Kishimoto, but if it is, then it should be mentioned. We couldn't do that yet though, 'cause, assuming that I'm correct that we really don't know who Kakuzu is, we don't know (Lol). The Wretched 00:55, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

Look, here's the deal. Leader wears his ring on right thumb, and in chapter 255 he is standing on the statue's right thumb. Itachi wears ring on right ring finger, and stands on right ring finger. Zetsu wears on right pinky, and stands on right pinky. Kisame wears on left ring finger, and stands on left ring finger. Orochimaru wears ring on left pinky, and no one is standing there. See the pattern here? Now, from the recent chapters, we know Kakuzu wears his ring on left middle finger. Who is standing on left middle finger? The largest guy. Therefore, Kakuzu is the largest guy in chapter 255. It makes sense that the largest guy in 255 is the largest guy in 238, the "Giant". Grrblt 09:18, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

Oh and if you're wondering how we can identify Zetsu, Leader, Itachi etc, just read the whole chapter (255). There are plenty of other pictures in the chapter that can be used to identify these dudes. Grrblt 10:05, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

No, I don't get that pattern... something about standing on fingers and crap like that...? The Wretched 08:18, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

It's a very simple pattern. Just see the image in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Akatsukihand.jpg . The members are each occupying one finger on the giant statue (some spots are not occupied in that picture, but if you read chapter 255 you will see that they have been occupied later on). From the picture above we can only make out Kisame, but from various other images in chapter 255, we can identify a lot of the members and where they are standing. It turns out that everyone is standing on the same finger as they wear their ring on. The guy with a ring on his left index finger, is standing on the giant statue's index finger. Same applies for all other members. The only finger which is NOT occupied, is the left pinky. Orochimaru wore his ring on left pinky, and he is no longer with Akatsuki so no one is standing on the giant's left pinky. Do not continue reading until you understand this pattern. When you do, consider this: The largest guy on http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Akatsukihand.jpg is standing on the giant statue's left middle finger. Kakuzu wears his ring on left middle finger. That means Kakuzu is the largest guy. Grrblt 00:05, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

4th hokage

who thinks 4th=leader and why. i think so because there both really strong and the outline is the same i just want a vote,and sihgn your comments please. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.199.154.43 (talk • contribs) 17:07, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

1. 4th Hokage is dead.
2. We don't know if Leader is really strong.
3. Their outline is only vaguely similar.
4. Leader has weird eyes which 4th Hokage doesn't share.
5. 4th Hokage is a good guy. Leader is not.

So no, 4th Hokage is not the Akatsuki leader. No chance whatsoever. :81.233.40.12 18:42, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

the eyes could b a dōjutsu and he must b strong to boss a pack of s-ranked ninja around and he might not b dead and he might b bad and another thing i said "who thinks 4th=leader" not who thinks he's not so shut up! —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Geterdone (talk • contribs) 19:02, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

4th Hokage didn't have a doujutsu. Leader doesn't have to be strong to boss them around, he could just be the man with the plan. 4th is dead without a doubt; the manga describes him as dead several times. He is not a bad guy, because he saved his village from destruction, he is loved by everyone who knew him and Naruto wants to be like him. I was on topic so shut up yourself; not my fault that you don't like the fact that 4th and leader are different people. 81.233.40.12 19:09, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

we don't know if he has a dōjutsu or not and it could be like star wars:good guy turns darth vader luke thinks he's dead but he really is bad then asks luke(in this case naruto)to join him and why would the4th seal a demon in his own son if not to use him and the demon in him. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Geterdone (talk • contribs) 19:44, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

hey "some guy 0830 "who do you think the leader is? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Geterdone (talk • contribs) 19:59, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

Honestly, I think it's that Uchiha Madara guy. It's just the kind of relevation I'd expect. He's met the Kyubi, he's apparently more evil than the Kyubi; it all fits. However, I'm not about to go adding that to the article. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 21:01, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

me thinks tis madara or yondaime what do you think about the yondaime theory someguy0830?--Geterdone 22:05, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

Honestly, I have to wonder what could possibly bring anyone to consider such a wholly implausible situation. He's freakin' dead. He used the self-killing sealing jutsu. You don't get much deader. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 22:09, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

sorry if i afended you but the leader has blonde hair not like the uchiha's hair, i know this because in the manga there is a flashback and they say: "the blonde haired worior and the old akatsuki leader face of and the blonde haired worior defeated the old akatsuki leader and becomes the new leader." i'm not saying thats"proof"but it does mean that it's not an uchiha. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Geterdone (talk • contribs) 23:02, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

Since when can an Uchiha not have blonde hair? Is there some law against it? I'm sorry to say, but the leader being the Fourth is never going to happen. What part of "self-killing sealing jutsu" fails to get through? Even the third states the ressurection is impossible with it. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 23:04, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

i didn't say its not possible its just unlikely and doesn't madara have black hair? but there is a jutsu that orochimaru has that resurected hokage to fight the 1st and the 2nd came out but the third one remained closed and oro was fighting the third so the 4th is the only one left and if one of the hokage is strong enough it can b indapedant and can't b controled by the user. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Geterdone (talk • contribs) 23:19, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

That sentence made no sense. Try using entire words. Have you seen Uchiha Madara? How would you know what he looks like? Second, I'm not continuing this. Feel free to believe what you wish. It's really quite obvious that the Fourth is dead and will stay that way. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 23:26, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

There is no such flashback in the manga. You either made it up yourself, or someone fooled you big time. 81.233.40.12 05:42, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

I knew I should have called him on that, but I haven't read the manga completely so I wasn't entirely sure. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 05:44, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

i thought there was i haven't read,it my friend told me that. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Geterdone (talk • contribs) 11:47, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

He lied.--Master Shan 05:59, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

Friends = leading cause of confusion. I'm not saying not to make friends, just don't trust everything they've said about any TV shows and/or Stories of any kind without reading it yourself. In fact, I wouldn't even trust Wikipedia fully right now. Lots of people add things that are mere rumor and could never happen or could, but don't have solid evidence yet. A prime example would be the claims that Shikamaru and Temari have a relationship. There are very minor hints but that's about it. Don't trust anyone when they tell you that Shikamaru and Temari are a couple. It could happen, but hasn't yet. The Wretched 01:09, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

I'm gonna have to say that I think it's either the Yondaime or Uchiha Madara. And if you say the Yondaime is dead...uh...yeah. That sure as hell didn't stop Orochimaru from nearly reviving him in his fight with Sandaime. Or, for all we know, he dodged death somehow. I mean, are we forgetting the jutsu that the Akatsuki Leader used to make the clones of Itachi and Kisame? The shapeshifting Jutsu? He could've stuck most of his chakra into that, and then had it go and seal the Kyuubi into Naruto while the real Yondaime gets the hell outta dodge. Just something worth considering - Viewtiful Rekk (Not sure how to sign these things still....>_>; )

If Yondaime wasn't dead, then Orochimaru wouldn't be able to attempt to revive him in the first place. The Wretched 08:26, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

may b orochimaru thought he was dead thats why it was unsuccessfull.--67.191.195.232 17:53, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

I hate to do this as it's necroposting, but the Sandaime stopped the summon. That's why it failed.--Frenchman113 on wheels! 20:55, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

(this is another person intrudind)- the leader has browin light hair and may not be either of the two. The Uchiha clan tend to have dark coloured hair and theres the fact that Orochimaru konws who the leader is. All the ninjas have to do is find and ask Orochimaru. Dont forget he also has the ring he recieved from Akatsuki.

These rings have a special power in them thats everone haas forgotten about. The 4th did a technique that sent him to hell as the stomach of the death god (shinigami) is hell so all the hokages of konoha apart from the 5th are in hell. The only two possible way the 4th could come back to life is by the seal he placed on naruto breacking and therfore hisimprisoning breaking and him being set free.

The second is the Orochimaru using that technique to bring him back to life and the third (ive just thought of) is by someone devoloping a technique like chiyos which brings people back to life. if you look at the cover of chapter 317 in the manga youll see his hair is th colour of a light brown but personally i think hes Mandara because the Kyuubi state he was the only one who could supress the beasts chakra.

I think if they had a fight with all the Akatsuki members Kakashi would find out tobi is Obito Uchiha and they would fight and Tenzo(Yamato) would fight the Akatsuki Leader because one can control the power of the bijuu and one can supress the power of this. Also if the seal on Kyuubi broke Naruto would die and 4th would live again so it would be like one life for another.

when it comes down to it all the rivalries in naruto have to face each other and Naruto facing Saske will be the most interesting. thats all ive got...

???

what happened to the conversations?--Geterdone 22:04, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

Archived. Look up top. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 23:05, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

thanks--Geterdone 23:20, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

the leader

will we ever know for sure who the akatsuki leader is?--Madara 12:27, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

Yes, when he's had a proper introduction. 138.227.189.8 14:44, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

who do you think he is?--Madara Uchiha 16:57, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

Someone new, of course. Grrblt 21:43, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

so does that mean you don't have anyone in mind? I think it's Madara Uchiha. what do think about it being Madara?

I can think it's Naruto from the future using a time travelling jutsu to return to the past and kill himself. Unless I'm Masashi Kishimoto, what I think doesn't matter. We'll find out when we find out. Anything else is pure speculation. – Pedantic79 ^(talk) 21:56, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

Your,right anything we say about the ID of the leader is just a guess.--Geterdone 23:04, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

If he is a pre-existing character, I would bet that he is the fourth (guessing from the hair). For some reason, the story has been very very quiet about who the Fourth was and his relation to Naruto, but a lot about the Fourth's story seems fishy. He's so very much like Naruto (frog summons, same jutsus), yet no one mentions it directly (other than Jirya's cryptic "forgive me, fourth"). He supposedly died sealing the biju, and yet we've now met characters who have both sealed and released bijus without dying. Something is very obviously "up." But it's all speculation.

I saw this comic of naruto that tells that the 4th leaf hokage is the leader and when he shows this face kakashi says 'sensei' and naruto shouts 'yondaime'. If u see some of the pictures of him and the a akatsuki leader the the hair and the eyes match ^_^

This is the reason why this article was protected. People have no concept of what a joke is. It's a joke image made by some fan. It doesn't actually happen. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 03:51, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

i have seen the same thing it's so realistic but perhaps it's fake i'm ganna laugh if it's in the mange thogh.--67.191.195.232 19:07, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

red moon or dawn

iv'e seen online where they say akatsuki means red moon but I thought it meant dawn or day break,whitch one is correct?--Madara Uchiha 16:49, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

There used to be a sentence about this. [1]. "Aka" in Japanese can mean "Red" (赤), and "Tsuki" can mean "Moon" (月). As such, many believe Akatsuki stands for "Red Moon". However, the correct kanji for Akatsuki is 暁, which means "Dawn" or "Daybreak".

Also User:Geterdone, thank you for signing this post. Please remember to not forget to sign things. If you change your default sig, as it appears that you have, please have it link to your user page so we can identify that you are User:Geterdone and not User:Madara Uchiha. Also please format your posts correctly. You've added an extra : for no reason. -- Pedantic79 ^(talk) 17:47, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

thanks --geterdone 18:10, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

Madara uchiha

does Madara have MS? --71.199.154.43 22:07, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

How is this in any way productive? – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 22:12, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

I just wondered if anybody Knew that's all.--71.199.154.43 22:42, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

Why would we know if he has/had MS? He's been mentioned by name once. Furthermore, have you ever heard of a Naruto character with MS? – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 22:47, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

I don't know how you would know and no i haven't heard of Naruto characters with MS. Gosh it was just a question.--Geterdone 23:10, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

do you have an image of Madara?--71.199.154.43 23:37, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

"He's been mentioned by name once." No one knows what he looks like, what he can do, or what if any physical disabilities he may possess. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 23:43, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

I see thanks--71.199.154.43 02:14, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

What's MS? The Wretched 01:02, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

Mangekyō Sharingan – Pedantic79 ^(talk) 02:01, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

Oh, okay. Well, if that's what it stands for, then my answer is this: no one knows. I think it's very likely, as Itachi did mention that if Sasuke obtained it, then the total who could handle it would be 'three'. Itachi was the only known person with the ability at the time. Kakashi developed it much later. However, we can't jump to conclusions. It's still possible he could be talking about someone else... The Wretched 03:50, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

I would guess that if Madara is still alive, then he has the MS. Itachi said there were three capable of using it, and he did not consider Kakashi able to do it. But there is a very good chance that Madara was some strong Uchiha legendary from hundreds of years ago, and Sasuke is the only person since then to achieve his "cursed chakra" and that stuff. Of course, even if he did 500 years ago there's still a chance he had the MS. But in that case, he isn't the third MS user. Grrblt 09:01, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

Where does he specifically say that Kakashi isn't capable of it? Itachi says that there are only three people CAPABLE of acquiring it, and given that he has just killed every single other known person with a Sharigan other than Kakashi and Sasuke (and himself), he might mean this quite matter of factly: there are now only three people left alive who even have the Sharingan in the first place (and thus only three who can attain it). Note also that just because Madara is Uchiha doesn't mean that the cursed chakra is related to the Sharingan. Sasuke's powers are quite litterally also based on a curse: the very curse powers that Sasuke believes make him special (more special than nine-tails powers). The Nine-Tails could just as easily be referring to that. We probably won't know for a while now regardless.  :(Plunge 21:15, 5 August 2006 (UTC)

When Kakashi hints to Itachi that he has the MS ("So, Itachi, how far has your eyesight deteriorated?") Itachi answers "Kakashi, you couldn't have...". Quite literally, this means that Itachi doesn't think Kakashi could have activated MS. Grrblt 07:55, 7 August 2006 (UTC)

(Someone)- The name Akatsuki means dawn or red moon like someone said already and Itachi can make a red moon like the name Akatsuki which could indicate whoever made Akatsuki could do that tecnique Itachi can do so he could be Uchiha Mandara. so its probaly Mandara whos doing all of this.

Sasori listed as "former member"?

Since the series will no doubt result in the deaths of many of the Atatsuki members, I would suggest that we should not establish a precedent of moving deceased members into the "former" category, at least until we know for sure that they will be replaced by another character at some point in the future. Orichimaru is legitimately a "former" member because he had left the group before we even meet him in the story. Sasori, though, we saw as an active Atatsuki member, and he merely died, not renounced his allegiance. None of the other pages work this way just when a character dies (for instance, dead members of the Sound Village are not listed as "former members") The format of the page should in general not be set up so that it changes based on future events in the manga. This is an encylopedia that has to look at the series from a more distant and objective perspective rather than something constantly shifting its structure in response to new events. 69.171.60.23 18:40, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

Tobi looks like he is set to take Sasoris role so that would mke Sasori a former member. There could possibly be a deceased members section. I doubt many more Akatsuki are going to be replaced when they die,I'd be willing to stake a large bet that Tobi is the one and only.Darkwarriorblake 19:25, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

First of all, that's by no means confirmed and all we hear of it is that Zetsu says it isn't that easy. But second of all, a wikipedia entry should not treat an entry on a fictional organization as if it were keeping track of the "current" roster of the group (as if it were chronicling real ongoing events!). It should speak as an overview of the storytelling as a whole, and generally the _structure_ of the entries should be biased to how things are at the start of the story, if anything (to avoid spoilers via implication). Orichimaru is sensibly in his own category as a former member only because that's his relationship to the organization as a story begins and remains his relationship throughout the story. If he rejoins Atatsuki at some point in the story, is then going to be taken OUT of the former member section, leaving only Sasori??? That just doesn't seem to be a sensible way to structure an entry on a fictional organization. 69.171.60.23 20:35, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

Dead or disbanded people can't very well participate, now can they? If it gets to the point where a lot of them die, then it'll be reformatted to indicate the group's non or reduced existence. AS it is, one dead member is fine. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 20:43, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

I agree. I had thought about this too, as I'm the one who originally added Sasori to the Former Members section, but as of now, he's the only dead member, so it's fine the way it is. If it gets to the point where it looks like several or all of the members will die (which, given the nature of Naruto and shounen mangas in general, will most likely happen), then we can worry about reorganizing everything. The Splendiferous Gegiford 20:57, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

Indeed, that is an expected event, but not one I expect to happen anytime soon. Frankly, the manga takes a long time to get things done. Killing off 8 more people is going to take some time. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 21:05, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

But you're all missing the point. You are treating this as if it were a blog or a news report instead of an encyclopedia entry. You're not supposed to update someone's status based on events that happen more than halfway into the story as if you were breathlessly relating recent current events. If anything, entries should be baised towards a structure that reflects the status of things at the start of the story, not altered so that they reflect the way things are now or at the end of the story (will every member then be in the "former" category???!) Furthermore, it's inconsistent with all the rest of the Naruto pages. The Third is dead, but he's not in a category of "former" Konoha villagers. Dead sound aren't "former" sound. etc.69.171.60.23 16:07, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

The third is listed as the Third Hokage. Given that there are five, one can assume he's not doing the job anymore. Second, Wikipedia is not paper, and always tends to be updated for current information. Deal with it. If and when the former members section becomes dominant, we'll reformat the article. As it stands, having two members in another section is fine. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 19:08, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

Who said it was a paper: you're the one treating like its myspace. It's an encyclopedia, not a fan site. 69.171.60.23 02:16, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

Stop overreacting. It's one member who's been dead for a decent amount of time now. Like we've told you several times, if it gets to a point were many of them will end up there, we'll reformat it as such. Until that point comes, having a dead member listed as a former member is a prudent course of action. On a tangent, you should get an account. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 04:02, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

We? Oh so apparently, not only is not an encyclopedia and a fan site, it's YOUR personal fansite. Sorry to intrude.69.171.60.23 23:45, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

First, there's one other person, so we is an appropriate generalization. Second, you're the one complaining over one measely person. He's dead. He's not a current member. Get over it. In fact, while you're at it, why don't you complain about the constant updates on the plot pages, or the character pages, or every other page for that matter. Wikipedia is routinely updated to reflect the most current information available. This will not change. It isn't like a paper encyclopedia, whose information will be out of date eventually. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 01:07, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

Those changes all make sense because they proceed apace without changing the 'structure' of the entries. Atatsuki is a fictional organization, not a real one, and an entry on it has to describe its membership from the perspective of an overview of the ENTIRE series, not "what things are like in the manga right this second." That overview structure, again, should be if anything biased towards the structure of things at the start of the story, and updates and new events should be described within those entries or in the appropriate plot sections. Again, you can't treat a fictional group as if it were some current event with an up to date roster. There is no up to date: it's a story that has a start and will one day end.69.171.60.23 06:19, 18 July 2006 (UTC)

And when it ends it'll still be up to date. You got your wish of moving him. My point is that you're being far too picky about a single character at some point in time. It's no different with the plot pages. Episode comes out, chapter comes out, it's updated. It's common practice. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 06:31, 18 July 2006 (UTC)

It's updated by adding NEW sections to deal with new developments. Not by changing old ones. I note that Yura is listed under "Agents" of Atasuki. Shouldn't he be listed as a "Former Agent" in his own section, by your logic? Plunge 21:05, 5 August 2006 (UTC)

I'm gonna have to back the decision, its stupid to have him in the former members section. Orochimaru is a former member, he quit. Sasori simply died and his spot has yet to be filled, thusly until that point I say we keep him in the members section, otherwise we'd simply have to apply that everytime one of them died we would place them as former members until there is no members (under the presumption all of akatsuki will at some point likely be defeated and killed). If anything, sasori should be made part of a 'dead members' section until he is replaced, as for all intents and purposes he is still technically a member....just dead. So end point, PUT SASORI BACK IN THE MEMBERS SECTION. Midusunknown 21:49, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

Sasori's spot has now been taken by Tobi. Time to move Sasori down again? Grrblt 11:59, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

Damnit. All that arguing and it's just reversed after I cave in. I knew it was a bad idea. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 21:19, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

HAHA, I'm still going to give you some respect for it Someguy. I mean...had Tobi not taken his place...Eh. All's well that ends well. Midusunknown 02:36, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

Except it makes no difference. Tobi joining makes him a member, but that doesn't have anything to do with whether it makes any sense to call someone a former member because they died. If anything, it would make more sense for Tobi to be in his own section as a "Newer Member" since, again, wikipedia articles on fictional characters are supposed to be structured as an overview with a bias to the status of things as the story starts, not how it ends or proceeds halfway in. Plunge 21:05, 5 August 2006 (UTC)

Kakuzu's technique?

Has anyone else noticed the technique Kakuzu uses to open the temple door in chapter 314. His hand turns to a different color and the sound effect was "zuzutsu". I think this is worth mentioning in his profile.

It's there. He is shown to have a great amount of physical strength, the use of which is somehow associated with a change in his skin color. Nemu 23:23, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

Hidan??? What's his village?

I've noticed Hidan's headband doesnt seem to portray any village i've seen in the manga so far or in the anime. It is also not mentioned on the Wikipedia entry for the Hidden Villages. Its three curvy lines almost like a strange mist village mark. We haven't seen any of his attacks besides the use of that tripple-bladed scythe so we cant guess his element from his attacks.

I just wondered if anyone knows what village it is or if anyone has any ideas. -- Justice san, 17th July06, 18:00GMT

At first it seemed like it was a mistake by the artist, and that his headband bears the symbol of either Hidden Grass or Hidden Rain. However, a chapter later we got a good many views of it and it doesn't match either. Hidan is most likely from a not yet introduced village, or the headband could be a mark of his religion rather than his village (though I've no idea why he would scratch his religion's symbol). Grrblt 23:02, 17 July 2006 (UTC)

It's definitely a village symbol, just not one we've seen. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 23:05, 17 July 2006 (UTC)

Ugh

I've uploaded a better version of the Akatsuki main photo, can someone make it default because I can't see how. Its there and says its the current image but its still showing the old photo. Darkwarriorblake 11:35, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

You probably just need to give it some time to update. Grrblt 12:06, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

Oh ok, wish it just said that instead of leaving me wondering w hat the hell is going on.Darkwarriorblake 12:18, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

Try refreshing the page, it should be up now. --Pentasyllabic 12:20, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

Anyone think these are good enough to replace the current one?

• http://www.zen89353.zen.co.uk/hidan.jpg
• http://www.zen89353.zen.co.uk/unknownmemver.jpg

The unknown one isn't showing much but I think its the only picture of that member going, it'd keep the articles structure at least. The Hidan one might be better simply because its coloured. -- Darkwarriorblake 16:13, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

We could always use the old picture from 238 for Unknown. The leader has a similar pic. And it points to the fact that we don't really know what they look like. I think Hidan's pic should stay for now; the new one has color but he's looking away from the "camera". His current picture is good enough. 81.233.40.12 18:30, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

Rank

Are we keeping that or what? I just noticed some members have their rank listed and others don't.

I'm not sure if their home village is of importance as much as their unique traits since they have certain skill allignments obviously.Darkwarriorblake 19:42, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

Requesting a section for unknown members

Um...What I said. - Malomeat 21:44, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

Akatsuki (Naruto)#Unknown member

What does that look like? – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 22:01, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

there are 2 (possibly) Image:Manga Akatsuki Naruto.jpg. one with purple hair and a hairclip (possibly female) and one one with orange-brown hair. Most say that this is Leader, being how they have a 9 member limit thanks to Oro. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Malomeat (talk • contribs) .

You have your answer then. We know the brown-haired one. He's the leader. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 22:59, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

It is the leader, thats why hes the furthest away with no visible face. Otherwise, where else is the leader in that picture? Its an Akatsuki roster pic.Darkwarriorblake 23:00, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

the leader

so now that we know that the leader has brown hair does anyone think they know who he is?--Geterdone 23:37, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

Don't encourage that nonsense. No one knows. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 23:41, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

yeah, good point i say no more.

Doesn't Corey Feldman have brown, spikey hair?

Yes, the Akatsuki Leader is Corey Feldman. The Splendiferous Gegiford 02:08, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

That's BS. It's Chouji's dad. - Malomeat 16:56, 29 July 2006 (UTC)

I wouldn't even define it as brown, the way I saw it, the hair colour looked orange. Speculation based off of a scan that could be tinted in colour will only lead to false truths and bad rumors. Midusunknown 02:10, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

It's not chouji's dad. chouji's dad is fat the leader is not simple as that and i think the theory of it being chouji's dad is BS.--71.199.154.43 21:58, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

If you really think he was serious, then it's time to get professional help.  :) Besides, it's totally Chouji's dad. That clan can change their body size. Besides, he's not fat, he's big boned.

there clan can increase there size not decrease it besides the leader does not look big boned.--Geterdone 21:06, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

OMG are you STILL taking that seriously? Whoosh! It was a joke when first mentioned, and joke all the times afterwards. :) Plunge 23:30, 17 August 2006 (UTC)

akatsuki clothes

Wikipedia says that akatsuki means dawn or daybreak but people say it's red cloud and i thoght it meant dawn too but on the akatsuki picture they have red clouds on there clothes so does that mean it really does mean red cloud?

Many people believe Akatsuki means "Red Moon" because Aka can mean Red and Tsuki can mean Moon. However, this is the case of a homonym (just like "i saw him" and "hammer and saw" sound the same but have different meanings). The real translation for Akatsuki in this case is Dawn. The red clouds have nothing to do with this, they are simply there to look good. Grrblt 12:20, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

Also, "Red Moon" would have to be be "Akaitsuki". The Splendiferous Gegiford 15:07, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

Actually you can drop the i related characters/sounds when making a compound with red, so aka enough would be sufficient. However that is off topic, I just wanted to clarify. Midusunknown 02:08, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

I think the red clouds could denote a dawn. In other words the red clouds from a dawn. So they do have relevance.

Eye Color

This isn't very important, but Zabuza's eye color is listed as black, when is actually white, and Hidan's eye color is listed as silver, when the HQ version of the new color spread actually appears to show him with pink eyes... am i seeing things with Hidan or does someone else see it?

It's just different tinting from cleanup. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 03:56, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

Tenzou, " Using suiton without a source?"

First of all, I'd like to thank everyone working on this article. I'm not sure if this is the right place to post this note.

In Kisame's profile you can notice this "Kisame is the only other person to use Suiton Ninjutsu without a water source besides the Second Hokage". The point that im trying to into is "Did Yamato use ( Suiton: Takitsubo no Jutsu ) without a water source ??". To be honest, it seems like the water was flowing from the ground rather than being summoned or blown out from the mouth of the user, but im not quite sure about this either. So its up to guys to decide.

thanks :-)

Tobi speculation

You should re-add the Tobi:Obito fan speculation. The Fourth's info includes fan speculation about being Naruto's father, and so do many other articles in wikipedia (such as Lost (TV series)), so why the double standard? It's factual to state that there's a debate about it. 70.187.164.216 02:06, 2 August 2006 (UTC)

Because it's more likely that Yondaime is Naruto's father than a dead Obito (and Yondaime, Uchiha Madara, and god knows who else) is alive and a member of Akatsuki. --Pentasyllabic 04:06, 2 August 2006 (UTC)

Our opinion on the likeliness of a speculation coming true really shouldn't play into it. Either we have speculation, which could be narrowed down to the most often speculated speculation, or we don't have it at all. And if we have it, I suggest a === Speculation & Theories === at the bottom, where we can stick all that crap so AL=Yondaime idiots can be happy. Grrblt 08:17, 2 August 2006 (UTC)

I rephrased the trivia to be more neutral, similar to the Kisame-Sanbi speculation. Is that better? --Pentasyllabic 12:32, 2 August 2006 (UTC)

The fourths article contains info on pointless baseless stuff because it, like 90% of naruto articles, is god awful. Darkwarriorblake 19:04, 3 August 2006 (UTC)

The Fourth is widely rumored to have a third nipple. (edit: it was a scanlation error: he actually has 4 nipples!) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Plunge (talk • contribs) .

Lock again

Can we just leave the lock against unregistered users please? Every 10 seconds someone is adding that Tobi is obito or some other random fanwank.Darkwarriorblake 19:04, 3 August 2006 (UTC)

I second that,it's so anoying!--Geterdone 16:22, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

Tobi's jutsu

what does tobi's jutsu do? in the trivia it says: "it beat 3-tails in one shot." and what does it shoot?--Geterdone 16:31, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

Not only do we not know what it does (since it doesn't happen on-panel), but it's even suggested that Tobi claims about his jutsu are as goofy as the rest of his appearances in this chapter, as the last thing we saw was Deidara's jutsu, and Deidara loudly denies that Tobi did anything, saying that it was his clay fish that did it. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Plunge (talk • contribs) .

Hidan

Which hidden village is Hidan from? --Beef noodles 02:24, 6 August 2006 (UTC)

No one knows. Also, see #Hidan??? What's his village?. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 02:36, 6 August 2006 (UTC)

That giant hand statue

It occurs to me that although we mention (and even illustrate) the giant hand statue, we don't actually explain its significance. I don't have those particlar manga chapters so I'm not sure what it's for, but the fact that Gaara's in front of it leads me to believe that extraction ritual takes place there. It'd be helpful if someone who's read those chapters would elaborate. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 03:35, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

I can't take the time right now to write something decent, but the statue is so far only used for the bijuu extraction ritual. The leader apparently summons it, and releases (unsummons) it right after they're done. The members each occupy one of the statue's fingers, the same finger as they wear their ring on. It has nine eyes, one eye is opened for each bijuu extracted/assimilated (as would be the case with Sanbi). It wears a pair of handcuffs, leading some to speculate that it will break free once all eyes are opened. It kinda looks like it's made of wood, making some people think Leader is a mokuton user. As part of the extraction ritual, all members say the kanji of the "opposite" member; Leader on left thumb will say the kanji on Sasori/Tobi's ring on the right thumb and vice versa. Zetsu is the only one who says his own ring kanji, because his "opposite" member is the missing Oro. That's what I can remember right now. Grrblt 07:05, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

I don't know how much of this is accurate, but it seems a waste to just delete it. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 20:45, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

The King of Hell Statue

The summon of The Akatsuki Leader's summon, The King of Hell Statue is the very object that works in partnership with The Fūin Jutsu: Genryū Kyū Fūjin (Sealing Technique: Illusionary Dragon Nine Consuming Seals). With this each Akatsuki member stands on The King of Hell Statue's fingers that match their ring position, then The Leader activates The statue with his technique and nine spectral dragon spew from the statue's mouth and enter the jinchūriki's body. After a certain time limit (Three dayus with nine Akatsuki rings) the Bijū is absorbed into The King of Hell Statue and one of it's nine eyes will open to show how many and which Bijū the Akatsuki have.

This summon appears to be a key item in The Akatsuki Leader's plan since he quickly removed it from The old Akatsuki hideout in The River Country when Sakura Haruno and Sasori of the Red Sands destroyed the cave it was held in.

Trivia

• All nine Akatsuki members don't not be physically present, they can use their astral projection technique to transport a spectral form of themselves into the cave.

Small note, we need to update the Akatsukihand.jpg picture (showing the ring position) to say Tobi instead of Sasori. Grrblt 12:31, 10 August 2006 (UTC)

Zetsu's country.

Motion to remove Zetsu's country being listed as Grass. Theres is no evidence to support this.

Previous discussion has pointed out that he is shown wearing a grass headband during his first appearance. I've checked this myself and no, it does not show ANY headband, grass or otherwise.

As well, in the great herobook, it shows the symbol of the countries that the revealed Akatsuki members are from, except for Zetsu, who has a question mark instead.

Also, since Akatsuki members 1 to 5 (assuming the leader is 0) have shown to be following the tradional Five elements (Japanese philosophy), the first being earth (Deidara is from the Earth country), the third being fire (Itachi is from the Fire country) and the fith being sky (Orochimaru's ring reads as sky), Then it is safe to assume that member #2 is from a water related country (most likely Rain. He/she is shown wearing a miniature umbrella in his/her hair) and Zetsu from an air related country (most likely Lightning). —The preceding unsigned comment was added by HakuGaara (talk • contribs) .

Geg had a picture proving it. It's in one of his edit summaries. He is indeed from the Grass village. It stays. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 19:43, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

A ha! Found it. http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y104/kangarugh22/zetsugrass.jpg There's your proof. Unlike Hidan, that's clearly a grass symbol. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 19:57, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

You can tell just by looking at that pic that it has been heavily edited. Here is a more 'natural' version http://msnusers.com/NarutoMangaReturns/vol27.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=13548. As you can see, there is nothing there. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by HakuGaara (talk • contribs) .

That looks to me like a bad scan. It's far too dark. As it is, I'm willing to trust the well-maintained image over your darkened version. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 20:48, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

Also, the guy has a giant fly trap on his head. What other country would he come from? Really, Grass fits and we have a picture proving it. It's fine. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 20:49, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

Just because a scan is darker and less visable doesn't mean a person should just edit it however they feel. Also, if it really was visable then why would the herobook (which came out well after) put a question mark were his country should be? I'm not asking to put his country as something else. just remove it as being Grass until there is more concrete confirmation aside from a doctored pic. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by HakuGaara (talk • contribs) .

You have yet to prove that pic is doctored. All you've given is a poor scan and said your's was right. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 21:00, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

It's OBVIOUS. Do a zoom in on both our respective pics. On mine it shows that area as being black on one side and white on the other. On yours it shows both sides being the white of a metal headband. Since its obvious that yours has had considerably more 'cleaning' done to it (yes, cleaning is a form of doctoring), it is safe to assume that the pictured headband is false. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by HakuGaara (talk • contribs) .

According to the source I got it from, (well, okay, it was a guy on a forum), the symbol wasn't there when the chapter was originally published in Shonen Jump, but was added in for the graphic novel release. The Splendiferous Gegiford 21:56, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

Ya, I heard that too http://forums.narutofan.com/showthread.php?p=4813778 but it still doesn't add up. Why would he add it to the volume release but then put a question mark for his country in the herobook? unless the volume came out after the herobook. Even still, I've never known Kishimoto to 'add' things to volumes that weren't there before. Seems suspicous. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by HakuGaara (talk • contribs) .

seems doctored to me simply because of the additional fact of how oddly placed that forehead protector would be, i mean its right over his chest of all places, isnt it? --Midusunknown 11:53, 18 August 2006 (UTC)

Speaking of Zetsu, why in the world is his pic replaced by a picture link of Kurenai and Asuma? (unless it's just me)

It's just you. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 05:37, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

eyes

can someone give me a pic of the leaders eyes? if so please put it on my talk page.--Geterdone 21:01, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

gaara's dad

can the leader b Gaara's dad?--Geterdone 21:01, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

Honestly, don't you have something better to do than post impossible theories and make odd comments on talk pages? You've only editted about 6 pages that are actually articles. Also, he's dead, so no he's not the leader. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 21:20, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

Honestly, don't you have anything better 2 do than being a jerk 2 newbeis to naruto and wikipedia ,i watch the anime in america ,the american version is in the chūnin exams so how am i suposed 2 know gaara's dad is dead so get of my back! if it were up 2 me you would b banned from wikipedia! what part of "don't bite the newbeis"and"b nice 2 new comers" don't you understand? so just answer the question,is that asking too much?--Geterdone 23:06, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

You can't claim you're a newbie when you've been here for two months. Go edit some articles. This isn't a forum. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 23:13, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

maybe not 2 wikipedia but to naruto!--Geterdone 23:17, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

Not to impose, but if you only watch the American anime, then how do you know about Akatsuki? Also, since you're asking about a character on a Wikipedia talk page, wouldn't it make sense to look up that character on Wikipedia to see if your question could somehow be answered? That is Wikipedia's purpose after all. Snapper2 23:36, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

the way i know is i found out about wikipedia then i tried 2 find something on the 4th hokage and i saw it say:"the 4th is the akatsuki leader" and i followed the link 2 akatsuki and here i am. i thought gaara's dad was dead but that doesn't keep fans from thinking 4th=leader.--67.191.195.232 12:53, 17 August 2006 (UTC)

purple

why do akatsuki members have purple finger nail polish on?--Geterdone 20:56, 17 August 2006 (UTC)

Not a forum. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 20:57, 17 August 2006 (UTC)