Talk:Anarchism in Australia/Archive 1

Archive 1

Initial Remarks on Set-up

The page is intended as a beginning. I have only barely worked out the mechanisms involved. Recent history is hotly disputed, so I hope discussions can be held here rather than getting into editing wars Jeremytrewindixon 04:25, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

I've added some references and made a first (so far unreferenced) mention of the FAA. I've toned down the mention that someone made of Germaine Greer. I don't know that she publicly identifies as an anarchist, and her membership of the SL was brief and long ago, although if you read her stuff it was obviously influential. I'm planning to contribute a lot more. References take time to assemble.Jeremytrewindixon 08:16, 30 June 2007 (UTC)

I've just added some "new external links" ie links to Takvers History Page where many anarchist documents are archived. I will no doubt reference more of them as the article grows to cover the least 20 years. (I am not Takver!) I'm doing my best to provide references that exist also in hard-copy, but it seems to me that readers should know how to access them online if possible. Several references are to works by Bob James, please note that he is an academic historian.210.84.13.233 07:05, 3 July 2007 (UTC) Erm, I seem not to have signed in, that comment was by Jeremytrewindixon 07:07, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

This page should further mention (at least) the australian affiliate of the International Workers Assocation 1986-1992 and its industrial work, the Brisbane Self-management group and the Brisbane Catholic Worker group of which Ciaron O'Reilly has become the celebrity member. I don't know that Willem Siebenhaar really needs to be mentioned here. There is much else that could me mentioned, I am trying to be ruthless in keeping it to manifestations of aus. anarch. which had clear direct or indirect mainstream impact. Speaking of which: Monty Miller is important enough a figure to rate his own biography. Apart from being part of the history of the Eureka rebellion, and of Australian anarchism, and an important figure in the Australian IWW, he is also part of the history of the Australian Labour Party. And a remarkable chap. Jeremytrewindixon 05:09, 5 July 2007 (UTC) Here is his National Dictionary of Biography site: http://www.adb.online.anu.edu.au/biogs/A100501b.htm ...and here is Harry Hooton on the subject: http://www.takver.com/history/hooton_iww.htm

I've added pretty much all that I think will need to be added to the section on "original" Australian anarchism, JA Andrews and all that. I've also mentioned a couple of Brisbane groups that needed to be there, the Brisbane Self-management group continues to cast a long shadow, on anarchism and also i think the greens Party in Australia while the catholic workers naturally. Moving towards almost done I guess apart from improving referencing. Jeremytrewindixon 08:46, 8 July 2007 (UTC)

Added some new stuff, including on the Anarcho-Syndicalist Federation and the Lib Workers and the lovely and talented Joe Toscano. Haven't fully cited what I've put up, but this brings us quite close to up-to-date. I was closely and controversially involved myself in events around the ASF but I've done my best to be objective. I would imagine references to the current established press belong in the introduction? That would be Rebel Worker (founded 1978) and Anarchist Age Weekly Review (founded 1991). I am affiliated with Rebel Worker while the Anarchist Age is the organ of the Anarchist Media Insitute. Both have web pages. There have been other periodicals which deserve mention. The pamphlet You Can't Blow Up a Social Relationship has (unfortunately IMO) been internationally influential so it needs a mention under literature. Haven't yet mentioned Melbourne Anarchist Centre, nor (Monty Miller aside!) anything on West Australian anarchism. Nor apart from Aunt Germaine, anything on Australian feminist anarchism Jeremytrewindixon 04:56, 20 July 2007 (UTC)

OK, I've added the press references and (yecch) "You can't Blow Up a Social Reationship" For the moment I've just cited the web. I think the history of the ASF, most notably its agitation among Melbourne public transport workers and its role in the Melbourne Tram Dispute needs to be addressed. Probably also need short separate articles on Collingwood Free Store and JA Andrews. Jeremytrewindixon 07:35, 21 July 2007 (UTC)

Added reference to Julie McCrossin's legendary pamphlet. I note that it is also refeenced on the Lesbian separatism page. Jeremytrewindixon 02:40, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

Monty Miller

New page. Message ends. ☻ Fred|☝ discussion|✍ contributions 10:59, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

Monty Miller attended meetings of the Melbourne Anarchist Club in 1886, 1887. In the 1890s he moved to Western Australia and played an important role in the formation of the Labor Party in Western Australia. When the IWW agitation started, Miller was a pivotal figure in the (Chicago based direct actionist) organisation as an orator in WA.--Takver 08:38, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

expert tag

Have taken liberty of removing it. Justified when applied to original or near original stub version of article. Main addition to article currently needed is round-up of present situation, the concept of single "expert" doesn't really apply. Jeremytrewindixon 04:14, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

Corrections

Most of this article is accurate. However there are two changes that need to be made. Germaine Greer has self-identified herself as an anarchist during the 1960s, 1972, and 1999. This is documented at my website article on Greer. Secondly, Rebel Worker was first published in 1982, not 1978. I have the first issue in my own collection, but it probably also exists in the State Library of NSW. As my website is used for primary and secondary sources for this article, I will refrain from adding or modifying the text substantially and leave the adding of references to my website up to others or discuss the appropriateness of links here on this discussion page first. --Takver 05:08, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

Yep, Takver, very glad you took the time. As it happens I was ahead of you with both of these corrections (although so far as Aunty Germs goes I accept correction only so far as the text as amended by me shows. Anarchism has a number of senses and a conversational "self-identification" as an anarchist is not conclusive. However it is certainly true that there is a deep and broad libertarian streak in Dr Greer's work .) ....Forgot to sign - Jeremytrewindixon 01:06, 7 August 2007 (UTC) Erk, also it seems I had forgotten to correct RW date, must have previewed when I thought I saved. Now done. Look, Takver, I have now read the Greer interview 1972 which is posted on your site. Its a damn good interview and she does identify as an anarchist communist (communism as in marxism) and says much of interest and good sense. 1972 was 35 years ago however; in 1999 all she says is "basically" an anarchist by which she means she isn't into telling people what to do. By anarchist communist in 1972 she seemed to mean a communist who isn't interested in telling people what to do. I don't know that the text needs further correction. (Though I'd like to find a way to put the interview in a footnote because it is such a good interview. http://www.takver.com/history/sydney/greer1972.htm) Anarchist ideas are quite widespread, usually to call someone an anarchist there is required some degree of relating to the ongoing anrchist discussion, working or attempting to work with other anarchists. I don't think this is true of Aunty Germs, valuable though her work is. Jeremytrewindixon 01:58, 7 August 2007 (UTC)

On reflection have referenced 1972 article to this page, and also to Greer's own page. I don't suppose it needs to be on both, and await the views of others. Jeremytrewindixon 08:03, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

punk

Punk and anarcho-punk came to Australia more or less immediately but I don't know a lot about this area. Anarcho-punk was obviously very influential in Australia as elsewhere. I'm hoping someone else might step in here. Jeremytrewindixon 03:29, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

Punk made an initial splash in Australia during 1976-77. The two foremost bands of the time were Radio Birdman from Sydney and The Saints from Brisbane. Anarcho-punk took a little longer to come to the fore and included bands such as The Thought Criminals (Sydney), The Tapeloops (Brisbane) in the late 1970s, early 1980s. In 1982 Redfern Black Rose Anarchist Bookshop in Sydney started importing anarcho-punk records from Britain which included material from the seminal groups CRASS, Poison Girls, Conflict, Flux of Pink Indians, Chumbawamba and many more. Black Rose organised stalls at gigs by US punk band The Dead Kennedys, who were persuaded to do a benefit gig for the bookshop during the tour. Black Rose organised two successful art exhibitions of the record cover art of material produced by anarcho-punk bands from Southern Studios in London: Crass Art and Crass Art II. Crass Art also travelled to Melbourne to the Museum of the Performing Arts. There should be reviews of these exhibitions in the Sydney Morning Herald and the Age that can be used as verifiable secondary sources. I might try digging around my own archives to see what else I can find. --Takver 00:21, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

Richard Neville (writer)

I think any discussion of anarchism in Australia needs to include Richard Neville and the publication of Oz magazine, and then later London Oz. Neville's book Playpower was an important anarcho-hippie text. I remember Neville attended the 1975 Sydney Anarchist Conference. Certainly Neville's entry needs to be expanded with a list of books he has written.

`I was and still am a liberal’, Neville says. `Sometimes then I was a bit embarrassed by it, because I thought I ought to be a little more revolutionary, but I’ve always completely loathed violence and bloodshed and everytime I dived into Marxism all I could think of was Lenin shooting the anarchists. I could never come to terms with the Big Idea. I come from libertarianism.’The Push and Critical Drinkers. --Takver 00:54, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

Melbourne Anarchist Centre, punk, Treason

Following on from the punk subject above......yeah the Melbourne Anarchist Centre in 1983 odd had heaps of Crass and Poison Girls records, and there were people around it who were both punks and anarchists, whether that qualifies them as "anarcho-punks" I don't know enough to judge. Takver mentions the group Tapeloops as a Brisbane anarcho-punk group, actually Tapeloops/Trash of All Nations, or some part thereof, was in Melbourne at this time and involved in both the Melbourne Anarchist Centre and the magazine 'Treason'. I have not mentioned any of this in the article. I was the founder of Treason and naturally regard it as of earth-shattering significance, a major influence on the developement of Australian anarchism and so forth. But my impartiality would have to be in doubt.

'Treason' was founded in 1981, copies are now fairly rare, only the first more or less pilot edition is in the State library. But referenceable traces of it remain in Henry Mayer's Media Information Australia (MIA); he was always very kind to us! MIA will be found in any academic library. Also there was a vitriolic attack in the Bulletin calling on ASIO to suppress or "counter" us. In 1982 or 1983 people from Treason and people who had been involved with Lib Workers set up the Melbourne Anarchist Centre. I notice there is a thesis on the Centre at Melbourne Uni, I was one of the people interviewed for it but have never bothered to have a look at what the hard-up Uni student involved made of us! A couple of stories hang on the MAC but my time is up right now. Jeremytrewindixon 02:17, 21 August 2007 (UTC)

How to Make trouble and Influence People

The reference to this pamphlet under "theory and literature" is misplaced in my view. It is an amusing piece which does represent the "methods of work" of a section of the anarchist movement in australia as elsewhere. So I'm not saying that it should not be mentioned in the article, and am therfore not removing it......but it is not well placed next to influential contributions to anarchist ideas. Jeremytrewindixon 04:20, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

Anti-globalisation protests

Anarchists have played a part in anti-globalisation protests at S11 (protest) against the WEF in Melbourne September 2000, the 2006 G20 summit meeting in Melbourne in November 2006, and the APEC Australia 2007 meeting in Sydney in September - the last two detailed in a small way in the Mutiny collective article. Mention should also be made of Indymedia, although it is not explicitly anarchist, has always had a strong libertarian influence arising from the role of the Catalyst collective from Sydney in building one of the first user contributed news sites (for Seattle WTO meeting in 1999).--Takver 18:25, 15 September 2007 (UTC)

Ref punk and How to Make Trouble

Have introduced first reference to anarcho-punk in main article, and associated "How to Make trouble" link with it which is where I think it belongs. When I get a chance to read the Melbourne Anarchist Centre thesis (referred to above) I will presumably be able to use that as a source with the influence on punk on Austrlain anarchism .....in fact not only Crass-type anarcho-punk but the older Sex Pistols etc punk was widespread in australian anarchism byn then but I understand I need checkable reference to prove it. Meanwhile I hope someone picks up the ball with punk. It's be nice to see Tapeloops get a mention.Jeremytrewindixon 02:17, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

review

As it stands it deserves a start rating, as the coverage is almost entirely history. But what is there is quite good quality work. So if the information on today's movements, characters, links references can be added in it would esily get a B rateing. GB 01:21, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

The article is improving towards a B level, but there are still some suggestions below that should be taken up or refuted! I have yet to find out what importance means for politics, so importance assessment is not yet available. Graeme Bartlett 03:18, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

Importance stays as low as there is no parliamentry reprentatives. Only the major political parties can get to a mid importance. Graeme Bartlett 04:24, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

In Our Time (re Beginnings section)

I have just been reading Verity Burgman's 'In Our Time' about the early socialist movement in Australia which includes quite abit on the Anarchists, enablign the section on "Beginnings" to be revised and I think expanded. (Jeremy Dixon, not logged in, oops) Here we go: Jeremy (talk) 05:35, 8 March 2014 (UTC)

Assessment comment

The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:Anarchism in Australia/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.

Comment(s)

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As it stands it deserves a start rating, as the coverage is almost entirely history. But what is there is quite good quality work. So if the information on today's movements, characters, links references can be added in it would esily get a B rating, and could look for a GA if the same quality is maintained. GB 01:22, 18 July 2007 (UTC) The importance will have to stay as low unless some anrachists are elected to a parliament, or they blow up parliament or something as dramatic. This is based on the Aus politics criteria. Graeme Bartlett 04:21, 9 October 2007 (UTC) This article is borderline. Its coverage is good on the history, but I would like to see the following done before I would consider the article to be B-class: I would like to see the lead expanded per WP:LEAD, an appropriate picture or two added; the references and links fixed per The Manual of Style, and more comprehensive coverage of anarchists in Australia today. Are there specific political causes linked to anarchism that should be named and linked? What's the current state of anarchism in Australia? There's almost nothing here on these sort of things. It should stay at Start-class for the moment, but try these fixes and you'll definitely get a B-class article, if not a GA-class if you work hard on it. JRG 08:13, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

Last edited at 08:13, 12 October 2007 (UTC). Substituted at 07:41, 29 April 2016 (UTC)