Talk:Antisemitism in Greece

ridiculous rightist thug political pov

So the New Democracy rightists who include holocaust deniers and neonazi sympathizers in the government are "sensitive to issues of antisemitism" while the left, with its well known bias against Israel -no denying that- are "the real antisemites"? What hogwash. Can't find the time to argue with revert-bots, good work on cleanwashing far rightist nazi thugs, though. (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Antisemitism_in_Greece&diff=636152809&oldid=636152624) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 46.12.18.187 (talk) 10:38, 1 December 2014 (UTC)

Subjective throughout, Jewish hyper ethno-centrism

The entire article is subjective throughout, it takes a view of Jewish hyper-ethnocentrism and trying to portray the Jews as "victims" of those evil, terrible Greeks. Not neutral at all. Why is there no article for Hellenophobia amongst the Jewish people? In particular, the article portrays Orthodox Christianity as "anti-semitism", where it would not describe Talmudic Judaism as "anti-Christianism", it claims the Golden Dawn party are "the linear heir of the German National Socialists" (as well as choosing selective, Jewish favoured epithets to describe them), it claims Greek leftist criticism of Israeli policy against the Palestinians as "new anti-semitism". All of this is from a purely Jewish-fascist, hyper-ethnocentric POV. I realise that Wikipedia is based in America, where Jews are particularly arrogant and drunk on power, but, to the rest of the world this is ridiculously bias. 94.6.39.45 (talk) 20:42, 16 January 2014 (UTC)

About Hellenophobia amongst Jews... I am as greek and patriotic as it gets. I have met hundreds of Israelis and actually visited Israel a while back... I can assure you, that Israelis have very positive sentiments for the Greeks! I didnt believe it, I saw it... About Karagiozis. It is an Ottoman leftover and in othoman times the different milliets (ethnic groups) were encouraged to compete/ dislike each other because Turks made up the minority in the cities of the west. Anyway I am thirty I grew up with shadow theater and I dont remember any Ovreos. Maybe there was sixty years ago anyway. Modern anti semitism, in my humble opinion starts with the benizelist 3E organisation in thessaloniki, because it was percieved that the Zionist movement there (Maccabean Party) wanted to autonomize the city. Ironically enough it was them (democrats) that collaborated in the HOlocaust. This is what demonized the Jews. Anyway, not saying that there in no antisemitism in Greece, just saying that maybe the more marginal part of the society is the loudest one... (ANONIMOS)

First of all, the name of this article is "Antisemitism in Greece", so this article will describe... well, you know, Antisemitism. And yes- there have been times when Jews were victims, by those evil terribe antisemites. The article describes the situation as it is today, without any biases. You're invited to take a look at reference 20 to understand why "it claims the Golden Dawn party are "the linear heir of the German National Socialists"". By the way, if you think there should be an article for Hellenophobia amongst the Jewish people- write one. Good luck. ScottyNolan (talk) 15:01, 24 February 2014 (UTC)

Perhaps I missed it, but while the article does describe examples of antisemitism within the Greek Orthodox establishment, I see no place where it defines Orthodox Christianity as antisemitism. - Embram (talk) 15:07, 30 January 2015 (UTC)

I am a Jewish Holocaust survivor born and raised in Athens. As a whole the article is mild by comparison to reality. There were Greeks who helped the Jews though many, including the King's Guard (Evzones) !!!!!, collaborated with the Nazis. Greek language and culture are permeated by antisemitism. A popular entertainment was Shadow Theater -- Karagiozis -- where a prominent character is the "Ovraeos" -- an ugly name for Jew -- having many derogatory attributes including terrible looks (big ugly nose etc). Judas Iskariotis -- is the personification of evil. That derives from miswriting the Hebrew Ish-Krayiot i.e. suburbanite ... such ignorance!! My family (I was 8 yrs old) returning from hiding during the Holocaust -- minus my mother -- were told by neighbors "too bad they did not also make you into soap". "What did you (Jews) do to the Germans that they wanted to kill you?!" Now Greeks blame Merkel and Germany for their financial mess ... they should also be asked "What did you do to the Germans ..." I was often confronted with "Why did you kill Christ?" --- and wondered how can people believe in such crap?! We were denied Greek citizenship and were Stateless "akathoristos". Significantly many(most?) Greeks do NOT consider Greece as a good place to live in for a variety of reasons. Conspiracy theories are the order of the day "explaining" their problems by always blaming others and often the Jews. What a pity that Greeks are not like their glorious ancestors!85.250.62.239 (talk) 14:17, 7 February 2014 (UTC)

Well, I wont defend anyone but the facts you mention were and are typical amongst many countries (f.e. blame for Jesus and the period during and after WW2). Abt the karaghiozis, I didnt know it, but i dont think it is popular amongst the new generations, beside it is of turkish origin. I think the modern antisemitism was a heritage of A.Papandreou philo-arab policies and Kissinger's paraphilology, but the last years is not so strong and acceptable cause of the countries approach. Do not forget that Israel had for many years close ties with Turkey. Abt the Greeks, it is funny but you are wrong. They think Greece is the most beautiful place in the world and blame all the time the politicians for any problem. With respect. Greco22 (talk) 18:51, 10 February 2014 (UTC)

Dear Greco, I take no pleasure writing (above and below) about my experiences growing up in Greece as a Jew. On the one hand, I immensely admire the achievements and contributions of the Greeks to Western civilization. It would be good if Greeks also knew and respected the Jewish contributions. Over 1/3 of the Nobel prize winners in the Sciences are Jewish. By comparison, there is about an equal number of Jews as Greeks in the world. Academic achievements rather than "MONEY" are our pride and joy. Please learn about Karagiozis, which as you say is not popular now but was until the 1950's. Read about the ridicule of the "Ovreo"; a reflection of Greek society's deep bias against the "Jew". Having grown among the Greeks I know that they also blame their government for their ills -- but who elects their politicians?! It is then that one hears amazing conspiracy theories. Your allusion to Kissinger (the "Jew") is an example which apparently you do not even realize. If Greeks were only as creative otherwise i.e. like in starting new industries. And with all due respect Greeks are not known for ... working hard. Of course, I know about Israel's "friendship" with Turkey until not so long. Turkey for a long time supported Israel politically and militarily. Are you aware that Greece was the ONLY European country who voted AGAINST the creation of Israel for the UN Partition resolution in 1947? What does that indicate? By the way, there are no "friendships" among countries but only interests as we see from the present re-alignment. Israelis are extremely fond of Greece as witnessed by the songs and the Greek artists who visit here. Do you know that Dalaras career got a big boost from his successes in Israel? The "great" Theodorakis, after earning handsomely from his many appearances in Israel, not so long ago declared "US Jews are behind Greek economic crisis" and other sick garbage! Where were the prominent Greeks who rose to speak against Theodorakis venom? What is this if not a "Jewish conspiracy theory"? Yet we have much much more in common culturally and historically with the Greeks than with the Turks. So please let's work to strengthen this. Every time you hear a Greek calling a Jew "Ovreo", "Tsifouti" etc correct him. We will all be better off that way. And for heaven's sake stop and correct the horrible, slanderous, LIES FALSE accusations against the Jews in the New Testament. e.g. "Jews are the children of the devil" -- John, and the most important: the Crucifixion of Jesus by the Jews. Jesus was a great Jewish patriot fighting the Romans who killed him claiming that he was the "King of the Jews" .... 85.250.62.239 (talk) 13:35, 1 March 2014 (UTC)as they wrote on the cross!!!!! These are the real sources of antisemitism. Thank you and let's look forward to a better world. 85.250.62.239 (talk) 13:35, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

Dear anonymous, most possibly not growing up in Greece, my greetings. Anyway. Let's start. "Over 1/3 of the Nobel prize winners in the Sciences are Jewish. By comparison, there is about an equal number of Jews as Greeks in the world." Ok, cool. You are more clever than Greeks. "Please learn about Karagiozis". Who, me? That's a good one. It's like instructing you to learn about talmud. Anyway, every episode I saw as a kid had no "Ovraios". I am 50 yo. Anyway no Karagiozis anymore for kids, finito, it's like ancient history. "And with all due respect Greeks are not known for ... working hard". Starting a proposition with "All due respect" doesn't show respect. For example, "With all due respect, you are stupid". Plus, according to Eurostat, Greeks are among the hardest working countries, search for the data before you speak. "Do you know that Dalaras career got a big boost from his successes in Israel?" LOL Dalaras "The "great" Theodorakis, after earning handsomely from his many appearances in Israel, not so long ago declared "US Jews are behind Greek economic crisis". Theodorakis IS great. He didn't say that. http://www.zougla.gr/page.ashx?pid=2&aid=305307&cid=4. He DID say the new Isreal is now performs messacres of Palesteanians and that new Israel behaves like it was never been a victim of holocaust etc etc. This is not racism, it is criticism, it's a different thing pal. "By the way, there are no "friendships" among countries but only interests as we see from the present re-alignment." :) :) :) Anyway, PLEASE, don't answer, I have to answer back and I have a LOT of work to do for my daily business. You see I work a lot of hours. The article IS biased and by that I don't mean that there was no possibly sporadic acts of racism to Jews. i believe that this could happen. BUT not in any way as described in the article. Even Golden Dawn that is specifically mentioned in the article, isn't really giving time to antisemitic acts. They prefer the poor Pakistanis. I know because they are class enemies ;) "And for heaven's sake stop and correct the horrible, slanderous, LIES FALSE accusations against the Jews in the New Testament." OK I will Alexopth1512 (talk) 01:49, 4 August 2014 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Alexopth1512 (talk • contribs) 01:44, 4 August 2014 (UTC)

Dear Alexopth1512, you say the article IS biased because "...not in any way as described in the article". I would like to know- what does the article describe that u dont agree with? Every antisemitic incident has a source, every incident *did* happen. so what's the problem? This article called "Antisemitism in greece". so it supposed to describe antisemitism! what else do u expect to find here? I really would like to know :) Oh, and BTW, i'm sorry, but the fact that the nice people in golden dawn prefer to abuse Pakistans doesnt mean they are not antisemitic.ScottyNolan (talk) 18:31, 29 September 2014 (UTC)

Dear ScottyNolan. I am NOT interested THAT much in this article. So, in short, I commented only to answer a ridiculous comment. I call it biased, because if you read it, you have the impression that antisemitism is systematically cultivated, expressed in every day life or about so in Greece etc. I was searching for some historical data and came across this lemma. Anyway I won't argue with this any more, I am not that really interested.

Regarding Golden Dawn, the new fruit of Greek political scene (ok not that new, but 20 years ago they were a bunch of stupid freaks that we were getting entertainment in beating them every week), I am pretty sure they are antisemitic but this is not manifested in (criminal) "organization's" every day works. I don't say that no incident has happened, I say that even if i watch closely the news (and of course of my political enemy Golden Dawn) I haven't noticed such a thing, I don't know. In contrast, till recently we had many incidents with poor immigrants.

Move discussion in progress

There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:3D Test of Antisemitism which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RMCD bot 10:31, 28 August 2014 (UTC)

Yugoslavian Civil War

"Some[who?] consider this argument to be inconsistent with the country's position on other conflicts (for example, Greece's support of Serbs in the Bosnian war)" False analogy. Israelis had not been slaves to Palestinians for 500 years like Serbs were to turkified Slavs. Also Serbs weren't installed into a de facto position of power by Western colonialists. The Yugoslavian War was a civil one between largely equal powers with Serbs trying to reclaim Bosnian territory predominantly populated by Serbs.

Anti-Hellenism in Israel

Despite the aggressive accusations of antisemetism one will certainly not see those evil fascist Greeks attacking a synagogue or prevent Jews from practicing their religious rites: http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/1.726345 http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/.premium-1.644285 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 46.176.30.63 (talk) 16:31, 22 June 2016 (UTC)