Talk:Arrow (TV series)/Archive 5

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Archive 5

Overcategorization

@AlexTheWhovian:, I think you're being overzealous in the application of categories here which are trivial/non-defining. According to our article, Curtis Holt didn't even become a regular until the fifth season, making it unlikely that he's a "main character" and even unlikelier that his presence makes it a "gay-related" show. The article likewise indicates that Hong Kong and Russia only appear in flashbacks. Is this inaccurate? Again, flashbacks, which are a very common narrative device, do not a "nonlinear narrative" make in any sense that is meaningful or useful for categorization. A quick look does not bring up any sources noting that atonement is a major or even a present theme of this show. I understand that you want users to find this article, but this wish cannot override Wikipedia practice. –Roscelese (talk ⋅ contribs) 16:44, 15 December 2017 (UTC)

@Roscelese: Come again? Overzealous? I only restored those categories once after they were removed without explanation. -- Alex^TW 22:49, 15 December 2017 (UTC)

So now that you've seen my explanation in both the edit summary and the talk page, you won't restore them again? –Roscelese (talk ⋅ contribs) 16:37, 16 December 2017 (UTC)

Plot detail or character development?

Recently, I re-added the removal of the last sentence in the Adrian Chase cast section. The sentence noted the demise of the character - a fairly common end to a character arc. Apparently, there is some disagreement as to whether a character committing suicide to gain revenge on the main characters is character development (ie. the ending of the character's development), or merely a plot detail. Thoughts? - Jack Sebastian (talk) 18:58, 16 December 2017 (UTC)

Home media

When did we go back into outlining every special feature across each DVD release? Per WP:MOSTV#Home media and streaming services, "Features about a home media set should be presented in prose format, with focus only going to unique features. Listing of every episode with a commentary track or deleted scenes is discouraged — this type of information can be readily provided by any sales vendor. Instead, focusing on special featurettes that discuss something unique about the season would be appropriate." -- Except I've noticed that all the pages somewhere got changed back to a per season, here are all the features on the DVD format. We're not here to sell a product.  BIGNOLE  (Contact me) 14:16, 6 December 2018 (UTC)

Besides the use of table vs prose, is there another issue here? From looking at the table, none of the special features listed is an episode commentary track and are in fact special features. --Gonnym (talk) 15:23, 6 December 2018 (UTC)

The point of the MOS was the not have "gag reel", "deleted scenes", etc. (non-relevant stuff) listed every time a home-media section is created. That's why it says use prose to summarize features. I'm not entirely bothered by the use of prose versus just a single list. Originally, there wasn't multiple cells for every DVD release to house their features. It was one single cell that identify key features across the entirety (because which one you find them in is irrelevant because we're not selling a product). The reason prose is generally preferred is to provide context as to why that feature is important to note. For example, a table cannot tell me what "Arrow Comes Alive" is about. I could guess, but I imagine that explaining it to a reader provides much more valuable information than just listing it on a table like it was pulled from the back of the DVD boxset.  BIGNOLE  (Contact me) 17:35, 6 December 2018 (UTC)

Arrow series viewers (in millions overview) is it wrong ?

Hi guys I visit very frequently wikipedia for information and I found something that propably is wrong on Arrow tvseries wiki information: here it reports that the season 5 average viewers in millions are 2.21 but this must be wrong because in 23 episodes the viewers are not up of 2 millions except of one episode so I sum all viewers of every episode and I divide it with the number of total episodes and the result is 1,75 and not 2,21 (another source which proves that I am correct is here: so what is the correct thing if my number is correct how can we inform wikipedia to update it with the correct number and if I am wrong how this number is (2,21) is comming? Thnx in advance

References

Cast

We're missing some sources that confirm the series regular status for some of these cast. It seems like we've gotten into a "they were the main villain so their a regular" habit that isn't always accurate.  BIGNOLE  (Contact me) 13:02, 12 April 2019 (UTC)

Cast and characters a fork

Arrow (TV series)#Cast and characters is essentially a fork of List of Arrow characters#Main characters. I've worked recently in trying to minimize the amount of forking and duplication of data between all Arrow-related pages, but since this would be a big change, I thought best to bring it up here first. Currently we have the main cast listed in both places and update the list, the text and the references in both - that's just pointless. Instead, we should transclude the main cast table here, and have the cast list there. Thoughts? --Gonnym (talk) 19:49, 11 July 2019 (UTC)

They really aren't the same (nor should be made to be the same). - Brojam (talk)

Could you elaborate? What isn't the same? This is what we have on Oliver Queen from both sections:

Oliver Jonas Queen (portrayed by Stephen Amell; main: season 1–present) is a billionaire playboy who returns to his home of Starling City after being apparently stranded on a desert island for five years and presumed dead. On his return, he embarks on a secret double life as a masked vigilante known as 'The Hood'. In season four, his vigilante persona becomes known as Green Arrow. He also appears in Arrowverse spin-off shows The Flash, Legends of Tomorrow and Supergirl, as well as animated web series Vixen. He also plays a central role in the annual Arrowverse crossover events.

The character is based on the DC comics character Green Arrow.

Stephen Amell as Oliver Queen / Arrow / Green Arrow (main: season 1–present), a billionaire playboy turned hooded vigilante-hero who is initially known as the "Hood", "Vigilante", and simply "Arrow". He is based on the DC Comics character Green Arrow. He survives on an isolated island for five years after the sinking of his father's yacht. Oliver returns to his home city with a mission—to right the wrongs of his father and save the city from the crime that has grown in his absence. Amell was one of the first actors to audition for the role, and Kreisberg felt that he "hit the target from the outset" and "everyone else just paled in comparison". In season six's finale, Oliver confesses he's the Green Arrow and is sent to prison where he's known as "Inmate 4587". The actor, who was already in shape from Rent-a-Goalie, did physical fitness training at Tempest Freerunning Academy in Reseda, California. Amell received archery training as well, which included watching a video on how archery has been displayed inaccurately or poorly in television and film before learning the basics of shooting a bow. For Amell, the appeal of portraying Queen was that he saw multiple roles tied to the same character: "There's Queen the casual playboy; Queen the wounded hero; Queen the brooding Hamlet; Queen the lover; Queen the man of action, and so on". Amell also portrays Dark Arrow (Oliver's Earth-X doppelganger) in the sixth season's crossover "Crisis on Earth-X".

Aside from the different word choice, they are describing the same thing. --Gonnym (talk) 22:18, 11 July 2019 (UTC)

I was talking about all the main characters in general since we should not have some characters being forked while others not. Just makes it confusing for people who want to edit. Also the Oliver Queen section at List of Arrow characters could honestly use some expansion. - Brojam (talk) 22:30, 11 July 2019 (UTC)

I'm a bit confused then from your response and we might not be understanding each other. I'm not intrested in any fork. All character information in one place - at List of Arrow characters#Main characters. Here you only have the table (similar to the situation with the episode series table). The characters should all have the same information for them - in-universe plot and real world production information. But in the current situation where someone adds a piece to one and not the other leads to just bad writing on our part. --Gonnym (talk) 22:35, 11 July 2019 (UTC)

Oh wow, I completely misunderstood your proposal. Sorry about that. I just figured it would be similar to what you did for the plot sections in the leads of each season article. I'm personally not a fan of having the cast section in the main article replaced by a table. For your agrument about the updating, seeing how this is the final season, I don't think it's that big of an issue since we very soon won't have to update these anymore. - Brojam (talk) 22:45, 11 July 2019 (UTC)

Sadly, I doubt that it means that. I will probably mean that just less people will be updating and watching this, which just means it will probably be even worse as times goes on. --Gonnym (talk) 06:37, 12 July 2019 (UTC)

@Brojam: unrelated to the characters, but not worth creating a new section. Should the rating information be in the list of episodes article or main article? Seems strange we have two different sections with different data and presentation. --Gonnym (talk) 06:42, 12 July 2019 (UTC)