Talk:Bangsamoro Republik

Question

Does the Bangsamoro Republik actually control any territory? Blaylockjam10 (talk) 09:31, 10 September 2013 (UTC)

No, it does not as the Autonomous Region in Muslim Mindanao (currently headed by its rival political party, the MILF) is the sole government in this region, which as pointed out in the article does not support this self-declared republic. The same group behind the Bangsamoro Republik now were themselves former leaders and governors of this autonomous region, so in effect, this whole declaration of independence is their way of trying to regain leadership. Neither the autonomous region nor the Sultanate of Sulu where this group originated, recognize such republic though. A self-declared unrecognized pseudo-state is what Bangsamoro Republik really is. --RioHondo (talk) 17:41, 10 September 2013 (UTC)

OK, then this really isn't a sovereign state. Blaylockjam10 (talk) 07:28, 11 September 2013 (UTC)

Yes it does control territory, four villages near Zamborga are under its control. It fits the criteria of the Montevideo convention for statehood. How long it will fit the criteria is another question entirely, but for the time being it does.XavierGreen (talk) 15:55, 11 September 2013 (UTC)

The terrorist groups Abu Sayyaf and BIFF "controls" more villages in Basilan and Sulu if hostage-taking is your idea of territorial control and authority which is what the Zamboanga siege is. Total of 200 hostages in four villages. -- RioHondo (talk) 16:54, 11 September 2013 (UTC)

Control of a permanantly controlled place is one of the criteria for statehood under the declarative theory, since the Bangasmoro Republik is in control of the villages it holds in Zamboanga it meets the criteria. Abu Sayyaf and BIFF have not declared independence so they do not meet the criteria for statehood even if they hold territory. If BIFF declares its allegiance to the Bangasmoro Republic than any places it controls would be relavant for purposes of determining whether Bangasmoro meets the criteria (it would stregnthen its case for inclusion under the criteria).XavierGreen (talk) 21:41, 11 September 2013 (UTC)

Okay.. And, Article 11 that prohibits using military force to gain recognition of sovereignty? Did you factor that into your equation? Villages being controlled and held against their will? --RioHondo (talk) 23:04, 11 September 2013 (UTC)

Villages under the control by the MNLF is in fact the reason why Bangsamoro is considered a state under the declarative theory. Its not my equation, its the declarative theory of statehood. The determining factors as for what is and what is not a state for the purposes of Wikipedia's have been well established. For a polity to be considered a state it must meet either the criteria for the declarative theory (declaration of independence, a defined territory, control of a permanently populated place, a government, and the capacity to enter relations with other states) or the constitutive theory (be recognized by one or more other states). It can easily be argues that military force has been used to gain sovereignty in virtually all of the states in existence throughout history, and in fact that it is the monopoly on military force that allows a state to exist. If you wish to challenge the status quo the place to do that would likely be on the talk page of the list of sovereign states, that is the place where issues regarding what is and what is not a state are ultimately hammered out around here.XavierGreen (talk) 01:38, 12 September 2013 (UTC)

Okay.. And, if the so called president of this imaginary state disowns his own militia group and denies involvement in the present occupation of these villages? 1 2 3 4 --RioHondo (talk) 08:11, 12 September 2013 (UTC)

Independence?

Are they any reliable sources that confirm this declaration? Web-site of MNLF said nothing about this. No text of this “declaration”, no text of “constitution”, nothing. We don’t know if statehood was really declared. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 194.165.48.90 (talk) 09:02, 20 September 2013 (UTC)

Starting in 1974?

The Bangsamoro Republik was declared in 2013, not 1974. Several Bangsamoro state have been declared; another instance would be in 2012. This article should be about the 2013 entity. [Soffredo] 01:26, 17 November 2013 (UTC)

Bangsamoro Republik was already proclaimed in 1974. I can post the entire text of the proclamation in 1974. They then waged a ware against the Philippine government and they captured the town of Jolo, Sulu, which the government forces had to retake. The entire town was burned down as a result. -- Namayan (talk) 16:10, 20 November 2013 (UTC)

What should be done in this case is one article for the Bangsamoro Republik, with sections in 1974, 2012 and 2013.-- Namayan (talk) 16:18, 20 November 2013 (UTC)