Talk:Battle of Maysalun

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GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Battle of Maysalun/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: FunkMonk (talk · contribs) 19:38, 1 March 2016 (UTC)

• This looks interesting. There's a citation needed tag, though! FunkMonk (talk) 19:38, 1 March 2016 (UTC)

Thanks for taking this nomination @FunkMonk:. I guess that missing citation must've slipped, but I added a ref now and changed some of the wording there. --Al Ameer (talk) 03:58, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

• "Salibi, Kamal S. (2003). A House of Many Mansions: The History of Lebanon Reconsidered. I. B. Tauris. p. 33. ISBN 9781860649127. "At the battle of the Maysalun Pass, in the Anti-Lebanon, the French did crush the forces of King Faysal in July 1920, which finally opened the way for their occupation of Damascus. Maronite volunteers reportedly fought with the French in the battle, and there were open Maronite celebrations of the French victory, or rather of the Arab defeat. This was not to be forgotten in Damascus."" This seems more like a footnote?
• To me, it seems the above non-free quote could just be cut entirely.

Agree. It was added by another user, but I don't think it adds anything to the article. Al Ameer (talk) 18:32, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

• "The image Poy-web.jpg could need a description template on Commons.

I just replaced the image with a new one. Al Ameer (talk) 20:38, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

• The infobox image seems to have iffy source and author info. Can it be elaborated/improved?

I couldn't find any original source information. It appears to be free, but in any case I uploaded a similar image from SyrianHistory.com until someone could find any details about the other image. Al Ameer (talk) 20:38, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

• "Towards the end of World War I and as part of the Arab Revolt against the Ottoman Empire, the Sharifian Army led by Emir Faisal, backed by the British Army, captured Damascus from the Ottomans on 30 October 1918. " I think I'd rejig this sentence like this: "On 30 October 1918, towards the end of World War I, the Sharifian Army led by Emir Faisal, and backed by the British Army, captured Damascus from the Ottomans as part of the Arab Revolt against the Ottoman Empire."

Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:32, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

• "In correspondences between the Sharifian leadership" Perhaps mention where they were based?

Done. Al Ameer (talk) 20:38, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

• "In the US-led June 1919 King–Crane Commission, the commission concluded in 1922" Why two different dates?

Clarified. (the conclusions of the commission were published in 1922). Al Ameer (talk) 18:32, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

• "over the Ottomans' former Arab territories." Over the former Arab territories of the Ottoman Empire?

Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:32, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

• "the latter promised to support the establishment of a Sharifian kingdom in the Arab provinces of the Ottoman Empire" Perhaps add this would be after victory? Perhaps obvious, but the article doesn't seem to mention the end of WW1.

Sorry, I'm not sure I understand the suggestion. Where should we relocate this part of the sentence? I added a quick mention that WWI ended less than a month after the capture of Damascus though. Al Ameer (talk) 18:32, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

Your addition is fine. FunkMonk (talk) 20:25, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

• "However, when a French officer was assaulted by Shia Muslim rebels opposed to the French presence," Where was the attack?

Will try to pinpoint, I think it was somewhere in the Beqaa Valley. Al Ameer (talk) 18:32, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

Clarified and added some more background material. Al Ameer (talk) 21:04, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

• "On 23 July, Al-'Azma set out from Damascus with his forces" You do not explain prior to this whether Faisal accepted that they should confront the French?

I'm not sure if I provided the direct answer to that specific question, but hopefully the Prelude I just added answers the question of what exactly happened in the two days before the actual battle. The line you quoted is from Moubayed whose book is not really detailed. I'll try to replace the line with a more detailed one soon. Al Ameer (talk) 19:13, 4 March 2016 (UTC)

• "The Syrians' camel cavalry were the first Syrian units to engage the French." The first "Syrian's" seems redundant here.

Revised. --Al Ameer (talk) 18:32, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

Ok, though I'd remove the latter mention, not the former. FunkMonk (talk) 20:25, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

• "about the battle from the Syrians' side." I'd just say Syrian side.

Revised. --Al Ameer (talk) 18:32, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

• "Faisal departed the country on 27 July" To where?

Clarified. Al Ameer (talk) 20:38, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

• "The commander of the French forces was General Mariano Goybet." He should be presented at first mention.

Question: Do you think I should rearrange the sections so that "Combatants and arms" immediately precedes the "Battle" section instead of being the last section? Al Ameer (talk) 18:32, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

Good question... I haven't reviewed that many battle articles, so I'm not sure what is the standard. Perhaps look at some other promoted ones? FunkMonk (talk) 20:44, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

• "and the states of Damascus and Aleppo." For any particular groups?

If we're talking religious sects, then the Sunni Muslims I assume. However, the source doesn't say so explicitly and it may be because as the majority and the "mainstream" population under the Ottomans and earlier rulers, the Sunni population at the time didn't really see the need to fly their colors so to speak. The more relevant divisions were between urban and rural and Aleppo and Damascus. In any case, all these sectarian/regional/class differences were manipulated/aggravated by the French to stamp out the prevailing Syrian and Arab nationalist sentiments in the country. --Al Ameer (talk) 18:32, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

• "The event was annually commemorated by Syrians, during which thousands would visit the grave of al-'Azma in Maysalun.[34]" Was or is?

The source makes clear that between the battle and 1930, the event was commemorated on a yearly basis. According to a 1930 newspaper the source cites: "Syrians still visit en masse the martyr's tomb in Maysaloun, where they put bouquets of flowers and pour tears of sorrow and pain." I know that the Syria still commemorates it because of Syrian news reports that mention the commemoration in 2010 and 2014, I just don't know if it would be accurate to say "thousands still visit the grave" on the battle's anniversary. I'll inquire a bit more and adjust the text accordingly. Al Ameer (talk) 19:13, 4 March 2016 (UTC)

• "and French Army of the Levant" The French.

Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:32, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

• "close to the Lebanese border." Current border. Also, this is not mentioned in the article body.

Removed altogether, unless you think it should be restored. Al Ameer (talk) 18:32, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

• Though the intro is meant to be a summary of the article, there is very little about the background in it?

Revised. Let me know if the lead is satisfactory now. --Al Ameer (talk) 18:32, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

• "in the Hauran" Hauran region?

Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 20:38, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

• "or face that bombardment of their encampments" Seems malformed.

Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 20:38, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

I've gone through the points above and you can let me know if there's anything else that needs to be addressed. I will find out more on Maysalun's present-day commemorations and I also plan to flesh out the Legacy section in general a bit more. --Al Ameer (talk) 19:13, 4 March 2016 (UTC)

All looks good to me then, so will pass it, and I'm sure you will add more good information if you find it. FunkMonk (talk) 21:33, 4 March 2016 (UTC)

@FunkMonk: As always, thanks for a thorough review. I could always count on an article becoming much better after you've reviewed it. And I'll add some more info hopefully soon. Cheers, --Al Ameer (talk) 23:13, 4 March 2016 (UTC)