Talk:Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati

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Initiation by Srila Gaurakisora dasa Babaji

In Response to some recent edits which I feel bordered on vandalism, here is some evidence pointing to the fact of Srila Bhaktisiddhanta's initiation from Srila Gaurakisora dasa Babaji.

From Web Articles

'In 1900 Gaurakisora Dasa Babaji accepted Bhaktivinoda's son, Bimal Prasad, as his disciple. He gave him the name Varsabhanavi-devi-dayita Dasa; he also gave him the tiger-skin hat and basket that had been given to Gaurakisora by his spiritual master Bhagavat Dasa Babaji, which he in turn had received from Jagannatha dasa Babaji. Varsabhanavi-devi-dayita Dasa later became known as Srila Bhakisiddanta Saraswati Swami Prapbhupada, and was the founder of the Caitanya Mathas and Gaudiya Mathas.'

• see: http://www.iskcon.com/about/parampara/gaurakisora.html

'Srila Gaurakisora,and Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura, manifested one pastime which shows how unflinching devotional service to Lord Krishna is situated far above mundane morality and scholarship. Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati was very pure in nature, a strict follower of Vaisnava principles, and very learned in all the scriptural conclusions. He was instructed by Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura to take initiation from Srila Gaurakisora. He went to Srila Gaurakisora and prayed to him. Srila Gaurakisora, hearing his prayer, said to him, "I must first ask Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu whether or not I can be merciful unto you. Only then will I be able to give you my decision." The next day Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati, again approached Srila Gaurakisora. Srila Gaurakisora answered him, "I have forgotten to ask my Lord." In great anxiety and distress, Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati said, "If you do not bestow your mercy upon me, then I will be unable to live any longer." On the third day, Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati approached Srila Gaurakisora for initiation. Srila Gaurakisora replied,"I asked Caitanya Mahaprabhu if I could bestow my mercy upon you, but He replied," The quality of mundane morality and academic scholarship is considered insignificant in light of pure devotion." Hearing this, Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati boldly replied, "You are the crown jewel of all deceptors who worship Lord Krsna, and now you will also try to deceive me? If I do not receive the mercy of your lotus feet, then I will certainly give up my life. Srila Ramanujacarya approached Gosthipurna eighteen times for initiation, and later received his mercy. So I will continue to approach you, until one day I will certainly receive your causeless mercy. This is my most serious promise."'

'Upon hearing this, Srila Gaurakisora became very pleased to see the determination of Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati,and bathed him with the dust of his lotus feet. On that day, within the island of Godruma, in the beautiful garden of Svananda-Sukhada-kunja, Srila Gaurakisora initiated Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati as his disciple.'

• From: http://www.gosai.com/chaitanya/saranagati/html/guardians/gaura-kisora-bio-4.html

Quotes from Senior Vaishnavas

Srila Prabhupada often quotes the fact of his guru's initiation throughout his books:

'Srila Gaurakisora dasa Babaji, the spiritual master of Om Vishnupada Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Gosvami Maharaja, the divine master of our humble self.'

• Quote from A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada

see: http://www.vedabase.net/cc/adi/1/summary/en1

'Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakura did not receive diksa in a dream. He received initiation from Gaurakisora dasa Babaji. Because of Saraswati Thakur’s innovations, many in the orthodox community doubted that he was initiated at all. However, he was giving initiation in the presence of Gaurakisora, his diksa guru, and Bhaktivinoda Thakura, his siksa guru, with their blessings. The thousands of devotees who joined Bhaktisiddhanta and under his direction preached widely for Mahaprabhu exemplified those blessings. Most were well aware of the Gaudiya sampradaya, but it was not until they met Bhaktisiddhanta that they became enlivened to actually join it--not only join, but also sacrifice. Sacrifice and surrender was the standard of Bhaktisiddhanta’s Gaudiya Matha monasteries. This is evidence enough for his followers.'

• Quote from Swami B. V. Tripurari

see: http://www.swami.org/sanga/archives/pages/volume_seven/v07n15.html

'He was being trained like this and Bhaktivinoda Thakura, he moved right here, Godrumadvipa. Gaurakisora dasa Babaji also moved in, or used to come to listen to Bhaktivinoda Thakura's talks. Bhaktivinoda Thakura instructed, "You take initiation from Gaurakisora dasa Babaji. First attempt, few attempts, "No, no, no, I have to consult. . . ." "I will give up my life, kandiya kandiya prana na rakhibo aro, I will not keep my life, I will give up my life!" "OK, sit down." He was initiated, Sri Varsabhanavi-devi dayita, you are very dear to varsabhanavi-devi, that's Radharani, you are very dear to Radharani. That was the name given by Gaurakisora dasa Babaji Maharaja. And "Krsna-sambandha vijnana. He had learned from Bhaktivinoda Thakur and more things he learned from Gaurakisora Das Babaji Maharaja, the science of Krsna, prabhave namah. Very powerful he was, unto such Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakur we offer our most humble obeisances.'

• Quotation from talk by HH Lokanath Swami

see: http://www.gopala.org/index.php/2006/02/20/srila_bhaktisiddhanta_sarasvati_thakura — Preceding unsigned comment added by GourangaUK (talk • contribs) 11:00, 12 April 2006‎ (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Bsst.jpg

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BetacommandBot (talk) 03:54, 12 February 2008 (UTC)

WP:INDIA Banner/Orissa Addition

Note: {{WP India}} Project Banner with Orissa workgroup parameters was added to this article talk page because the article falls under Category:Orissa or its subcategories. Should you feel this addition is inappropriate , please undo my changes and update/remove the relavent categories to the article -- Amartyabag ^TALK2ME 03:00, 5 July 2008 (UTC)

Gaudiya Math

• Merge The Gaudiya Math, specifically centered around Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura's preaching mission, ended with his death. Thanks. Ism schism (talk) 18:13, 25 April 2010 (UTC)
• Merge The article is about actually non-registered system and not about an organization, entirely by the Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura and those who continue after him. Wikid^as© 19:09, 25 April 2010 (UTC)
• Oppose It doesn't matter what it is about. What matters is that Gaudiya Math is covered in multiple reliable sources. Please stop this nonsensical merging campain. It looks like vandalism to me.

(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)--Gaura79 (talk) 09:49, 27 April 2010 (UTC)

Reliable Sources

The sources shown in this article are almost entirely internal to ISKON and from that wp:POV. On WP we need sources from more objective viewpoints, which is always difficult in areas of religion. Comparative works must be available for a person of such influence. Let's track some down and use them, lest this be dismissed as merely an ISKON hagiography. LeadSongDog come howl! 13:51, 25 July 2013 (UTC)

Copy Right Violation

In the external links section, a link to PDF file of the entire book "Shri Bhaktisiddhanta Vaibhava" is provided. This book is copyrighted by Bhakti Vikas Trust and is illegally hosted by krishnapath.org. Sharing of this link on wikipedia amounts to copyright viloation and hence I am removing the link from the article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.150.210.187 (talk) 03:24, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

Don't be ridiculous. It's from 1869, a 1936 printing. Even if we do his life plus 70 years we only get to 2007: a good seven plus years in the public domain. Not to mention, no copyright in the pdf. Where are you getting this copyright information from?Iṣṭa Devatā (talk) 22:43, 14 July 2015 (UTC)

Oops, I thought you were referring to the Bhagavatam lecture. Don't know about the other one, but following the link you removed http://www.krishnapath.org/ it appears to be a book that was written for free distribution, and says so in the body of the pdf. Do you have any copyright info for this?Iṣṭa Devatā (talk) 22:59, 14 July 2015 (UTC)

The site (see http://www.krishnapath.org/library/) consists mainly of copyrighted material, brazenly published without permission. Unsuitable for reference in WP. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:C1:401:B200:A913:1F96:9A4E:CDE2 (talk) 22:11, 18 November 2015 (UTC)

Requested move of February 21, 2014

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: page moved Cinosaur (talk) 01:28, 22 February 2014 (UTC)

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Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura → Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati – The name "Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati" without the honorific 'Thakura' is a much more common name for the subject of this article in academic sources. Also, the use of 'Thakura' in the article's title is less preferred per the MoS. Therefore it is better to rename the article to "Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati", leaving a redirect to it at its current location. Cinosaur (talk) 14:33, 21 February 2014 (UTC)

• Rename, as nominator Cinosaur (talk) 14:42, 21 February 2014 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Promotion of ISKCON founder with link spam and honorifics

@Dāsānudāsa, please refrain from the Promotion of ISKCON founder with link spam and honorifics. These honorifics are discussed in ACB's article. They do not need to be added everywhere he is named. Venkat TL (talk) 09:07, 4 January 2022 (UTC)

[Copied from User talk:Venkat TL]: Hi again, just to remind you the honorific here is the Prabhupada, not the Swami, which is part of the gentleman in question's name. With an honorific "Swami" (like saying Swami Vivekananda or Swami Rama), he would be Swami Swami, as his sannyasi name is Swami (like Vivekananda or Rama). Dāsānudāsa (talk) 09:10, 4 January 2022 (UTC)

To use this article as an example, the Bhaktisiddhanta is equivalent to the Bhaktivedanta and the Saraswati to the Swami. Thanks Dāsānudāsa (talk) 09:11, 4 January 2022 (UTC)

ACB is not Vivekananda. What is your justification of adding link spam when these two links are already included in the section once. --Venkat TL (talk) 09:28, 4 January 2022 (UTC)

I'm not adding anything. I have reverted your removing something. That said, it is your removing part of ACBS's name that I object to, not the "see also" in the crises of succession section, so I have taken that back out. Dāsānudāsa (talk) 09:52, 4 January 2022 (UTC)

@Venkat TL: You are AGAIN removing half of AC Bhaktivedanta Swami (Prabhupada)'s name, despite having been reverted multiple times across multiple articles for doing so. As I have explained multiple times, it is his name, not an honorific title (equivalent to the Sarasvati in Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati's name). It's becoming disruptive. Please abide by WP:BRD and build consensus before doing so again. Dāsānudāsa (talk) 07:28, 5 January 2022 (UTC)

It’s very confusing to refer to A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada simply as “Bhaktivedanta” because Bhaktivedanta is not a name, it’s an honorific. Several other people connected with Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati are also known as Bhaktivedanta, such as for instance Srila Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja. Iamrcr (talk) 12:34, 15 July 2022 (UTC)

Proper name and honorifics

Starting this discussion to resolve a dispute User:103.2.135.33 has regarding the subject's name:

Should the article have the person's full name and honorifics like this? Why/why not? — AP 499D25 (talk) 11:33, 13 February 2024 (UTC)

WP:NCIN is quite clear that honorifics like "Srila", "Goswami", "Thakur", "Prabhupada" etc. don't belong if they are not part of the person's common name, otherwise we'd end up with ridiculous formations like Sri Srimad Guruji So-and-So Paramahansa Maharaja, etc., etc., as is common in the Indian religions. The use of the title "Prabhupada" is already mentioned later on in the lead para, anyway. Dāsānudāsa (talk) 12:48, 13 February 2024 (UTC)