Talk:Black Hawk (Sauk leader)/Archive 1

Archive 1

Fort Madison

Was Black Hawk involved in the expulsion of the Americans from Fort Madison, Iowa? Bigturtle 31 Dec 2005

Two things:

The answer to the above question is, yes and no. Black Hawk did in fact lead the British Band and 500+ warriors (plus families) to Fort Madison in the spring of 1832 (mid-April). I'm not so sure if there was an explusion, however, as his main beef was with settlers who had desecrated lad east of the Mississippi in Illinois. More than anything, Fort Madison served as a meeting point as Black Hawk was calling a congregation of warriors from several different tribes. Please refer to Roger L. Nichols, Black Hawk and the Warrior's Path, for a more detailed description of the events (particularly pgs. 112-116).

Secondly, in reference to the title of this main entry it should be noted that Black Hawk was never in fact a Chief. This is a misnomer. War leaders who rose to prominent positions of honor were often not tribal/civil Chiefs that actually made the decisions for the tribes and that is the case here. Chiefdom among the Sauks was derrived from hereditary linage (until the Americans basically appointed another vocal leader, Keokuk, as Chief by recognizing his authority over the Sauks) and Black Hawk was never recognized as a tribal leader.

-J. Canales, Madison, WI 16 Jun 2006

Thanks for your comment. I've looked into this and I think the basic problem is that "chief" is an English translation of more than one term or rank. The Sauk seem to have had civil, war, and ceremonial chiefs, and I frequently find Black Hawk called a "war chief". Perhaps "general" or "commander-in-chief" is a better translation, but it isn't common English for Indians. --Dhartung | Talk 06:40, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

The Original question might also be asking about the 1813 defeat of the U.S. Army at the Fort Madison military post. According to Black Hawk's autobiography, he participated in several of the sieges of the fort, including the coordinated Sept 1812 attack, but he was not part of the Summer of 1813 siege that finally led to the fort's abandonment. Billwhittaker (talk) 15:16, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

Quotes

Shouldn't these be moved to Wikiquote? 69.4.101.103 03:58, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

I Feel an article on a historic person we know so comparatively little about as Black Hawk actually needs some (as many as possible in fact) quotes (and information around when and what circumstances of the quotes. This is really important to the history of persons we know little about, since it can give the best clues as to the actual role of that person in historical events. If not a historical article would be misleading in that it plays down, or ignores the role of minorities and their impact for their nations and communities. Most all European leaders or historic persons have huge pages abundant with information and references. In the case of the Native Americans we need as much material as possible to even grasp a tiny portion of the actual impact and roles they played historically. Nunamiut (talk) 09:19, 3 November 2009 (UTC)

Burial

I have replaced the incorrect statement that Black Hawk is buried in Jefferson Barracks, with a brief summary of his burial, theft of his body and its eventual destruction in a fire in 1855. This summary is consistent with numerous, credible sources (for example, an online article on Black Hawk's life from the Davenport Public Library's website, http://www.qcmemory.org/Default.aspx?PageId=260&nt=207&nt2=229 ). Jethro1 08:54, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

Thanks! I formatted it further, so now it's properly referenced.--Dhartung | Talk 09:13, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

Sources

• Early life, 1881, says he was Potawatomi by birth
• Early life, 1849, confirms the above, confirms not a chief by birth but says he was Sac by birth
• Black Hawk autobio, he says he was Sac
• Bit on his early life
• On Jim Thorpe
• Info on him in footnote

IvoShandor 09:50, 4 October 2007 (UTC)