Talk:Bob Keeshan

Untitled

Was he really 76 years old or is he lying about his age.

Ummm, huh? Apparently the birth & death dates are correct, and the age given as well. Beanbatch 23:30, 1 August 2005 (UTC)

"The responsibility of parents is to raise children who do not need parents."

I'm not sure what he means by that. Does anyone know?

Well I assume he means that a parent should teach and tutor their children to the point that the children are able to thrive independently of the parent.

On another note, I read an email saying that Bob Keeshan won the Navy Cross at Iwo Jima. Any truth to that?

This is debunked on snopes.com (http://www.snopes.com/military/marvin.asp). The statement in Trivia that Marvin served with Keeshan at Iwo Jima is also debunked at snopes and other urban legend websites. I believe it should be removed from this article.

• I've removed the discussion about this that someone place improperly within the body of the article (discussions go on Talk pages, not IN the article). As to that person's claim to have seen the show, I can only submit two facts: that Tonight Show records and transcripts indicate Lee Marvin never told this story on the show, and if Marvin ever told it anywhere, it was false, for the reasons described in the article -- that he never served on Iwo Jima and that Bob Keeshan never saw combat or overseas duty. Monkeyzpop (talk) 06:44, 8 February 2008 (UTC)

• • Bob Keeshan enlisted in the Marines: True. He was in combat with Lee Marvin, served on Iwo Jima: False. . Keeshan never saw combat of any kind, therefore he could not receive the Navy Cross. MR2David (talk) 04:33, 24 May 2016 (UTC)

The myth about Lee Marvin seeing Bob Keeshan has been perpetuated in an interview of Tom Hanks by Stephen Colbert: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aHrlEW_44pI In the interview, Hanks asserts that Marvin told Johnny Carson that he saw Bob Keesham during the landing of Iwo Jima. Earlier in the Hanks interview they reference a Dick Cavett interview of Marvin where Marvin does talk about his WWII experience. He never claims to have seen Keesham or been at Iwo Jima. See the Cavett interview here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iPcyYvDs2WI Great interview, but Marvin never makes any wild claims. And, of course, Marvin was never at Iwo Jima either. Psywaropshistory91 (talk) 19:43, 31 August 2024 (UTC)

References

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Dartmouth class of 1942?

How could he be born in 1927, serve in the Marine reserves, and "later" become an honorary member of the Dartmouth class of 1942? All of this by the age of 15? Could someone please clarify? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.50.200.15 (talk) 10:55, 3 September 2007 (UTC)

He was 18 years old in 1945, and plenty of folks signed up for WWII before the age of 18. As for Dartmouth, I don't understand why that year was chosen - but Keeshan's son graduated from Dartmouth (undergrad and grad) in the 1970s, so presumably they gave a retro "honorary" membership because of this connection. - DavidWBrooks 12:55, 3 September 2007 (UTC)

It is inaccurate that Mr. Keeshan received the Kennedy Center Honors in 1987. There is no record of Mr. Keeshan ever receiving this honor.

Source: —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.78.224.188 (talk) 15:19, 21 April 2009 (UTC)

References

Monkeyzpop, your terminology is incorrect

Pertaining to Lee Marvin's military service: "Invalided out" is not a term used by the United States Marine Corps. The proper term is "medically discharged." Your continued use of that term describing Lee Marvin's discharge from the USMC is offensive, technically and historically inaccurate, and does not portray an appropriately neutral point of view. See http://military.discovery.com/convergence/celebrities/about/about.html for more information about Lee Marvin's military service. Please do not undo my changes again, otherwise your account may be suspended for vandalism. Please review WP:NPOV. - 96.255.26.223 (talk) 03:28, 16 December 2009 (UTC)

First off, my edit was not vandalism, and you should pay attention to one of the first rules of Wikipedia, as noted on the edit page: "If you do not want your writing to be edited, used, and redistributed at will, then do not submit it here." Secondly, as a Marine myself, I am quite aware of the difference between "invalided out" and "medically discharged." Thirdly, nothing in the article states (or requires) precise military terminology. Marvin was removed ("invalided out") from the combat zone AT THE TIME DESCRIBED, but he was NOT medically discharged from service until quite some time following THE TIME DESCRIBED. Therefore, while you are correct in that Marvin was AT SOME POINT IN TIME medically discharged, you are incorrect that he was medically discharged AT THE TIME DESCRIBED IN THE ARTICLE. And finally, threats of "account suspension," especially at one with a long history of active, beneficial participation in Wikipedia, and with nothing more to justify those threats than a difference of opinion, violate WP's guidelines for presumption of goodwill and civility. I presume your goodwill and good faith in your edits to this article. I believe they are, in this case, less accurate than what was previously in the article and thus worthy of reversion. If you can provide evidence that Marvin was medically discharged from the service AT THE TIME NOTED, (and he was not, according to his biographer Zec, author of the only major full-length biography of Marvin), then provide the source citation for that discharge, and then the contradictory sources can be compared. But until then, please do not presume vandalism just because you don't like someone's difference of opinion. Monkeyzpop (talk) 17:26, 16 December 2009 (UTC)

Donald Zec is an Englishman, "invalidated out" is a term used in Britain but is NOT a term of policy, regulation, doctrine, or art in the USMC and is considered offensive to service-disabled US combat veterans (myself included). In the British military, it is analogous to "medical discharge." As a Marine yourself, surely you realize this could be seen as a gratuitous insult against the memory of Mr. Martin. Either way, it is an improper term to use to describe the manner in which Mr. Martin was pulled out of combat.96.255.26.223 (talk) 00:50, 17 December 2009 (UTC)

Nowhere in WP guidelines does it say a generic term must fit Marine Corps standards. Donald Zec may be an Englishman, but the word "invalided" did not come from his book, per se. What came from his book was the fact that Marvin (not Martin) was NOT medically discharged at the time under discussion. Additionally, while your claim that "invalided" is either British or insulting may be the opinion of some, it is not the opinion of Merriam-Webster's American Medical Dictionary, © 2002, which defines the transitive verb form of "invalid" as "1 : to remove from active duty by reason of sickness or disability, invalided out of the army." Nor is it the opinion of the Random House Dictionary, © 2009, which defines the transitive verb form of "invalid" as "to remove from or classify as not able to perform active service." The American Heritage® Dictionary, © 2009, defines "invalided" as "To incapacitate physically." It goes on admittedly to state that as a military term it is more frequently a British than American usage, but makes clear that it is not exclusively British. None of the references make any notation of a derogatory, insulting, or unflattering meaning to the word, and this is the first time I have ever heard anyone claim that it has one. I do not mean to be pedantic, certainly no more than you meant to be, and I am happy to see that you compromised on the wording. "Invalided" was not my word, nor Zec's, but it seemed far more accurate than to suggest that Marvin had been discharged from service at the time under discussion, as he had not been. Your rewording is somewhat imprecise even now, as Marvin was not "reassigned non-combat duty," which suggests a desk job or some such. Instead, he was hospitalized from June, 1944 until October, 1945, two months after the end of the war, at which time he was medically discharged. I may take a crack at a more precise wording. I appreciate your concern, and my days at First Medical Battalion outside Da Nang in 1970 left me quite attentive to the feelings of the wounded. I would not have used a derogatory term deliberately, and though I have never heard the term referred to in such a manner, I am happy to see it gone if it reasonably tends to offend someone. Its British frequency of use is likewise unheard of by me until now, and I think it a bit picayune to damn the term in that regard, as the meaning is clear. If Marine Corps terminology were required in every article about a Marine when simple verb forms and not equipment, exercises, decorations, etc., etc. are in question, it would, again I think, be picayune. Let's see if we can't make the article precise and as accurate as possible without being pedants, okay? I'll give it a shot. I hope you will.Monkeyzpop (talk) 08:32, 17 December 2009 (UTC)

Ok, I like your latest edit. Thanks for your understanding.96.255.26.223 (talk) 03:14, 18 December 2009 (UTC)

No Kennedy Center Honor for Keeshan

I have removed from the AWARDS section a bullet point saying Keehsan won a Kennedy Center Honor in 1987. He did not win one that year (they were awarded to Perry Como, Bette Davis, Sammy Davis, Jr., Nathan Milstein and Alwin Nikolais in 1987). According to the Kennedy Center website listing all the honorees, he's never won one. See http://www.kennedy-center.org/programs/specialevents/honors/history.cfm --212.139.244.241 (talk) 19:03, 25 October 2012 (UTC)

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Clarabell

No, he didn't "give up the role" in 1952...he was fired. Source? Every book and article on Howdy Doody ever written. 71.162.113.226 (talk) 10:06, 8 July 2020 (UTC)

The Howdy Doody article says he and two others left the show in a salary dispute. - DavidWBrooks (talk) 14:58, 8 July 2020 (UTC)

Death reasons?

Are there any reasons of his death? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Clrichey (talk • contribs) 18:40, 10 July 2020 (UTC)

Recordings

Keeshan made a lot of children's records, none of which are mentioned in the article. This seems to me like quite an omission. Among other things, he was the narrator for Stokowski's version of Peter and the Wolf and he did a surprisingly good children's record on the history and evolution of jazz ("A Child's Introduction To Jazz"). Might merit a whole section, certainly merits a mention. - Jmabel | Talk 04:15, 22 July 2020 (UTC)

Good point. I added a quick paragraph, with reference from discogs.org; better reference would be good. - DavidWBrooks (talk) 16:26, 22 July 2020 (UTC)

Robert Keeshan, Author

I don't know how to edit these pages. So I'm leaving this information for whomever would be inclined to make the addition.

I personally possess four books authored by Bob Keeshan, yet I'm not seeing any mention of this aspect of his career.

Books I know of are: Growing Up Happy Doubleday Books $17.95 (230p) ISBN 978-0-385-24909-6

Good Morning, Captain 50 Wonderful Years with Bob Keeshan - TV's Captain Kangaroo ‎Fairview Press (September 17, 1996) (216p) ISBN-10 ‎1577490002 ISBN-13 ‎978-1577490005

Books to Grow By ‎Fairview Press (January 12, 1996) (254p) ISBN-10 ‎0925190837 ISBN-13 ‎978-0925190833

Alligator in the Basement (Kyle Corkum, Illustrator) Fairview Press $14.95 (32p) ISBN 978-0-925190-90-1 +SPANISH LANGUAGE El Lagarto del Sotano Fairview Press (September 3, 1996) (‎27p) ISBN-10 ‎1577490029 ISBN-13 ‎978-1577490029

Hurry, Murray, Hurry Fairview Press (November 5, 1996) (‎32p) ISBN-10 ‎0925190845 ISBN-13 ‎978-0925190840 +SPANISH LANGUAGE ¡Ándale, Murray, ándale! ‎Fairview Press (November 5, 1996) ‎(32p) ISBN-10 ‎1577490010 ISBN-13 ‎978-1577490012

Itty Bitty Kitty (Jane Maday, Illustrator) Fairview Press $14.95 (32p) ISBN 978-1-57749-017-3

Itty Bitty Kitty Takes a Splash (Jane Maday, Illustrator) Fairview Press $14.95 (32p) (November 4, 1997) ISBN-10 ‎1577490185 ISBN-13 ‎978-1577490180

Just Right for Itty Bitty Kitty (Jane Maday, Illustrator) Fairview Press $14.95 (32p) ‎(October 7, 1997) // That's from Amazon, but copyright on my First Printing copy says 1998 // ISBN-10 ‎1577490193 ISBN-13 ‎978-1577490197

Captain Kangaroo's Get Well Elephant ASIN ‎B0019VJK3W Publisher: Robert Keeshan Assoc.; Upjohn Edition (January 1, 1992)

She Loves Me...She Loves Me Not... (Maurice Sendak, Illustrator) Publisher: MICHAEL DI CAPUA BOOKS (April 1, 2004) (32p) ISBN10 0060287926 ISBN13 9780060287924

Family Fun Activity Book ‎Fairview Press (May 9, 1996) (‎304p) ISBN-10 ‎0925190292 ISBN-13 ‎978-0925190291

Holiday Fun Activity Book Fairview Press (May 9, 1996) (296p) ISBN-10 ‎0925190780 ISBN-13 ‎978-0925190789

There are also some recordings, which can be documented on Etsy. I didn't take the time to get into those.

Thank you for what you can do to add this information to Mr. Keeshan's Wikipedia entry. 74.65.5.149 (talk) 04:43, 11 February 2022 (UTC)

Lee Marvin’s statement not an urban myth

I recall seeing The Tonight Show the night that Lee Marvin talked about fighting alongside Bob Keeshan and stating that Keeshan was an even more decorated war hero than he was. I remember because I recall that the audience, Johnny, and I were so impressed with Keeshan when we heard him say it, and I recall telling other people what Lee Marvin had said. JHCCohen (talk) 00:46, 20 August 2023 (UTC)

You are remembering incorrectly (as we all do; our memories are fallible and change over time) - this is why editor's personal memories are not used as references. - DavidWBrooks (talk) 14:50, 20 August 2023 (UTC)

I am known for having a remarkable memory, and I am not remembering this incorrectly. I recall being amazed, while watching The Tonight Show, that sweet old Captain Kangaroo, who I loved as a child, was a war hero. JHCCohen (talk) 16:07, 20 August 2023 (UTC)

As the article notes, the facts of history show that your can't be remembering it correctly. Keeshan didn't serve in any combat role. - DavidWBrooks (talk) 16:35, 20 August 2023 (UTC)

I never said Keeshan served in a combat role. I only said that I heard Lee Marvin say it. JHCCohen (talk) 16:43, 20 August 2023 (UTC)

What matters on wikipedia is not whether someone has a memory that someone once said something on a talk show 40 (50?) years ago, but whether you can prove it. Per WP:PROVEIT, "All content must be verifiable" - so, unless you have reliable evidence that Lee Marvin actually said this - the article is pretty heavily sourced as it is - this is all moot. Echoedmyron (talk) 20:52, 20 August 2023 (UTC)