Talk:Bouzouki

Image

The picture of the tetrachordo is not very good. Would some tetrachordo owner please change it to a picture of your bouzouki? We have the picture of mine for the trichordo, after all. The Real Walrus 02:33, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

First appearance of the bouzouki

You said bouzoukis have not been around in Greece all that long, this is a mistake. All music analysts who are familiar with Greek music know that bouzouki is is an evolution of the ancient Greek similar instrument called "Pandoura" or "Pandouris" (appeared about the 3rd century BC) This instrument was used even at the Byzantine age with the same name, this is where the Turkish instruments Tanbur an Saz came from. As you correctly mentioned the name bouzouki comes from the Turkish language, but the instrument is ancient Greek - the tzouras is the closest instrument to it - a tzouras or a trichordo bouzouki has not really many differences from the ancient and Byzantine pandoura.

The Greek speakers can have a look at this page: http://img.pathfinder.gr/clubs/files/34662/1.html http://www.rebetiko.gr/books/html/2.asp

Thanks, yes, it is a bit of oversimplification, perhaps. I thought the early bouzouki with movable frets was a development of the tamboura, but to be honest I am not an expert on the history of lute-like instruments. I'm pretty sure that the bouzouki in its trichordo form with fixed frets is a 20th Century instrument, but I won't get cross when somebody produces evidence to prove me wrong. By the way, who are you? I have stopped being anonymous... The Real Walrus 09:51, 19 May 2006 (UTC)

That was me, username:ellinas_arkas. When I post it I didn't have a wiki account. Well, I've seen other people too believing that the bouzouki firstly appeared in the 19th or 20th century, and was from Eastern influence. This is a very big mistake.

The instrument could have Eastern influence from early civilizations like Egypt, Assyria and India, but with its current form it appeared in classical Greece as Pandoura.

Also here is a thread from my forum about the history of the bouzouki: http://www.takeforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=198&mforum=greece

I think it may be necessary to edit some more, ellinas_arkas! Hiotis was definitely an early user of the tetrachordo, but I don't think he was the inventor of it. Unfortunately I can't remember the names of the two people who have been suggested as the actual inventor. I will also fix up some punctuation marks that need changing. I'll try not to do anything annoying without asking first! The Real Walrus 21:52, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

@ellinas_arkas. You are totally turning the truth around. I can't believe how often wikipedia gives wrong information. Sometimes Articles even contradict each other. How can you state that the turkish saz, baglama and bouzouki have descended from the pandoura? The turkish saz is brought to anatolia by turkic central asian nomads who became the turks we know today. So this type of lute was known by the turks in central asia long before they came to the middle east, anatolia or greece. There are still lutes in Central Asia and China (Xinjiang) who closely resmble the saz, baglama and bouzouki, such as the Dombra. I agree that there was a lute in ancient greece called the tanboura but that has nothing to do with the saz, baglama and bouzouki. There isn't even a resemblance between the saz/baglama/bouzouki and the pandouri, other than that they are all string instruments off course. The pandoura (sumerian pantur, meaning little bow) by the way is not greek but an ancient sumerian instrument which came to be known to the greeks trough the persians. Did you (or the ones you got this information from) just randomly look for the oldest type of lute you could find in greece and claim that as the ancestor of the saz, baglama and bouzouki? By that logic I could also come up with ancient turkic, persian, indian or chinese lutes and make the same claim. Just coming up with random depictions of lutes (who don't even resemble the saz/bouzouki) is no proof that there is a connection between the two. Ibrahim4048 (talk) 15:45, 8 February 2009 (UTC)

Markup confusion

I think one of the writers confused the < with the [ for linking. 24.186.192.247 21:09, 13 September 2006 (UTC)

Bouzouki

This bit was dull, my bad.... The Real Walrus 03:49, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

Bouzoukia

This is an interesting addition, but I think it should be a separate page. The Real Walrus 21:57, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Yes indeed. I was thinking of that exactly when I pressed save, but I was in a rush. I'll call it Greek nightclubs. Thanks for correcting my silly mistakes. :-) NikoSilver 22:32, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Don't be unkind to yourself... The Real Walrus 03:46, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

Angelos Charisteas

Because Charisteas' ability and interest in the bouzouki is not mentioned on his page, could someone find and add an external link that describes this? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.41.53.131 (talk) 16:59, 29 January 2007 (UTC).

The article is about the bouzouki, not footballers. It would make more sense to edit the article about Charisteas to say he is interested in the bouzouki. And what is HagermanBot? The Real Walrus (talk) 08:37, 21 September 2008 (UTC)

Greek bouzouki and other versions

Can we perhaps start having seperate pages for the bouzouki types? Ie, greek, irish, middle eastern, etc.. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 139.149.31.194 (talk) 12:16, 15 March 2007 (UTC).

I think this is a sensible suggestion, and the baglama ought to have its own page anyway. I'm too lazy to do it, and I don't know how yet. I suggest you do it! The Real Walrus 15:22, 29 April 2007 (UTC)

Infobox

Discussion of the infobox that just showed up is at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Musical Instruments. __Just plain Bill (talk) 23:19, 18 November 2007 (UTC)

OK

The Irish Bouzouki and the Greek Baglamas both have their own page. I think I should erase them from hereYangula (talk) 19:47, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

Do you know whether any of the people in the notable players list are actually players of the Irish bouzouki? The Real Walrus (talk) 20:37, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

other meanings of word in greek?

i recall being told that 'bouzouki' can be used to mean someone is crazy. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.183.217.250 (talk) 14:29, 20 June 2008 (UTC)

pedazo de instrumento chabales —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.23.117.255 (talk) 13:54, 4 July 2008 (UTC)

It is a turkish word not greek. It means broken. Ibrahim4048 (talk) 15:50, 8 February 2009 (UTC)

Who are those people?

The section on notable players of the Greek bouzouki is again gathering names that look like the members of Celtic bands. I don't know them, anyway. Do these people actually play round-backed Greek bouzoukis, or do they play the flat-backed Irish bouzouki? If the latter, they are on the wrong page. Alex Lifeson, for instance. I can't find a picture of him playing a bouzouki to check. Unless anyone says I am wrong, I'm going to remove all the obvious non-Greeks from the list. Soonish. The Real Walrus (talk) 20:35, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

• • You are right of course. I cleaned up.--Yangula (talk) 21:07, 13 December 2008 (UTC)

Don't be too hasty! It turns out that Alex Lifeson is of Serbian descent, and plays a Greek trichordo. Then again, as he is a member of Rush, it's not going to be Greek music he plays on it... I hope you have not removed anyone who ought to be there. :) The Real Walrus (talk) 02:24, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

well, even if he plays greek bouzouki he belongs not in the "Notable players of the Greek bouzouki" section. I play to! should I write my name also? :) Yangula (talk) 04:45, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Here we go again...man I looked Stephin Merritt in youTube up- the guy plays guitar on an bouzouki. This is certainly no notable bouzouki-playing. (it isn't even bouzouki playng at all)--Yangula (talk) 17:36, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Yes, even if some of them play Greek bouzouki, that does not mean he is notable unless proved by reliable sources. I think the names which are red links should be sourced for confirmation. If proper reference cannot be found, then those names should be removed. Otolemur crassicaudatus (talk) 17:51, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Karl Sanders from Nile- I always the Bouzouki bits on Nile albums were just samples. I heard the one in 'Dusk Falls Upon the Temple of the Serpent on the Mount of Sunrise' on a BBC Horizon programme.Urpunkt (talk) 22:41, 29 April 2009 (UTC)

I've removed Luc Arbogast from the notable players on this article because he is a player of the Irish Bouzouki. I've created a Notable Players section over there and put him into it.Gnomon

File:Music lesson Staatliche Antikensammlungen 2421.jpg Nominated for Deletion

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Ancient Greece?

As fas as I know Bouzouki is of central Asian origin, which is why it was banned during the Metaxas regime period. Is there a reliable source confirming an ancient Greek origin?.--— ZjarriRrethues — ^talk 18:46, 3 October 2011 (UTC)

Probably introduced by User:BouzoukiGr's sock army at some point. Removed. Fut.Perf. ☼ 20:28, 4 October 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for that. The "History" section still reads like a copy&paster with scant competence in written English. I am not familiar enough in depth to fix it, though. __ Just plain Bill (talk) 20:33, 4 October 2011 (UTC)

Fixed, But who said about other origin beyond the normal, worldwide is knowable like its Greek origin from everyone, I didn't read anything else.: (+take a look on this too: Origin: Greece. Evolved from the ancient Greek Lutes. Instrumrnts database )

--Vingarmen (talk) 19:22, 5 December 2011 (UTC)

File:Greek wooden baglama.jpg Nominated for speedy Deletion

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Rule violations - Unprovoked vandal behavior

the tambouras of Yannis Makriyannis in the National Historical Museum, Athens

This case is consistent deliberate attempt at misinformation that consistent vandalism. Without a suitable (User:Omnipaedista) reason he proceed a subtraction of a very well-known edit, about the instrument, and pictures of museum information. This consistent a bizarre behavior. What do you want? --HailEpov (talk) 12:14, 25 October 2012 (UTC)

Official Page of Museum of Greek Instruments

Can the User tell us if there is any more appropriate source than the official page of Greek Instruments of Athens Museum?

It says clearly (in Greek) Στην αρχαία Ελλάδα ο τύπος αυτός είναι γνωστός ως τρίχορδο ή πανδούρα, στο Βυζάντιο ως θαμπούρα (το όργανο του Διγενή Ακρίτα) και στη νεότερη Ελλάδα ως ταμπουράς, μπουζούκι, μπαγλαμάς which can be translated like: In ancient Greece, the instrument was known as trichordo or Pandoura. Is he a musician? I have two links from Proffesional Bouzouki players, too. "In which school has graduated" is an extra question by me to Omnipaedista? Can this mess be called a grammatical correctness? This is nothing but a nationalistic intolerant edit!

In another one article with France politics (something that is not my "cup of tea"), calls Roiter Organisation grammatically inappropriate and then he take it back. On items that can be hardly verified, is necessary a system of referrals to have creditworthy external sources. If the disputed text is harmless then just believe that it is necessary a referral. --HailEpov (talk) 13:42, 30 October 2012 (UTC)

Not in citation given: source talks about ταμπουράς, not about μπουζούκι: "Η ονομασία ταμπουράς χρησιμοποιείται για μια σειρά από νυκτά όργανα της οικογένειας του λαγούτου, ανεξάρτητα από τις διαστάσεις, τον αριθμό των χορδών και το κούρδισμά τους. Τα αρχέτυπα, γνωστά ήδη από τη 2η χιλιετία π.Χ. στη Μεσοποταμία και Αίγυπτο, έχουν μικρό ηχείο, μακρύ χέρι και παίζονται με πλήκτρο-πένα ή με τα δάχτυλα. Στην αρχαία Ελλάδα ο τύπος αυτός είναι γνωστός ως τρίχορδο ή πανδούρα, στο Βυζάντιο ως θαμπούρα." --Omnipaedista (talk) 17:25, 30 October 2012 (UTC)

And continious ... και στη νεότερη Ελλάδα ως ταμπουράς, μπουζούκι, μπαγλαμάς; (...in modern Greece as bouzouki & baglama...), means that bouzouki which is the descedant of "tampouras family" was known in ancient Greece as Pandoura or Trichordo... --HailEpov (talk) 18:31, 30 October 2012 (UTC)

Macedonian?

The first paragraph says the Bouzouki is a Macedonian instrument, but Macedonia is not mentioned anywhere else in the article. The article is part of the "Greek musical instruments", and it is stated and implied throughout the rest of the text that the bouzouki is Greek. Additionally, I am personally pretty sure that the bouzouki is in fact a Greek instrument. Is this a case of vandalism? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 123popos123 (talk • contribs) 21:42, 2 March 2017 (UTC)

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Bouzouki dance?

There's something called a Bouzouki dance, it's danced in circle with the dancers holding each other at the shoulders, doing simple steps left and right and 'bouncing'. Apparently it's related to a Chora\ Hora. I only found some videos of it, but no information. Any ideas?92.114.148.141 (talk) 12:58, 10 September 2017 (UTC)

Construction

The section on construction was clearly Google-translated from the equivalent article in the Greek Wikipedia. I've been gradually translating it into readable English but am still mystified by some bits of it. Does anyone know the difference between "tonicity" and "tonality"? The author is using those words in ways which don't correspond to the normal English usage. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gnomon42 (talk • contribs) 13:54, 5 February 2018 (UTC)

Electric bouzouki

While discussing an edit to Ry Cooder's page, I've noticed that there's no mention on this page of the electric bouzouki. A Bing search demonstrates that there are definitely a few of them out there: does anyone fancy adding a section about them? ~dom Kaos~ (talk) 19:07, 10 June 2018 (UTC)