Talk:Bye Bye Baby (Madonna song)/GA1

GA Review

Article (edit | visual edit | history) · Article talk (edit | history) · Watch

Reviewer: XXSNUGGUMSXX (talk · contribs) 03:21, 16 June 2014 (UTC)

Overview

Prose: See below Resolved

Sourcing: See below Resolved

Coverage: See below Resolved

Neutrality: See below

Stability: No issues

GA Result: On hold for seven days Passed

Details

Lead

• "It was released on November 15, 1993, as the sixth and final single from the album, by Maverick Records"..... the record label belongs in the album's introduction, not here
• "The song is inspired by Madonna's complex emotions at that time and her S&M thoughts"..... "complex emotions" is POV
• "A filter was used on Madonna's vocals to give the effect of sound coming out from an antique radio"..... doesn't read very well, I'd suggest "Madonna's vocals were filtered" for the beginning bit though am not sure how to configure the rest
  • I tweaked this and sounds better. —Indian:BIO · ^{[ ChitChat ]} 09:03, 16 June 2014 (UTC)
    • Indeed it does Snuggums (talk • contributions) 11:47, 16 June 2014 (UTC)
• "found Madonna's vocal delivery to be flat"..... maybe "were disappointed with her vocals" would be better, as I don't think everyone would automatically know what "flat vocals" are
• "She and her backup singers cavorted with three scantily clad women"..... keep it simple and say they danced with the women
• "found it to be a response to male chauvinism"..... "misogyny" or "male patriotism" would probably be better
  • misogyny is better since patriotism is a wrong usage here. —Indian:BIO · ^{[ ChitChat ]} 09:03, 16 June 2014 (UTC)

Background and remixes

• The first three sentences belong in the Erotica album page, not here
  • I have kept just one line to give context when the song production actually began in respect to the album. Deleted the other bits. —Indian:BIO · ^{[ ChitChat ]} 09:03, 16 June 2014 (UTC)
    • Looks better now Snuggums (talk • contributions) 11:47, 16 June 2014 (UTC)
• How about going more into what Lucy O'Brien thought about this particular track? You could also use her book for some background info for the track by itself
  • O'Brien doesn't delve much into it. It was a much less significant track anyways. Just that "Bye Bye Baby" was one of the tracks which grew out of this frustration she vented in the songwriting. The bit about the album having no sugar-coated tracks is also present to give context on how the songs shaped up leading to BBB in the last. Just saying that "BBB was developed from Madonna's complex emotions" would not have explained anything at all and would have been a cliffhanger. —Indian:BIO · ^{[ ChitChat ]} 09:03, 16 June 2014 (UTC)
    • Understood Snuggums (talk • contributions) 11:47, 16 June 2014 (UTC)
• "contained several remixes, none of which differed too much from the original album version"..... let's instead use something like "which contain relatively minor differences from the original edition"
• "which consist of a few extra beats and horns thrown into the original mix" → "which contain a few additional beats and horns added to the original mix"

Recording and composition

• "Along with producing, Pettibone also did the sequencing"..... I don't think the "Along with producing" bit is needed
• "wanted a 1940s feel"..... try theme
• "A 23 second sample of 'Bye Bye Baby', which illustrates Madonna's thin, attenuated vocals, with a high treble"..... simplify this to something like "A 23 second sample of 'Bye Bye Baby', which contains a high treble"
• "The filter on Madonna's voice gives the effect of an answering machine message, with the bleep on the final line "You fucked it up" being likened to a machine's end-of-message beep"..... quite a mouthful, let's simply this bit
  • Yep, simplified. —Indian:BIO · ^{[ ChitChat ]} 09:03, 16 June 2014 (UTC)
• If ref#6 (Metz & Benson) is from The Washington Post, why not provide their issue?
  • the reference and the content is listed in the book The Madonna Companion. I do not know the issue and not possible to find out also I believe. —Indian:BIO · ^{[ ChitChat ]} 09:03, 16 June 2014 (UTC)
    • Very well Snuggums (talk • contributions) 11:47, 16 June 2014 (UTC)

Critical response

• What is the author's name for the People review? Unless this is from a well-known media critic (which People doesn't tend to have- they consist of news reporters), it's probably best to leave this out due to topic concerns (kind of like consulting ESPN for politics)
  • This was before the I'm Breathless review. Have removed it now. —Indian:BIO · ^{[ ChitChat ]} 09:03, 16 June 2014 (UTC)
• I'm skeptical about the "Soulbounce" ref
  • Removed. —Indian:BIO · ^{[ ChitChat ]} 09:03, 16 June 2014 (UTC)
• "noted that the aggressive lyrics and the profanity at the end did not mesh well with the erotic vibe of the album"..... this sentence needs a WP:TNT- "aggressive" is borderline POV without quotation marks, "felt that the lyrics" would probably be better than "noted", "did not mesh well with the erotic vibe of the album"..... did not suit the erotic vibe

Chart performance

• "It became the fifth single from the Erotica album to place within the top 10 in the country"..... use the country's name here
  • not needed since the preceding line clarifies that it is Italy. Tweaked though. —Indian:BIO · ^{[ ChitChat ]} 09:03, 16 June 2014 (UTC)
    • Tweaked very nicely Snuggums (talk • contributions) 11:47, 16 June 2014 (UTC)
• "The next week it went to number 15, becoming its peak in the country" → "The next week it peaked at number 15".

Live performances

• "Louis Virtel from The Backlot ranked the performance at number eight on a list for 'Madonna's 11 Greatest VMA Moments'. praised Madonna's rendition of the song at the Video Music Awards, calling it 'a hell of a VMA performance' and a 'killer cinematic throwback'"..... the period between "VMA Moments" and "praised" should be a comma.
  • There was a missing "He"
    • Makes sense Snuggums (talk • contributions) 11:47, 16 June 2014 (UTC)
• Add "The" before "Main inspiration behind this segment"
• "Brett Beemyn, one of the authors of the book Queer Studies, noted that Madonna" → "Brett Beemyn noted in Queer Studies that Madonna"
• "rubbing against them and holding sexy poses and dominated them"..... Giggity..... but "sexy poses" is POV- try "sexual poses"
• Remove the slash in "characteristic lesbian/butch femme portrayal with the performance" per WP:SLASH, and take "lesbian" out of the link
• "It also mocks the fact that Asian women" → "It also mocks how Asian women"
  • Its a quote. —Indian:BIO · ^{[ ChitChat ]} 09:03, 16 June 2014 (UTC)
    • M'kay Snuggums (talk • contributions) 11:47, 16 June 2014 (UTC)

References

• ref#6 for some reason isn't working like the other book page refs (i.e. doesn't bring reader down to book when clicked)
  • Yeah, the year was wrong. —Indian:BIO · ^{[ ChitChat ]} 09:03, 16 June 2014 (UTC)
• Publisher for The New York Times is Arthur Ochs Sulzberger, Jr.
• Publisher for Los Angeles Times is Eddy Hartenstein
• Publisher for The Baltimore Sun is Timothy E. Ryan
  • Corrected all. —Indian:BIO · ^{[ ChitChat ]} 09:03, 16 June 2014 (UTC)

@XXSNUGGUMSXX:, starting to work on it, but have you noticed that for some reason the GA review is not being transcluded in the talk page? Are we doing something wrong? —Indian:BIO · ^{[ ChitChat ]} 04:19, 16 June 2014 (UTC)

No, nothing wrong at all. If the reviewer posts it all in one go (which I did), then it oftentimes won't be transcluded (especially if reviewer fails nomination). Snuggums (talk • contributions) 04:30, 16 June 2014 (UTC)

@XXSNUGGUMSXX:, responded and corrected all the points mentioned in the review. —Indian:BIO · ^{[ ChitChat ]} 09:03, 16 June 2014 (UTC)

GA! Snuggums (talk • contributions) 11:47, 16 June 2014 (UTC)