Talk:Canine distemper

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Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 16:40, 16 January 2022 (UTC)

Added info

I went ahead and expanded this article. I added headings, info on decontamination, transmission, incubation period, symptoms, diagnosis, treatment, and a reference. I removed the part about treating the disease with a sparse appetite and allowing to run on grass, because I know of no basis for that. I also removed jauncice as a symptom. By the way, does anyone know if we can remove the stub template? Who decides if it is still a stub? --Joelmills 03:59, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

It's great to have a vet editing stuff. Thanks! The definition of a stub is a little loose and different people have somewhat different ideas, because the question is really "does it have enough info in it to be useful?" and that varies by topic, by reader, and by writer :-) . You can read Wikipedia:Stub for the semiofficial position on stubs. You're right, though, this one's no longer a stub. I've removed it, although you (or anyone) can also do so. Elf | Talk 05:24, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

Reference to bacteria should be clarified

The present article has the statement, "It was first thought to be related to the Plague and Typhus and resulted from several species of bacteria", but never clarifies or expands on that thought. Canine distemper is viral, of course, and if it was at one time considered otherwise, perhaps a little history of that thought would be welcomed. Otherwise, removal of that statement may be in order. Cincyflyer (talk) 13:39, 4 July 2008 (UTC) it may be curable —Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.98.16.130 (talk) 08:35, 22 June 2010 (UTC)

Canine distemper

The local S.P.C.A. is having problems innoculating puppies that have been turned in for adoption. Shortly after being vaccinated they develope distemper. Is there a specific vaccine that should be used? I might add, we are in Mexico. DingusMcGee

If puppies are developing distemper after being vaccinated, either they are too young (less than four weeks) or the vaccine still contains a virulent form of the distemper virus. Modified live vaccines (MLV) usually have an attenuated form of the virus that renders them unable to cause disease, but the degree of attenuation varies. At our practice in the U.S., we use either Duramune (Fort Dodge Animal Health) or Vanguard (Pfizer) combination vaccines. Good luck. --Joelmills 23:35, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

If they develop distemper DingusMcGee, you can treat them with colloidal silver (plata coloidal). It is available as a vegetable wash in most Mexican grocery stores. You can just put one or two drops of concentrated colloidal silver in 10 ml of water and give orally in a syringe for a puppy. Should immediately stop progression and clear up the disease in about a week. Works against fading puppy syndrome too. By the way, I have edited the main page on this topic to give more vets this vital information but it keeps being taken down in favor of "There is no specific treatment for the canine distemper." This is a shame when colloidal silver is a very safe and effective treatment we have used to completely reverse many even advanced cases in Mexico. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 189.222.87.46 (talk) 07:50, 2 July 2017 (UTC)

more information on prevention needed!

i work in a vet's office as an assistant. two collie puppies left the clinic yesterday. one was diagnosed with distemper. they both stayed in our isolation room for 10+ days. my responsibility after they left was to clean and disinfect the room. i didn't really get much more information out of them about how to disinfect this highly contagious room.

this article wasn't much more helpful. it only briefly mentions that one must clean and regularly disinfect the room to prevent infection of others. is this enough? how long after the infected leaves should you clean it? what should you clean it with? is everything in the room (bottles, brooms, leashes, etc.) infected? should everything be cleaned or just the place where the dogs stayed?

also, in this article there is nothing about protecting yourself from this disease if you are in contact with the infected dog. here at my place of work, doctors told me to spray myself with disinfectant, wash my hands, and step in a small pool of bleach before entereing or leaving the room each time. these seemed like very important steps. i have a puppy at home that i'm worried about giving the disease to. please help if you have the answers to my questions.

m.

Thanks for pointing out the info missing from this article. I will expand it. Just to briefly answer your questions now, distemper does not survive long outside the dog at normal room temperature, not more than a few hours. Pretty much any disinfectant will kill it, so normal cleaning procedures will disinfect the room. I guess you can spray leashes and brooms with a disinfectant, too. As far as yourself, I assume you are concerned about your puppy's health and not your own (distemper does not affect humans). I've never heard anything about the virus being transmitted on clothing or skin, but if you are going immediately home, wash up and change your clothes before coming in contact with your puppy. Distemper is nothing like parvo, which is difficult to eradicate from the environment.

All that said, don't forget that wikipedia is not meant to be an instruction manual, and the vet you work for should have some kind of protocol written up. --Joelmills 01:09, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

Possible infection

I have two dogs who recently had pups. The pups some how contracted an unconfirmed case of distemper. I feel it was this because of the symptoms that each suffered before death. When the first pup died I immediately purchased the 7way vaccine for the rest of my dogs including the adults as they had never been vaccinated. The mom being 6 and the Father being 2 and the remaining pups 3 months old. The remaing pups died within the week of the vaccine. My question is that it is now 11 days since the adults got thier shots and they are not showing any symptoms of the illness, are they safe or should I still be on guard? I feel this would be good info to put on this site so others will know to vaccinate immediately if they suspect contamination to their unprotected dogs or not.

This is a puppy virus. Your other two dogs are probably fine. I know this from research and sadly... from experience as well (my puppies died, while the adults stayed fine).  :( --Saritamackita (talk) 05:29, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

Same is the case with me but homeopathy came to my pups rescue. Its been 3 days and pup is recovering. Sometimes I feel homeopathy is just a joke, but sometimes I have seen miracles happening because of it.

Room Temperature

It does not survive in the environment for more than a few hours at room temperature (37° C)

37 C is body temperature, not room temperature. --BANG! 02:00, 27 September 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for pointing that out. --Joelmills 03:06, 27 September 2006 (UTC)

Age Affected

In your article you say that dogs 4 months to 4 years of age get this virus. I know for a fact that they are most vulnerable from 1 1/2 months of age to 4 1/2 months. I just had two puppies die of this absolutely horrific virus. they were both around 2 3/4 months when they died. As for the symptoms that both showed----around 7 days after infection--diarrea, after another 7 days or so...seizures (with uncontrollable bowel movements), lock jaw, a blank stare, a shivering jaw, running around in circles, getting really skinny and not eating. Oh, and of course, mucus and sneezing and rough paws. 2 days after the start of seizures, they die. VACCINATE YOUR PUPPIES, ESPECIALLY IF YOU ARE IN LATIN AMERICA!! Saritamackita (talk) 19:56, 18 March 2008 (UTC) (actually it happened like around June 2007 hence my interest in the subject and my work on the article)

Highly technical sentence with no citation

"Histologic examination reveals intranuclear and intracytoplasmic eosinophilic inclusion bodies in numerous tissues."

I am taking this sentence out because it is almost impossible for someone other than an expert in the field to understand and it lacks a reference. If whoever put the sentence in can find the reference and put it into plain English, then go for it. Saritamackita (talk) 19:56, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

Canine Distemper

I adopted a puppy from the pound. She presented first with a stuffy nose, then respiratory infection and treated with antibiotic and cough meds. She then started muscular twitching. I took her to the emergency vet who said she was showing all the classic signs of distemper. I chose to put her to sleep. I have two other dogs. A 2.5 year old great dane and a 7 month old rodisian ridgeback mix. The rodisian has an upper respiratory infection he caught from the pound puppy with distemper. The vet said my other two dogs should be fine because they have been fully vaccinated. Both dogs are on antibiotics because they were showing signs similar to the upper respiratory infection. Is there a chance dogs can catch distemper even when they are vaccinated? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.67.18.187 (talk) 17:36, 21 May 2008 (UTC)

Reasons for past poor prognosis

"Until recently, canine distemper had a long history of failures with respect to treatment of affected animals. Two associated factors had an important role in maintaining this negative perspective.

The first is misdiagnosis or a lack of treatment until the animal reaches the Affected animals do not receive adequate attention until the disease reaches the nervous stage and the distrubed state of the animal is more obvious and less responsive to treatment.

The second factor is due to the old interpretation that had the mechanism of action of the virus in the nervous phase. It was assumed that the injuries that occurred were the result of a strictly autoimmune reaction, the thought being that the canine distemper virus unleashed something, was subsequently eliminated, but the reaction initiated continued. It was therefore recommended that an intervention by anti-inflammatory and immunosuppressive drugs be used, because they saw a need to eliminate this condition of self scourge."

I'm not sure about this section because from what I read from the rest of the treatment section, a lack of treatment with ribovirin, vitamin A, etc. could lead to a very poor prognosis for the animal. The lack of availability or treatment with these medications seems like it would really be the primary reason for the poor prognosis. Saritamackita (talk) 19:02, 28 November 2009 (UTC)

prognosis —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.97.164.250 (talk) 00:24, 4 December 2009 (UTC)

dubious info in the treatment section.

I am concerned about the treatment section of the canine distemper. It needs urgent attention from a expert on distemper treatment.24.97.164.250 (talk) 15:25, 5 December 2009 (UTC)I think it does seem overly technical,and should be deleted,but i do not no if its false. I do find it difficult to belive vitamin a is a cure for distemper,so i put dubious discuss there.169.244.148.235 (talk) 19:02, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

The section on Vitamin A is essentially unsubstantiated. The references do not support the contention that Vitamin A has been shown to be a successful treatment for distemper in dogs. I suspect that the entire section should be deleted. At the very least it should be reworded to indicate that there is (at most) a hypothesis based on studies in ferrets and the experience in humans with measles. Since I'm not a vet or an expert on distemper I'm hesitant to just call the whole section hooey, but it might be just that. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mlustig (talk • contribs) 13:00, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

The above comments appear valid. I have read the citations. The section, while reflecting an interesting hypothesis that rests weakly on some of the citations, seems to breach WP:NOR and WP:SYNTH. It is also stylistically inelegant, unduly wordy, and its message overreaches, and is clearly not reflected in other sources. This posting represents notice of intent to substantially redact and clean up; prior to doing so I will 1. review further outside sources; 2. give notice and be open to input from other editors.FeatherPluma (talk) 17:45, 22 May 2011 (UTC)

Questions about CDV

Hi, I'm doing a little casual research on CDV and reading through the article sparked some questions that aren't really answered in the text. I know WP talk pages aren't forums/help lists but if anyone has the answers, they might be worth including in the article?

• Why does CDV not affect domestic cats? From my layman's perspective, domestic cats, lions, and tigers are much more closely-related than domestic dogs, ferrets, and tigers are. And domestic dogs have a lot of contact with domestic cats so there would be plenty of opportunity to catch it.
• What's the average time range for an untreated animal with CDV to go from start of infection to death? I tried to figure this out from the numbers in the article but I don't think there's enough information to do it.

Cheers! --142.25.33.55 (talk) 19:46, 31 May 2011 (UTC)

• It can infect a very large range of species. Wildlife species include foxes, skunks, racoons, black-footed ferrets, lynx, bobcats and lions (Appel and Summers, 1995; Roelke-Parker et al., 1996). There is some serological evidence of infections in domestic cats (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC96116/). You can't say that CDV does not infect domestic cats. What you can say, is that it may not have caused serious enough disease to warrant detection.
• Very variable based on virulence and host factors. The acute form of the disease may result in neurological signs, eventually leading death, but many animals recover/develop immunity. Vindigenous (talk) 21:50, 16 March 2012 (UTC)

Anti-Distemper Serum by Dr Sears

Dr Sears' work should be added to the list of the list of Treatments for this page. Information regarding his process can be found here http://www.edbond.com/antidistemper.html

I help run a rescue group for huskies in Texas and we have used his method several times to save dogs. There is one process which uses a donor dog for making the treatment and another, Newcastle, which does not. Newcastle isn't as effective but provides dogs a greater chance of surviving. We just used the Newcastle serum on puppies @ 6 weeks old after two in the litter came down with distemper. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jamesabolton (talk • contribs) 16:17, 12 December 2012 (UTC)

Issues with article and lead

…noted, and began addressing. Specifically, I corrected a misquotation that plagiarized from McLeod (about.com source, now appearing with actual DVM author name), replacing it for now with the actual quote.

I moved this sentence, for which no specific citations appeared later in the article (with regard to Families included in the host range):

Canine distemper… affects animals the families Canidae (dogs, wolves, foxes, etc.), Mustelidae (ferrets, weasels, otters, etc.), Mephitidae (skunks), Hyaenidae (Hyenas), Ailuridae (the red panda), Procyonidae (racoons, ringtails, etc.), Pinnipedia (seals, walrus, sea lion, etc.), some Viverridae (racoon-like animals in South Asia), and Felidae (cats, though not domestic cats).

leaving what I could in the lead (that which was sourced by McLeod or another source). This sentence was moved to new host range section, and sourced and unsourced material was specifically called out so other editors could begin to remedy the shortcomings with specific sources.

FInally, I annotated remaining unsourced material in lead, and the rampant unrepresentative use of primary cites in the whole, esp. in the section on Paget's.

Please don't revert overall, or specific locations, without addressing these clear sourcing issues. 71.239.87.100 (talk) 03:04, 15 December 2014 (UTC)

Explanation of Canine_distemper#Host_range tags

This section's content presents a significant problem with regard to its sourcing, that has led to the odd in-line tagging of the section. Recall, this section's content was, earlier, in the lede, but was moved here because if was completely devoid of citations. The two citations that now appear, to McLeod (about.com) and Jones, were first added during my edit.

The problem with the material lies in that it is essentially a combination of two lists, neither of which are sourced, in general, or in particular. The list of phylogenetic Families that appear in the host range is not sourced, and so all the Latin family names that are indicated as hosts needed a tag that says "".

The list of individual animal common names that are seen as distemper virus hosts is also a list, and was also unsourced, in general, or in particular. Two sources were added (during my edit, because they were present in article, and relevant). First, McLeod, a poor source from about.com that already appeared prominently in the article was completed (e.g., author name McLeod did not earlier appear); this article listed a few of these animals, and so this citation was added following the animals it mentions, but these occurrences had to be tagged "", because with a rich secondary literature on veterinary pathology and infectious disease, about.com does not make muster. Second, Jones mentions pinnipeds, and so Jones was added (no issue with this source). Common names of animals that are listed as hosts that were not mentioned in either of these articles remain without sourcing, and so must also appear with ""'.

This is why this section appears with the odd array of tags after each grouping of names in the list; it can be remedied by [1] finding a source for the Family names of hosts of the virus (or by removing these from the article, since unsourced), and [2] finding a reliable veterinary text, monograph, or review (reliable, verifiable secondary medical source) that lists all or most of the common names of animals that appear here.

Until such sources are found, as long as the text appears, the inline citations need to appear, to signal myself, and other editors, as to what material still remans to be edited with regard to sources. Please do not revert until the fundamental issue is resolved. 71.239.87.100 (talk) 15:11, 15 December 2014 (UTC)

Suggestions on how to expand/contribute to this article

I'm new at evaluating/editing articles on Wikipedia so bear with me :)

A citation to use for the species affected by distemper could be the Veterinary Merck Manual- http://www.merckvetmanual.com/mvm/generalized_conditions/canine_distemper/overview_of_canine_distemper.html?qt=distemper&alt=sh

The part in the second section that says "The viral infection can be accompanied by secondary bacterial infections and can present eventual serious neurological symptoms." almost makes it sound like the neurological symptoms can come from the secondary bacterial infection when in fact the neurological symptoms come from the virus. Also consider using the word "effects" or "signs" instead of "symptoms" as "symptoms" tends to be subjective (animals cannot explain symptoms- so veterinary professionals observe based on signs or effects)

The article mentions that distemper is highly contagious via inhalation but distemper is also transmitted via other routes like body fluids (secretions, urine, feces, nasal, oral, ocular discharge), contaminated food and water, contaminated fomites. Is this meaning that distemper is especially contagious via inhalation moreso than the others forms of transmission?

Not sure if the lead "As McLeod notes," goes against Wikipedia's rules

Maybe we could add more studies of prevalence in more recent years than April of 2011. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Maymers7 (talk • contribs) 03:08, 30 January 2016 (UTC) (Maymers7 (talk) 03:16, 30 January 2016 (UTC))

Also, "Infectious Diseases of the Dog and Cat", by Craig E. Greene. Chapter 3 "Canine Distemper". Expensive in Amazon, but I found the 3rd chapter of the 2012 edition in Google books (https://books.google.com/books?id=eeJOAQAAQBAJ&q=distemper#v=snippet&q=distemper). Catrachos (talk) 20:15, 5 December 2017 (UTC)

Annotated Bibliography

1.

This source is relevant as it is a manual written by veterinarians providing overall information on the Canine Distemper Virus. It provides relevant info in each section (like pathogenesis, signs, who it affects, how it affects the body multi-systemically, the vaccine, preventative care and supportive care). Though this Wikiepedia page does touch on most topics, I think this source could really fill in the gaps.

2.

This source is directed towards Veterinary Technicians but is relevant because since vet techs are a main part of the veterinary field of medicine along with veterinarians in understanding and knowing about diseases affecting animals. This book elaborates on the phases of the infection which can help clarify/add to what is in the article already. It also includes sanitation/preventing spreading information which could be added under prevention.

3.

This source discusses that there are multiple strains of the virus and that the strain determines the severity of signs and fatality.

4.

This article discusses more on prevention and elaborates on wildlife being affected and describes precautions to take. It also mentions another mode of transmission being transplacental.

5.

This book includes more information on the efficacy of the vaccine which could be expanded upon in the Wikipedia article. It also includes information on how Canine Distemper could relate to Paget's Disease which the section in the Wikipedia article has already been started on.

Maymers7 (talk) 02:02, 23 February 2016 (UTC)

Added template for reflist, so that references from this discussion are listed more conveniently immediately below. DferDaisy (talk) 02:29, 31 January 2017 (UTC)

References

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Added research; Carnivore Distemper Virus

Diversity of susceptible hosts in canine distemper virus infection: a systematic review and data synthesis; Marlen Martinez-Gutierrez and Julian Ruiz-Saenz, corresponding author; May 2016

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4865023/#MOESM1

The research was a review of 217 separate articles. The number of susceptible species is staggering. A proposal for renaming the disease Carnivore Distemper Syndrome was noted.

A more in-depth reading is pending, but the article appears to address the Canine distemper#Host range tags, explained Dec 2014 above (Talk:Explanation of Canine distemper ... tags).

From the article's introduction:

Conclusions

The results of this systematic review demonstrate that CDV is able to infect a very wide range of host species from many different Orders and emphasizes the potential threat of infection for endangered wild species as well as raising concerns about potential zoonotic threats following the cessation of large-scale measles vaccination campaigns in the human population.

Even more recent articles also point to increased concerns for wildlife. Advances in canine distemper virus pathogenesis research: a wildlife perspective, April 2017

Added a line about Giant Pandas.

GeeBee60 (talk) 13:01, 7 October 2017 (UTC)

Changed uncited 50% mortality rate in introduction

I made a literature search to find the mortality rate (50%) cited in the article. That was a commonly cited number, although articles citing that number didn't provide a reference or when they did, the referenced articles didn't specify an exact number. 50% for adult dogs and 80% for puppies seem to be commonly cited "ball-park" figures" rather than actual measures of morbidity, which appears to be more complicated. I therefore rewrote based on recent cited journal articles. Unlike rabies, there isn't a single morbidity (e.g. 100% or 99%). Any single figure comes with qualification including species, animal's age and immune status, and virulence of the infecting strain. The acute generalized form of the disease has high mortality, presumably accounting for the ballpark figures of 50/80 (dogs/puppies). However, up to 70% of infections in domestic dogs are sub-clinical, according to the cited articles, so a 50% figure would not be accurate over all infections (http://www.allthingscanid.org/caninedistemper.pdf and https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5462633/); and that's discarding all other factors. A point made in at least one article I looked at is that morbidity rate in dogs for distemper is second only to rabies [among prevalent diseases]. That could be added, if I can find the article again... Catrachos (talk) 00:09, 6 December 2017 (UTC)

Disturbing footage of dying animal

Whilst Wikipedia is an educational site, I feel there is no need to watch a terminally ill wolf convulse on the ground. Such footage can be searched for by the extremely small subset of readers of this page to whom it may be of use, but to the vast majority of Wikipedia users (often including children and adolescents) it is an unnecessary upset. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 60.224.17.10 (talk • contribs) 05:07, 30 September 2020 (UTC)

I have moved this file to the section where these symptoms are discussed. WhatamIdoing (talk) 20:04, 11 January 2021 (UTC)

WP:VET

This is one of the most popular pages in Wikipedia:WikiProject Veterinary medicine's scope. Very few editors watch WT:VET's pages, which means that questions may not be answered in a timely manner. If you are an active editor and interested in animals or veterinary medicine, please put WT:VET on your watchlist. Thank you, WhatamIdoing (talk) 20:00, 11 January 2021 (UTC)

Source 12 Misuse

Source 12 (https://www.millenniumassessment.org/documents/document.356.aspx.pdf) does not make any reference to an outbreak of CDV in lions in 1991. Furthermore, the outbreak the author is presumably referencing happened in 1994, before which it was not known that big cats were vulnerable to CDV (also, around 30% of the Serengeti lions were killed in the epidemic). Here is a paper describing the outbreak accurately: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/8559247/. 86.177.187.137 (talk) 04:18, 8 March 2024 (UTC)