Talk:Canis

Discussion at Canini (surname)#Requested move 15 October 2017

You are invited to join the discussion at Canini (surname)#Requested move 15 October 2017. Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 15:35, 15 October 2017 (UTC)

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A possible error on the tree

There seems to be an error in the bottom four groups in the tree shown in the article:

Side Striped Jackal: The side-striped jackal (Canis adustus) is a species of jackal, native to eastern and southern Africa. Unlike its cousin, the smaller black-backed jackal, which dwells in open plains, the side-striped jackal primarily dwells in woodland and scrub areas.

- - - Curiously, this animal is put in the Canis Genus, which from the above diagram, is illogical.

Black Backed Jackal: The black-backed jackal (Canis mesomelas) is a canid native to two areas of Africa, separated by roughly 900 km.

- - - Curiously, this animal is put in the Canis Genus, which from the above diagram, is illogical.

This would suggest that there is an error in the positioning of the four bottom canids in the above diagram.

The painted wolf, and the dhole should be on the bottom fork of the first split in Caninae, while the two jackals on that lower split should be on the bottom of the upper split. The dates on the splits seem to support that conjecture.

So the upper split is CANIS, and the lower split is LYCAON, and CUON.

So Jackals, ‘Wolves’, Coyotes, and Dogs, are ALL in the CANIS, or DOG branch, while the Dhole, and Painted Wolf are in the LYCAON or CUON, or WOLF branch.

Dave at 168 15:27, 18 October 2019 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Daveat168 (talk • contribs)

Hello Dave, intuitively correct but not quite right. The phylotree shows the "Phylogenetic tree of the extant wolf-like canids". If you follow Note (a) at the end of that title, you will be taken to the same tree in the article "Evolution of the wolf". If you follow its Note (a), you will have all of the supporting references - it is based on genotype, not phenotype. Why does Lycaon and Cuon fit so neatly inside genus Canis? Because their fossil ancestors are classified in an extinct subgenus of Canis called Xenocyon and their modern descendants' DNA reflects this. Additionally, the genome of all dogs, wolves, and coyotes show ancient genetic admixture with an unknown canid that has branched off after Lycaon but before Cuon did (Gopalakrishnan 2018). Thanks for your interest in Canis. William Harristalk 01:27, 24 October 2019 (UTC)

@Daveat168: The problem is not with the cladogram but with the scientific names. Traditionally all jackals have been considered members of Canis, but a jackal is more an ecomorph than a distinct group with a common ancestor. Recent molecular analyses have shown the black-backed and side-striped jackals to be less closely related to the golden jackal that the hunting dog or dhole (as shown in the cladogram). Several people have suggested reassigning these jackals to different genera, Schaeffia for the side-striped jackal and Lupulella for the black-backed jackal, or the latter for both (see Jackal for references). Canids are overdue for a taxonomic reassessment.   Jts1882 | talk  12:31, 24 October 2019 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:

• Canisportrait.png

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 08:52, 2 September 2022 (UTC)

Dagger Symbol

Hi, just wondering what "†" means in this article. Thank you! SeaDragon1 (talk) 17:33, 17 August 2024 (UTC)

It's an international symbol for "extinct". Anaxial (talk) 17:41, 17 August 2024 (UTC)

There is a template {{extinct}}, which renders as †, that can or should be used on first occurence in an article.  —  Jts1882 | talk  19:11, 17 August 2024 (UTC)