Talk:Carlo Biotti

Accuracy of the article

I have edited this article because it had said the exact opposite of what the given sources said. The article had said:

On 27 May 1971 he was recused for having admitted his active membership of a political organisation of the extreme Right.

However, according to the source (ref 2) Biotti was required to recuse at the request of Calabresi's lawyer who claimed that in a private conversation Biotti had admitted he was a supporter of a left wing militant party, something Biotti vigorously denied. Note also, this source (Giornalismo italiano, Volume 4. Monadori, 2009) states that Calabresi's lawyer suddenly asked for the recusal because Biotti had ordered the exhumation of Pinelli's body and that Biotti doubted that Pinelli had died jumping from the window of the police station, as Calabresi claimed. Reference 2 says pretty much the same thing. I'm also going to add the material from A.C. Milan website concerning Biotti's dates of birth and death. He was a director of the club. Voceditenore (talk) 15:27, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

Good catch, Voceditenore, right for left, stupid error on my part, thank you for picking it up. That said, where does the stuff about a private conversation come from? I had the greatest difficulty finding anything resembling a reliable source about this business (there's a seriously non-neutral account of it here) and I don't see anything about that in those I did find. The Civiltà cattolica ref appears to say no more than "il giudice Biotti è stato ricusato dal difensore del Calabresi, avv Lener, per aver ammesso di essere militante di partito di estrema sinistra e di avere idee politiche contrarie a quelle della parte civile". What did I miss? Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 12:46, 27 February 2016 (UTC)

Hi Justlettersandnumbers. You didn't miss anything. The "private conversation" comes from the other sources I consulted which recounted the evidence presented by Calabresi's attorney when asking for the recusal, just to make sure it was left and not right and what the background was. I've now added them to the article. It turns out that the account in the Italian Wikipedia (here) while somewhat exaggerated is not far off from what the sources I've consulted have said, and they seem quite reliable to me, i.e. very notable publishers and newspapers, albeit by authors with mostly left-wing sympathies. Actually the whole affair is slightly more complicated than the way I've presented it here. The accusation of being in collusion with Lotta Continua, came from a private conversation Biotti had with Calabresi's attorney, Michele Lener, some months before concerning a separate case before the court of Milan in which Calabresi was suing Pio Baldelli for defamation. Lener claimed he wrote it down at the time. But he sat on it for over 5 months and then pulled it out for the Pinelli/Calabresi case to get Biotti recused. Voceditenore (talk) 15:09, 27 February 2016 (UTC)

• Hello 79.31.142.172. I understand that you are upset about the error, but it was an honest mistake by Justlettersandnumbers and it has now been fixed. The problem is that this article was created by an editor with the account name Alec Smithson who is globally blocked for causing serious problems on many Wikipedias. For example, this is his block record on the Italian Wikipedia. When that editor was banned, he began using a lot of IPs to continue editing and cause still more disruption. Since you were also editing from an IP, several editors, not just Justlettersandnumbers, thought you were Alec Smithson returning to cause trouble. That is why your edits were removed. I am giving you the benefit of the doubt. Please don't prove me wrong and please do not make any more threats of legal action on Wikipedia. That is strictly forbidden. I assume you are the same person who edited the article and this talk page before as the IP 79.17.164.12 who was blocked for making a legal threat. You cannot edit using another IP if you are blocked. You need to wait until the block expires. If you have any questions about your block or need help in appealing that block, contact me on my talk page. I will not revert your message. When your block expires, I strongly urge you to register an account to avoid any further misunderstandings and to allow us to communicate with you. If you prefer, you can read some of these guidelines in Italian: it:Aiuto:Come registrarsi and it:Wikipedia:Non minacciare azioni legali. Voceditenore (talk) 16:17, 27 February 2016 (UTC)

79.31.142.172, this time I have reverted your comments and your attempts to edit the article itself [1]. You may not edit while you are blocked. You may not edit while your legal threat stands. You may not make personal attacks on other editors. The original error has been corrected. Enough is enough. If you really are the attorney for Biotti's family, and still feel you have a grievance about this article then email info-en-q@wikipedia.org. Please refrain from posting any further on this subject on this talk page or anywhere else on Wikipedia. Voceditenore (talk) 18:06, 27 February 2016 (UTC)

Latest IP edits

We have an IP here, 95.236.138.131, who is quite clearly a sock of globally blocked User:Alec Smithson. The IP had replaced the bolded text in "who claimed that in a private conversation Biotti had admitted he was supporter of the left wing militant group Lotta Continua." with "Biotti had admitted his previous conviction of the final judgment. The English as per usual with this editor is garbled and the edit was accompanied by an edit summary with a not too thinly veiled legal threat. However, on checking the references carefully, the previous version was, in my opinion misleading. Several of the sources claimed that Biotti was under pressure (for career reasons) to find in favour of Pio Baldelli in a libel case brought by Calabresi. Baldelli was the editor of the newspaper Lotta Continua which had repeatedly accused Calabresi of Pinelli's murder. However, that is quite different from Biotti admitting support for the actual Lotta Continua movement. I have now amended the text in bold to read "that for career reasons he had already formed an opinion on the case". Note that Baldelli was a highly respected academic in Italy, and a month after Biotti was forced to recuse, L'Espresso published an open letter in support of Baldelli, signed by a veritable "Who's Who" of Italian journalists and editors. Voceditenore (talk) 09:34, 13 March 2017 (UTC)

Voceditenore. Thank you now is right. you should make sure that someone is not the first time it changed your modiiche you've made now, right now, without nullla say.

However I think the same person did the same thing in serious Inglese simple page that then I would ask you to correct protected in the same way, this serious incident also defamatory in version simple Inglese.

It would also be fair Also it would be fair that you punish the person who has remade this without respect for yourself and for the truth.

--87.2.67.26 (talk) 12:09, 18 March 2017 (UTC)

I have corrected the simple English version. Please note that I was the one who originally wrote the misleading statement about Lotta Continua. I was attempting to correct a previous erroneous statement that Biotti had been a member of a right-wing militant group. Note that the editor on Simple English WP was cleaning up the complete mess you had made of the article there and in good faith replaced it with the content of the article here on English WP. Now, please stop with your talk of "punishment" and veiled legal threats. You are a globally locked account. Please stay away from editing any article on any Wikipedia in any language. Voceditenore (talk) 18:41, 18 March 2017 (UTC)