Talk:Casey Affleck/Archive 1

copyedit cleanup

I rewrote most of the career section. There's still a potential style problem throughout: should he be referred to as "Casey" instead of "Affleck"? Eliz81 23:40, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

I'm Still Here

It was stated that this is a documentary, it is now fully acknowledged that it is a mockumentry so I changed it to say so, problem is it still talks about the subject as if it were truly real which it obviously isn't, except for the extend required to make an er 'mocko'. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Aether22 (talk • contribs) 05:44, 17 September 2010 (UTC)

minor change

I changed the statement that Casey is a "strict vegetarian" to that he is a vegan, as a vegan can always be considered a strict vegetarian, but a strict vegetarian doesn't always mean someone's a vegan. Speaksoyltfos 20:22, 13 October 2007

minor change

There is a discrepancy between the date listed when Casey's son Atticus was born and the article link. It says he was born November 2007, but the article cited is actually January 2008 and Casey's site (which is cited for the DOB on Summer Phoenix's page) says January 2008 for the birth. Walkerb4 (talk) 15:15, 3 August 2010 (UTC)

excessive detail in Early Life section

I propose deleting the following paragraph:

His mother was raised on New York's Upper East Side by her own mother, longtime Museum of Modern Art director of public information Elizabeth Shaw (née Roberts), and her mother's second husband, Samuel Shaw, an attorney. Affleck's maternal grandfather, O'Brien "Obie" Boldt, was a Democratic activist and professor of political science at the City University of New York. One of Affleck's maternal five times great-grandfathers was congressman Adam Rankin Alexander.

There is already lots of detail in the section about his parents' jobs/mother's education/father's interest in acting, and the kind of household Affleck grew up in. Details about Affleck's stepgrandfather and grandparents etc seem excessive to me. Any thoughts?Popeye191 (talk) 20:33, 11 December 2016 (UTC)

I disagree for all the reasons I have indicated at User talk:Sundayclose#Casey Affleck. Sundayclose (talk) 21:26, 11 December 2016 (UTC)

Sundayclose - I've copied and pasted your argument here: "Look again at the family history. The information about grandparents has links to their own Wikipedia articles. That's sufficiently notable to be included." Why do you think information about his stepgrandfather and grandparents should be there - they don't have wiki articles?Popeye191 (talk) 21:41, 11 December 2016 (UTC)

First of all, you haven't copied and pasted my "argument". You selected a few words from my more extensive comments. Please don't misrepresent my position. The grandparent information is notable, and for a second time his grandfather Adam Rankin Alexander has an article. My argument at my talk page is quite sufficient, so there's no need for me to repeat it unless new information is provided here. Anyone who is interested can click the link and read my own position as well as my responses to some of your comments. Sundayclose (talk) 22:30, 11 December 2016 (UTC)

I've looked at your page again and no argument for keeping the paragraph is given other than the sentence I quoted. The definition of a "grandparent" is a parent of one's father or mother so Adam Rankin Alexander is not Casey Affleck's grandfather. Nonetheless, I understand that the fact that the ancestor has a wikipedia page is why you think the sentence should remain. However, why is there rest of the information notable, in your view?Popeye191 (talk) 23:16, 11 December 2016 (UTC)

Again, stop mischaracterizing my comments on my talk page and let others decide for themselves. Most Wikipedia readers aren't too stupid to click the link and read for themselves. Your definition of grandparent is contrary to common understanding, and I don't plan to argue about it; my great-grandfather is my grandfather. So stop splitting hairs and let others decide how they wish to define grandfather. In any event, the information that you dispute clearly and unequivocally states how many generations apart Affleck is from Rankin, so this is a pointless argument. As for the remainder of the disputed information, let me try to simplify this so that you can understand. My opinion is that it is notable; your opinion is that it is not. Neither your opinion nor my opinion is better than anyone else's opinion on Wikipedia. There is no policy on these matters, and WP:CONSENSUS takes precedence over any stylistic concerns. That's why we are having this discussion. Now, for the last time, let's see what others might have to say. Consensus is not determined by how many times you can unnecessarily question me over matters that are already discussed or a matter of opinion, either here or on my talk page. Thank you. Sundayclose (talk) 23:49, 11 December 2016 (UTC)

My take is that Alexander can be briefly mentioned (I.e. "Through his mother, he is a descendant of Adam Rankin Alexander"). The rest is rather much. Snuggums (talk / edits) 02:44, 18 December 2016 (UTC)

---

First, it is clearly excessive detail and trivia. One's great-great-great-great-great-grandfather is not a material part of one's existence, except perhaps if someone is part of royalty or nobility. We are not a genealogy website. See WP:TRIVIA, WP:NOT

Second, quite apart from any notability concerns, Breitbart.com is not a reliable source. This has been repeatedly brought up at the reliable sources noticeboard (WP:RSN) and the general consensus is that it is not reliable. The fact that no other source appears to report the same thing is an indication that Breitbart is not reliable (see WP:USEBYOTHERS.

Third and finally, the burden is on the proponents of the source to demonstrate a consensus that the source is reliable and acceptable to use, especially when the article deals with a living person, as this BLP does. See the prominent notice on the top of the page: "Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article." The material is contentious and poorly sourced and therefore must be removed in accordance with policy. Neutrality^talk 23:34, 28 December 2016 (UTC)

RfC about details in Early Life section

The following discussion is an archived record of a request for comment. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this discussion. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.

Consensus as expressed below and in related section immediately preceding is against inclusion of grandparents information. Also, consensus and BLP policy is against inclusion of material on maternal ancestor due to reliable source concerns. (non-admin closure) Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 22:07, 1 March 2017 (UTC)

---

• Should the "Early Life" section contain the names and professions of Affleck's grandmother, grandfather and step-grandfather?
• Is the discussion of Affleck's maternal five times great-grandfather a) relevant and b) reliably sourced (ethniccelebs.com)? Popeye191 (talk) 10:00, 3 January 2017 (UTC)

Comments

• I'm in general agreement with the rough consensus I see in the discussion above: if pressed, I have to say the material is slightly excessive and unnecessary to an encyclopedic summary of Affleck as a topic. That said, it's an awfully small difference in content to generate for such a hullabaloo. On the other hand, not only is ethniccelebs.com clearly not an RS, it's hard to imagine a source better positioned to define what does not constitute a reliable source. That said, the objection to the content doesn't seem to be that it can never be sourced, but rather that it's superfluous even if it can be. And again, yeah, it's superfluous, but it's only just barely attenuated enough for me to say that. Snow ^{let's rap} 09:33, 4 January 2017 (UTC)

• No on grandparents; they would only really be worth mentioning if they warranted their own articles and/or were big part of subject's life (i.e. was raised by them). Adam Rankin Alexander could be mentioned if reliably sourced, but EthniCelebs most definitely isn't at all a good reference. See Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Noticeboard/Archive 207#EthniCelebs.com for more. Snuggums (talk / edits) 14:51, 10 January 2017 (UTC)

• I would suggest removing this His mother was raised on New York's Upper East Side by her own mother, longtime Museum of Modern Art director of public information Elizabeth Shaw (née Roberts), and her mother's second husband, Samuel Shaw, an attorney. Affleck's maternal grandfather, O'Brien "Obie" Boldt, was a Democratic activist and professor of political science at the City University of New York. One of Affleck's maternal five times great-grandfathers was congressman Adam Rankin Alexander. This is way too detailed considering that his grandparents are not well known. For the content about the ancestor, it is only sourced to one source and it is not authoritative. I would personally prefer not including it. Or if included, say that According to Breitbart,...so and so...may have been his ancestor... --Lemongirl942 (talk) 07:08, 12 January 2017 (UTC)

• No to grandparents, as I generally agree with the arguments above. I would argue that his grandparents should be included, if source material (interview or good newspaper article) could be found that makes it clear his grandparents were very important to his early life and development, for whatever relevant reason. As such, that would make them as important as an influential parent or sibling in my mind. His ancestry, included for the sake of ancestry, I find not worth looking into beyond "he is of X heritage." But even then, ethnicity and family line is meaningless unless they have been proven in the source material to have impacted the person in some way, for example African American activists being influenced by various race-related cultural factors in their career choice. Nationality is much more relevant. And here I am rambling. Logging off now, to sample yet another seagrams flavor (so good, yet so disgusting). Yvarta (talk) 01:56, 14 January 2017 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Starting sentences with numbers

Grammatically that is wrong. Yet in the lede for this entire page it is written:

"2007 was a breakthrough year for Affleck."

It should read:

"Affleck's breakthrough year (Subject) was (Verb) in 2007 (object)."

The year -2007- in this case should be the object not the subject of this sentence because the "breakthrough year" is dependent on Affleck not 2007.

It should be changed accordingly. 82.132.232.240 (talk) 14:47, 27 February 2017 (UTC)

No, it's not.

You are confusing stylistic preference with grammar. Starting a sentence with a number, whether it be a year or otherwise, is in no way contrary to English grammatical standards. As a matter of style, many guides to good journalistic style would agree with you, but even they usually make an exception when it comes to dates. 199.116.168.111 (talk) 21:28, 1 March 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 28 March 2017

{{edit semi-protected|Casey Affleck|answered=no} Casey Affleck's production company made a $5,000 donation to Donald Trump's transition, it should be included in the political section http://www.cosmopolitan.com/entertainment/celebs/a8984761/casey-affleck-company-gave-money-to-trump/ Movieeditor546 (talk) 02:58, 28 March 2017 (UTC)

Emails exchanged with Amanda White

I added this segment to the 2010 lawsuits, as part of the email exchange with Amanda White:

White also wrote "Your unwillingness to move on my deal showed me a fundamental disrespect that was often confirmed by the ways you would speak to me and treat me. Your idea of "ribbing" is hurtful and unnecessary. It[sic] less humor and more a way to disarm and attempt to overpower others..."

Another editor feels this is non-notable trivia and reverted it. I feel it is important enough to be included in terms of how the plaintiff had behaved before resigning. One argument presented against the plaintiff is that she had never complained about work environment before. My addition suggested another side of the argument and balanced the inclusion of email exchanges. I believe simply including the emails that had a positive tone will provide a lopsided argument. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Golta (talk • contribs) 03:27, 12 September 2017 (UTC) --Golta (talk) 03:36, 12 September 2017 (UTC)Golta

References

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