Talk:Charles, Cardinal de Bourbon (born 1562)

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography, a collaborative effort to create, develop and organize Wikipedia's articles about people. All interested editors are invited to join the project and contribute to the discussion. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the documentation.BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Biographybiography articles

Catholicism Low‑importance

Charles, Cardinal de Bourbon (born 1562) is within the scope of WikiProject Catholicism, an attempt to better organize and improve the quality of information in articles related to the Catholic Church. For more information, visit the project page.CatholicismWikipedia:WikiProject CatholicismTemplate:WikiProject CatholicismCatholicism articles

Low

This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Catholicism task list:

Here are some tasks awaiting attention:

Article requests : see Draft articles
Assess : see Category:Unassessed Catholicism articles; Category:Unknown-importance Catholicism articles
Cleanup : Blessed Virgin Mary (see the talk page)
Collaborate : Invitation template needed, see Category:WikiProject invitation templates
Copyedit : Cuthbert Tunstall
Expand : Angelus; Roman Catholicism in Kosovo; Bishop Adolph John Paschang; Cum sæpe accidere; Altar Society; American Board of Catholic Missions; Bernard Häring
NPOV : Americanism (heresy); Ensoulment
Photo : see Category:Wikipedia requested photographs of Catholicism
Stubs : see Category:Stub-Class Catholicism articles; Category:Catholic Church stubs
Update : Peer review; John Aloysius Maguire
Verify : Archdiocese of Glasgow; Archbishop of Westminster; Bishop; Saint Mungo; Sanctification; Westminster Cathedral
Other : Watch recent changes for Catholicism articles

Page Move Reversion

Latest comment: 8 months ago3 comments2 people in discussion

Hi @Srnec:,

I see you reverted my page move on the grounds that Charles II, Duke of Bourbon was also a cardinal. I understand this line of argument but I disagree with it.

The first cardinal de Bourbon was however briefly a major secular lord as the duc de Bourbon and Auvergne, and that is the title his article enjoys despite its brevity. By contrast neither of the two cardinal Bourbon's of the 16th century are known as secular lords. Therefore I don't believe their numbering leads to confusion.

Even if we do not restore the article to Charles II, cardinal de Bourbon, which fair enough, you could make an argument it should be 'Charles II, cardinal de Bourbon and Charles III, cardinal de Bourbon', Charles II de Bourbon-Vendôme is an unsatisfactory alternative as his grandfather was Charles IV de Bourbon-Vendôme. The 'II' numbering only makes sense in the context of him being the second Bourbon cardinal of this period.

I would therefore propose the following compromise. Charles de Bourbon, cardinal de Bourbon (1523-1590). Charles de Bourbon, cardinal de Bourbon (1562-1594) sovietblobfish (talk) 23:02, 2 March 2024 (UTC)Reply

I believe their numbering leads to confusion because it is not in virtue of being a cardinal of the House of Bourbon that he is Charles II. It is as archbishop of Rouen. I don't think that second Bourbon cardinal of this period is good basis for an encyclopedia article title, although it might work as a fudge in a book. I agree that the current title is also unsatisfactory for the reasons you state. I am perfectly happy to use dates in the titles, but I see no need to repeat 'Bourbon'. Srnec (talk) 23:23, 2 March 2024 (UTC)Reply

Hi Srnec,

Dates sounds good to me, and I can lose the double Bourbon if needs be. My main priority is preserving the fact they were cardinals de/of bourbon in the title as this is how I have seen them referred to in every index and every book. :) sovietblobfish (talk) 23:27, 2 March 2024 (UTC)Reply

Add topic