Talk:City of Walls and Secrets

City of Walls and Secrets

On Nick.com, this episode is titled "City of Walls and Secrets" like originally thought, not "The Secret of Ba Sing Se" as it is titled here. I'm not sure if we should think about moving it or just wait closer to airdate incase Nick tries to pull another "Earthbending Tournament" and end up naming it this. I'm interested in hearing someone elses view on this.. -Redsparta 07:31, 16 September 2006 (UTC)

Its already been moved...ah well, worse case, we just move it back if it turns out to be necessary.--Fyre2387 ^{(talk • contribs)} 20:30, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

I just have one thing to say. If the Di Li is spelt like I have spelt it, it would mean literally "Earth Strenght". Di is the Mardiarin Chinese word for earth, Li is a Chinese name meaning strength. Just thought that somebody might like to know. - The Dragon's Daughter. PS: And please don't yell at me saying that's how Nick.com spells it. I don't want another Azula Age War going on. (Now that I think about it, her age being fourteen could be A TYPO! HAVE YOU EVER THOUGHT OF THAT!!??) Thanks.

Nope not at all. We go by Nick.com for all information and even if it's a typo it's still an official source over speculation. Please sign your posts. H2P ^{(Yell at me for what I've done)} 07:31, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Well you shouldn't base ALL your information off of one sight. Half of the things I theorize about Avatar is stuff from my own bank of knowledge. And I was just going to say, I read about the Dia Li, and I didn't know it was named After Chiang Kai-Chek's secret police guy. My apologies to that, but hey, Di Li meanign Earth Strenght is pretty cool. But you shouldn't base everything off of one sight, even if its the "offical" Avatar sight. - The Dragon's Daughter

Your logic is flawed. Nick.com's site is the offical site, therefore all information we get from it, unless contradicted by the actual show, can be taken as factual. Everyone that knows the show can come on here and add all their annoying little theories, but Wikipedia is not a place for theories, it is a place for facts. Wikipedia is not a fan site and its discussion pages are not forums. I would love to have another site to use, but unless the co-creators of avatar create their own site with information, we only have the nick.com site and the shows to provide us with information. H2P ^{(Yell at me for what I've done)} 07:50, 24 September 2006

What about TV.com! That's an good source. True they deal with only the episodes. I once trusted this sight, but now I really don't. It all started with Azula's age. SHE IS FIFTEEN! ITS A TYPO! I don't care if you hate me, but I think this is idiocy! So, you are going to tell me that YOU PERSONALLY don't have ANY theories what so ever? If you say no, I find that EXTEREMELY hard to believe. - The Dragon's Daughter

TV.com can not be used as an official site because it, like Wikipedia, can be edited by it's users and therefore can present false or speculatory information. Unless you have proof that she is 15 and not 14 as Nick.com says, you don't have the evidence to allow that change to stay there and it will quickly be reverted. I have many theories, but I, unlike half the posters here, don't add them because they are theories and not facts. H2P ^{(Yell at me for what I've done)} 08:04, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, well, so what else is new? This sight, is a place that thinks they no everything. I hate know it alls. Just like I hate Azula. Oh, and Azula's age hasn't been MENTIONED in the SHOW! She is still "AGELESS" or better yet, put Age Unknown for her Mai and Ty Lee. And please point out to me where in the show that Sokka and Katara tell Aang their ages? -The Dragon's Daughter a firm suppoter of theories cause they ROCK YOUR FACE OFF!!!

I'm not going to argue anymore, you are doing well enough to support my side. The fact that the show never tells us their ages is why we use Nick.com, because it is the next source aside from the co-creators coming out and giving us information. And apparently, this is the only way I'm going to get through to you: "We don't give a damn about your theories." Oh and by the way, it's site, not sight. H2P ^{(Yell at me for what I've done)} 08:18, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Well. What I'm saying is that you SHOULDN'T USE NICK.COM! And I DON'T GIVE A DAMN ABOUT YOUR STUPID ASSINING KNOW-IT-ALL ATTIDUTE! -The Dragon's Daugther PS: I know how to spell, thank you very much, so if next time you see a typo, don't point it out to me.

Try to listen to reason for a second, ok? Wikipedia has rules. One of those rules is that things need to come from a verifiable source. We can’t just make them up. This isn’t stuff we make up just to bother you, its rules that are applied to every last article on this site. Of course I have theories about Avatar, I have all sorts. I could go on forever about my thoughts on, for example, Aang’s Firebending teacher. But I don’t, because Wikipedia is the wrong place for it.--Fyre2387 ^{(talk • contribs)} 01:23, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

I know there are rules, but I just think that its pretty stupid that there is only ONE sight for pure factual Avatar information. -The Dragon's DaughterFire is in my blood! Water is in my soul! Oh...and ZUTARA RULES! 06:58, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

Technically, there should be two sites for "pure factual Avatar information". Nick.com, and wikipedia. But people keep putting non-factual information up here...so, there is still only one. Bagpipeturtle 22:21, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Normal Animal

There's a little mistake in the Notes: "This is the second appearance of a normal animal (a bear), the first one being a cat in "The Blue Spirit."

We've seen normal frogs in "The Blue Spirit" too. 201.37.197.185 15:36, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

As well as blue jays, butterflys, etc. H2P ^{(Yell at me for what I've done)} 17:44, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

Well, I think that the birds and bugs might not count as much, because they're just minor animals that have little, if no part in the story what so ever and oviously, they made a big deal that there would just be a "bear" at the party. Momoroxmysoxoff 25 September 2006

Plato

I don't know if anyone else noticed this, but it seems to me like there's a connection between Ba Sing Se and the Republic that Plato describes with three very specific classes of citizen with very controlled roles in society. It should also be noted that the Repbulic places severe limits on the production of art and the content of information taught to the public, including lying to promote the ideals of the city-state. I wanted to put this into the article notes section but thought it be wise to bring it up here first. Comments would be appreciated. Thanks- Avogadro

It's interesting, but many governments could be the basis of Ba Sing Se's and listing them all would get redundant since many governments are just scaffolds of previous models. H2P ^{(Yell at me for what I've done)} 15:51, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

Lake Laogai?

File:Avatar-TLAmap.jpg

Click for full image.

I think thats how its spelled.

Anyways, I havent seen the whole epidode, but where is this lake seen? Ive never heard of it before.

I think it's the lake in between the inner and outer walls of Ba Sing Se -Redsparta 19:48, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

It's so far only mentioned on nick's Avatar site, I think. It could be fodder for future episodes. Madd the sane 01:11, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

is that big thing in the northeast ba sing se? its huge --skuj

Errors

I just have a question. I had added some information about some small errors in the episode. One being Iroh asking Zuko if he had seen the Spark Rocks, when he actually has one under his thumb, and the other being when Iroh needs more string to tie his apron, he throws the tea out the window and it can be seen that his apron is now tied. I just was wondering why, did these get removed? Other shows, and I believe episodes reviews of Avatar, do note some of the mistakes. I was just wondering why we can't express these ones as well. Thanks.--TriPredRavage 01:40, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

The errors were proven wrong. I can't remember who did it but it's there somewhere. They'll come forth soon and post it here hopefully. H2P ^{(Yell at me for what I've done)} 01:57, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

Are you sure? Not to cause an arguement, its just that I checked this so many times before adding it that I would really like to see that contradiction. Here are some images. File:Avatar Spark Rocks.jpg File:Iroh Apron Tied.JPG

Sorry for the image sizes, its my first time uploading any images. Anyway, if you look at the "tied" image, the error even seems to go further and have Iroh already have the extra string. If someone could locate that contradiction I'd be greatful. Thanks a lot.--TriPredRavage 04:01, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

I never actually looked. The tied thing looks like a verified blooper. The Spark Rocks thing though could be an error in how we think of the item. He could be holding only one half of a dual pair of functioning items. For instance, he could be holding the striker but needs the flint. H2P ^{(Yell at me for what I've done)} 04:31, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

I had thought about that, too (in regards to the spark rocks). The only problem is that moments later when Jet is shown, he is actually holding both halves. If what you say is true, and one half of the pair is the flint, then I suppose it would be entirely possible that Jet would have only taken that half and all of their replacements for it. I personally hadn't thought of that, and I must say that it is entirely possible. Thanks for bringing that up. But in regards to the tied image, does anybody mind if I reinsert the tied error then? Thanks a lot,--TriPredRavage 12:27, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

Month = 6-8 weeks: Joo Dee said in regards to the gang wanting to speek to the Earth King "your request for an audience w/ the Earth King is being processed & should be put through in about a month. Much more quickly than usual." She added "6 to 8 weeks actually." Considering the average month is roughly more than 4 weeks long, Joo Dee either had a slip of the tongue intentionally written into the script, the writers just made a mistake, or the Avatar world has a different calendar from the real world. Because of the latter possibility, I thought it might be worth including into the Notes section.Auge 00:48, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

She said "in about a month" and used it as a way to keep optimism instead of telling them the real longer period. Due to the dial seen at The Library, i doubt it's anything more than that. H2P ^{(Yell at me for what I've done)} 01:22, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

Fight

It appears that there is a blue line left in the wake of the blades in the fight between Jet and Zuko. This wake can slice through objects. Zuko demonstrates by cutting through Jet's straw. I at first thought it was Zuko firebending, but Jet also had a blue trail follow his blade. I'm not sure I know what I saw or if it is worth mentioning in the article under notes. But, I think it was just another example of the fictional world's physics differing from our own.Auge 00:20, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

sigh, look, just go here to Talk:Zuko and never speak of the sparks again. H2P ^{(Yell at me for what I've done)} 01:22, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

thats a common affect used in anime cartoons. it's not firebending. Bagpipeturtle 22:16, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Character Voice

In the City of Walls and Secrets there is a young earth boy holding scrolls, (he says something about not being a political science student) his voice sounds INCREDIBLY familiar to me, but I could not figure out who he was nor could I find him online. I then realized that he sounds like the geeky kid (sidney Poindexter) from Danny Phantom who is played by Peter MacNicol. Can anyone confirm (or deny or correct) this? You should be able to find the part of the episode I'm talking about here: http://media.putfile.com/ep342put (putfile) (It's a few minutes into this video) Also, does anyone know if there is a place to find ALL of the character names (not just the main or big ones?)

Thanks, J —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 137.141.156.246 (talk) 02:28, 24 April 2007 (UTC).

"Himmler"?

In this article, the man whom the secret police of Ba Sing Se is named after (Dai Li), is being referred to as the "Himmler" of China. Was this a typo? Because he seems to be more like Hitler. --Freespirit1981 00:50, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

Close, but not quite. Himmler commanded the SS, ran the concentration camps, etc. He was the one ruling the secret police, just like Long Feng. JBK405 00:55, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

Thanks, JBK! :) --Freespirit1981 00:57, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

No problem, that's why we have these Talk pages. JBK405 01:10, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

JBK, what do you think about adding a Wiki link for Himmler in this article? Not everyone knows who he was. I know that I didn't.--Freespirit1981 18:59, 20 July 2007 (UTC)