Talk:Cobra (game engine)

Notability concerns

I don't want to send this to AFD right away, but notability is not demonstrated. I have taken some time to try to find further sources with WP:VG/S's custom search engine, but there are no in-depth independent sources that cover the engine. Here is a break down of all the sources I found and their suitability:

1. [1] - Interview, non-independent. Passing mention only in one paragraph stating how it powers several Frontier games.
2. [2] - Interview, non-independent. Already in use.
3. [3] - IPO announcement, passing mention as being the reason Frontier wanted to raise IPO funds.
4. [4] - Passing mention in a caption as being the in house engine used for two games.
5. [5] - Passing mention in one sentence as Frontier's in-house engine

Without in-depth coverage, this topic simply isn't notable. Notability is not inherited from the fact that games that use the engine are themselves notable. -- ferret (talk) 20:15, 7 October 2024 (UTC)

The Cobra engine is absolutely notable. It has been used in 17+ games. Many of these games are world-famous and sold millions of copies worldwide. The Cobra engine also did some very innovative things such as for Elite Dangerous to simulate the Milky Way galaxy. That makes it an important video game engine in gaming history. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Artanisen (talk • contribs) 20:59, 7 October 2024 (UTC)

I appreciate your views on the engine, but notability is not established in the way you are stating. WP:GNG and WP:NPRODUCT have to be met, and the engine does not inherit notability from the games that were developed with it. In all of my searching, the most I could uncovered were passing mentions of "The game uses the engine". This is not in-depth or sustained coverage of the game engine. -- ferret (talk) 21:01, 7 October 2024 (UTC)

There is enough to support this game engine to be notable and important in the video games industry and video game history. This engine is not as popular as Unreal Engine, but it's certainly noteworthy with a lengthy list of world-famous games. Without the Cobra engine, games like Elite Dangerous wouldn't have existed back in 2004. Elite Dangerous was only possible on the Cobra Engine.

1. [6] - interview with 3 paragraphs about the Cobra engine's entity component system and simulation code that is used for Planet Zoo.-Artanisen (talk) 21:06, 7 October 2024 (UTC)

   Hi Artanisen: Interviews do not contribute to notability as they are promotional and non-independent. The interview contains a single response from the developer with no critical commentary or secondary statements. It's a wonderful source for the development section of Planet Zoo though. -- ferret (talk) 21:10, 7 October 2024 (UTC)

   Article in Custom PC magazine (August 2017). The website has an excerpt: "When Elite Dangerous launched in December 2014, it supported an engine capable of rendering a procedurally generated galaxy populated by billions of star systems. With the aid of its Stellar Forge technology, these systems were simulated according to realistic physics, covering everything from the age and composition of stars to how the light from individual suns illuminates specific celestial spheres." - this was groundbreaking when Elite Dangerous launched in December 2014. Still no other space sim does what Elite Dangerous is capable of thanks to the Cobra engine. It also describes the versatility and flexibility of the Cobra engine, because it powers Planet Coaster and Planet Zoo as well. - Artanisen (talk) 21:46, 7 October 2024 (UTC)

I'm adding this prior to opening AFD. The following source analysis is based off the article version as of: Special:Diff/1250724065. Numerals refer to the sourcing order as they appeared in that revision.

1. Primary source (Developer's website)
2. Interview
3. Non-independent blog post interview (Author is a localization blog, no editorial oversight)
4. Primary source (Developer's website)
5. Just a company directory
6. Interview about Elite: Dangerous with passing mention (I highlighted this one in my original post)
7. Passing mention in relation to Planet Coaster (I highlighted this one in my original post)
8. Primary source (Blog post by the developer)
9. Primary source (Guest post by the developer)
10. Interview with single passing mention
11. Print magazine interview. Unfortunately offline, might be the best source thus far, but is heavily in the context of Elite: Dangerous.
12. The first of several sources about the planet/system generation of Elite: Dangerous. This one makes no direct mention of Cobra. They speak in terms of an Elite: Dangerous sub-system specifically, Stellar Forge.
13. This is the first about TRAPPIST-1, and how Stellar Forge happened to almost predict it. Cobra is not directly mentioned.
14. Same
15. Same. This article references a "trusty Cobra". This is a reference to an in-game ship with the name Cobra, not the engine.
16. Same

With no secondary reliable coverage that focuses on the engine itself with any depth, I am sending the article to AFD. -- ferret (talk) 13:41, 12 October 2024 (UTC)

Noting for the record the additionally added VentureBeat source does not help with the notability issue. It's a passing mention that the company is raising funds to work on its engine/SDKs, with no actual details or commentary on such. It's almost a press release. I noted it above in my original post. -- ferret (talk) 16:30, 12 October 2024 (UTC)

Wholly disagree with your unfair and overly strict scrutiny of this article. The article sources are credible on Wikipedia. Video game news websites get information from either the developers, publications, media outlets, public statements by the company and such. Cobra's systems have been used and explained in lots of articles, but usually part of the game title. For example when articles describe Planet Coaster, Planet Zoo, Elite Dangerous, Kinectimals, Rollercoaster Tycoon 3, Kinect: Disneyland Adventures, Screamride, LostWinds they tend to describe the systems as part of those games while these are in-fact systems of the Cobra engine which has made these games possible. The Cobra engine has made a big impact on the game industry with popular and ground-breaking games. For example the modular piece-by-piece building, and the voxel-tech of the map editor in Planet Coaster was very sophisticated when PC launched. The lifelike dinosaur behaviour and the astronomically accurate (as far as possible at the time) of Elite Dangerous has been praised by the gaming media. Low-importance articles are allowed on Wikipedia too. - Artanisen (talk) 17:24, 12 October 2024 (UTC)