Talk:Csaba Csere

pronouncing his name

Does anyone know how to correctly pronounce his name? "Csaba Csere (pronounced tʃaba tʃədə)" does not really help. --ProdigySportsman 20:41, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

I agree, back in June, I posted "Chubba Chedda", which is referenced here and here, but someone thought that it would be better to use the IPA system, which few ordinary people understand. --rogerd 21:33, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

Nice work rogerd I believe your references and understand "Chubba" from "Csaba" but don't know how they get "Chedda" from "Csere," lol. BTW, Car and Driver subscriber since December 1998. --ProdigySportsman 00:53, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

I don't know. Well how about Mike Krzyzewski, I see they list the IPA and something that us mere mortals can understand:

ʃəʃefˈskiˌ; in American English transliteration "shuh-shef-skee";

perhaps I will update this article with a similar formatting. --rogerd 01:54, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

The IPA is the norm for pronunciations, but is left out of most Americans' education. (Even Canadians use it now.) So IPA it needs to be, as this is an international encyclopedia, and Americans really limit themselves if they never to learn to use a dictionary other than Webster's. But that said, the IPA transcription was wrong. I'll try to fix it up. kwami (talk) 23:02, 19 May 2009 (UTC)

Greetings, herd. As referenced to above and to assist in verifying the veracity of that declarative statement, I, the Mighty Obbop, star of neither stage nor screen, distinctly recall reading within Car and Driver magazine many years ago that the closest pronunciation of the bloke in question's name is phonetically spelled "Chubbah Chedda." For some unfathomable likely perverted reason that phonetic spelling snagged a few of my remaining active still-functioning neurons and deeply embedded that generally worthless memory within my sere withered brainlet.24.206.248.102 (talk) 22:56, 20 December 2008 (UTC)

"Chubbah" is close to the Hungarian pronunciation (though not a perfect match).

In "Chedda" just try to pronounce a short "r" instead of the "d". The two "e" sounds in "Csere" should be pronounced like the first vowel in the word "cherry".

Good luck. :) Squash Racket (talk) 13:12, 21 December 2008 (UTC)

If you want the Hungarian pronunciation, just type his name in the {{IPAc-hu}} template, separating each letter or digraph with a pipe. It will convert automatically to IPA. But as the editor of Car & Driver, we should have an English pronunciation. So far "Chubba Chedda", as odd as that seems, is the only English pron. I've seen. (The recent edit was a mix of English & Hungarian, & therefore wrong for both languages.) kwami (talk) 10:40, 21 December 2009 (UTC)

I changed only one letter (d -> r) in the IPA pronunciation aid which
- exists in both languages (if it gives anyone a sense of satisfaction, I in fact copied it from the IPA for English chart because I wasn't sure if the same Unicode character codes IPA/English r and the letter r).
- Both in Hungarian _and_ in English, his name should be pronounced with an r between the e's. My changes reflect the correct(ish) (or widely believed to be correct by numerous sources, including the person in question himself) English pronunciation of his name. I use the term correct(ish) because I'm not sure if anything like 'Chubba Chehreh' could be considered correct on Wikipedia; but for the IPA part, I definitely and positively _am_ correct without remarks. I don't know why should Wikipedia users get obviously false information and why didn't you take one minute to get your facts right.

Please watch the first 10 seconds of this video (I guess he himself is
- accepted as authoritative on the subject
- speaks English well enough to resolve this issue).
First hit for 'Csaba Csere' BTW.

If you still think I'm wrong please fill me in what am I missing. I do hope I can tell the difference between Hungarian and English pronunciations of the same name (at least when it's so obvious like this one). Maybe it's time to look for another source and ignore this one on the grounds that there's audiovisual proof against its reliability and car magazines are rarely cited for substantiating pronunciation claims. --ThE6HU7A (talk) 12:50, 21 December 2009 (UTC)

Not to actually wade into this very deeply, but just one bit of info regarding d vs r: It's a phonemic thing. Alveolar-tap /r/ (as opposed to retroflex /r/) "sounds to an American" like "d". So whether you're philosophically a technical purist who insists on transcribing it with an "r" character (r/ɹ), or you're a "pronunciation respelling realist" who thinks it has more practical value on Wikipedia to transcribe it with a "d" character, neither side can say that the other side is groundless or stupid for choosing their choice. Both sides have entirely defensible transcription logic on that particular point (i.e., what written character should be used to stand for an alveolar tap). — ¾-10 20:02, 27 February 2010 (UTC)

I can't tell if that's an English or Hungarian pronunciation. It seems half & half, so it really doesn't help much. How do others pronounce his name, with a /d/ or with an /r/? kwami (talk) 20:58, 27 February 2010 (UTC)

Interesting question, because IMO the "correct" answer depends on which "others" are asked and therefore (1) which continent they're from and (2) whether their perspective is emic or etic. To the average American layperson, who knows nothing of phonetics, phonemics, linguistics, transcription theory and practice, or the emic/etic distinction, "Chubba Chedda" is what makes sense to their brain circuits, and it is the transcription that will get them as close as they're going to get to the Hungarian pronunciation, or to Csaba Csere's own pronunciation of his own name (to whatever extent those two differ from each other phonetically, which probably isn't much). Because if you tell them that the transcription is "Chubba Chere", they're going to reach for a retroflex r, not an alveolar tap. In other words, an "American r" is *farther* from "Csaba Csere's own pronunciation of his own name" than is an "American d", so you're better off telling the average American layperson to use the "d". The exact same principle comes up with Guy Fieri. — ¾-10 22:28, 27 February 2010 (UTC)