Talk:David Boyle (archaeologist)

wikilink or unlink collector names or start articles

Hi, i recently arrived at this article as part of wp:DPL's efforts to eliminate ambiguous links in Wikipedia, and specifically on a campaign to eliminate them in WikiProject Canada's articles. John Long was the one term linked to a disambiguation page. The passage is now:

In 1884, Boyle became curator of the Canadian Institute Museum, a post he held until 1896, and of the Ontario Provincial Museum from 1886-1911. He cultivated a core of loyal collectors across southern and central Ontario who assisted him in archaeological digs and in collecting artifacts for the museums. These men included Andrew Frederick Hunter, George E Laidlaw, J. Hugh Hammond, John Long, Dr Thomas W. Beeman, William Wintemberg and Frederick William Waugh. He was also the Secretary of the Ontario Historical Society after 1898, and became highly influential in the local historical societies that grew up in Ontario in the late ...

I unlinked it but then was reverted asked why by Trekphiler. The best other option would be to revise it to be a redlink with a disambiguating parenthetical, perhaps John Long (archaeology volunteer), and to add the redlink to the disambiguation page.

My reasoning for delinking was that I believe from the context that this John Long is not a Wikipedia-notable person, so redlink calling for an article should not be set up. Per this article he was one of "a core of loyal collectors" cultivated by David Boyle in his role as curator of two museums. The collectors sound like nice people who were volunteers, important enough for Boyle to have credited them I presume, and important enough for an editor here to choose to list them out. I don't disagree with giving them credit but I do not imagine there are sources enough to develop articles about them (however I am open to being corrected on that). They all are "redlinks" and in fact all of them should be delinked, if there is not sourcing about them.

I must acknowledge that I did not try to check any sources in the article to see if more information is readily available, I just made an educated guess. But just now I did, and I see that in fact there is no info in the online sources: 1) unfortunately the historic plaque link no longer works,and would have been short and not about volunteers I imagine, and 2) the link about Aboriginal Material Culture in Southern Ontario only goes to a book ordering page.

Addendum: The book Collections and Objections: Aboriginal Material Culture in Southern Ontario by Michelle Hamilton is in Google, has no John Long mentions, but it does have a couple mentions of Thomas Beeman. --doncram 20:52, 18 September 2015 (UTC)

Hmm, googling on ( "John Long" archaeology Ontario -wikipedia ) does bring up some possible hits. There was a "John Long" who was owner of 2 sites with archaeological potential per this, but there's no more than mention of his name, among hundreds of others. Some other possible hits turns out to be about an English fur trader John Long whose 1791 writing was republished in 1971 ("Long, J. 1971 "Voyages and Travels of An Indian Interpreter and Trader, Describing the Manners and Customs of the North American Indians; With an Account of the Posts Situated on the River". Saint Laurence, Lake Ontario, etc. Reprinted. Coles Publishing, Toronto. Originally published 1791, Robson, Bond Street, London, England.)

Trekphiler, do you think there are sources about him (and the others)? I see that the wikipedia article was created by you in November 2008 in this version, which didn't give that list, someone else added it later, so maybe you and/or that other would know. --cheers, --doncram 20:24, 18 September 2015 (UTC)

P.S. FWIW, William Winterberg is the only one of those exact names which has any other redlink to it (from Port au Choix Archaeological Site article); he is mentioned at Port au Choix National Historic Site of Canada. The complete info is a timeline entry: "1929 -- William Wintemberg of National Museum of Canada makes an archaeological survey from Bonne Bay to Port au Choix on Newfoundland's Great Northern Peninsula. Numerous sites found, including the large site of Phillip's Garden at Port au Choix."

And Googling ( "William Winterberg" archaeology -wikipedia) yields snippet "In the late 1920s, William Wintemberg, considered the father of Canadian archaeology, returned to Tadoussac (Wintemberg 1943) and began a series of... " (emphasis added) from History in the Making: The Archaeology of the Eastern ... https://books.google.com/books?isbn=0759120242 Donald H. Holly Jr. - 2013 - Social Science. So Wintemberg at least merits linking (or could we just start an article about him?). --doncram 20:39, 18 September 2015 (UTC)

♠I opposed removing the link (& prefer keeping a redlink) on the belief whoever put it in to begin with knows if the person merits (or might merit) a page. If Long doesn't (or if any of the others don't), remove the redlinks.

♠I'd agree, Winterberg seems to merit a link; if there isn't a page, I'd say, start it. TREKphiler ^{any time you're ready, Uhura} 23:48, 18 September 2015 (UTC)