Talk:Dewoitine D.520/Archive 1

Archive 1

Rumoured Romanian use

There are rumours about use of the D.520 in Romania, but no evidence was ever exhibited. The postwar DC conversion did not serve outside France. PpPachy 20:31, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

Sorry for entering info about DC version as Romanian one. My memory didn't served me well and I linked it with IAR-80's DC two-seat version. - Piotr Mikołajski 13:38, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

To the anonymous contributor that keeps adding Romania: every serious source about the D.520 (take Cuny & Danel's or Ehrengardt's books, for example) says no evidence exists Romania actually operated the type. It looks very much like an error that gets copied and pasted over and over. You say: In 1942, a small amount were sold to the Romanian Air Force by the Germans, but few of them actually saw combat due to lack of mechanical parts. => Great, tell us which serial numbers they got, which unit used them, from which airfields, and so on. I'm not on a crusade against you, I just tend to think some author once mistook Bulgaria for Romania and now others take him as gospel. PpPachy 22:49, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Dewoitine D.520.jpg

Image:Dewoitine D.520.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

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BetacommandBot (talk) 21:27, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

Operation Torch claims

There's been an edit and a rollback on this edit but I think the anonymous poster was in good faith. US pilots 'claimed' more than one D.520 over Casablanca, but they misidentified H-75s for D.520s, and they overclaimed (like any other air force in WWII). Also, some of the US air losses were indeed due to French aicraft. I'll try to update this with info from Ehrengart and Shore's book. PpPachy (talk) 18:44, 24 February 2009 (UTC)

10th July 1941 in service of Vichy

10 July 1941. Seven Tomahawks from 3rd RAAF Sqd claimed five of five engaged Dewotine destroyed. Only two Dewotine were lost and three returned to base. Three Blenheims were shootdown and one crashlanded on return, six others had some lesser damage. http://surfcity.kund.dalnet.se/commonwealth_turnbull.htm 89.253.89.107 (talk) 19:46, 9 January 2010 (UTC)

Gorrini... and GPM, again

Despite what Gorrini has said about, D.520 was: faster than MC.200, was better suited for night missions, had radio set, had a much longer endurance, it was appreciated also for cockpit design and easy exit from a spin. It had not only merits, such the weak undercarriage and the low reserve of gun ammunitions; despite that, what Gorrini said, is not that important, especially if we get another source, that Gorrini said exactly the opposite (even about MS.406s). So this is a bit unreliable statement, IMO.Stefanomencarelli (talk) 00:16, 20 September 2010 (UTC)

New tags added to article...

New tags have been added to this article stating that it has several problems, yet the editor who added these tags has not bothered to elucidate exactly what in his opinion needs to be changed. Would User:Dave1185 please elaborate, rather than just tagging? Minorhistorian (talk) 01:31, 12 March 2011 (UTC)

Dewoitine design for Hispano-Suiza: the HS.50 or D-600, a follow on to the D-551

I thought I would bring to your attention a website (2014) that mentions this aircraft, with a picture; however the article and reference is quite brief. Those of you with more expertise and experience can look into this, decide if you can use this reference and picture (or some other reference) and if it rates a comment in this article, either down under the D-551, or on a separate line as the D-600/HS.50?

In addition there is another picture under a modeling website showing the never built HS.50/D-600. I can only conclude, therefore, that knowledge of this aircraft design is out there in the world!

Apparently Monsieur Dewoitine, worked for Société Industrielle Pour l’Aéronautique under the Vichy government. In France he only designed trainer aircraft, but if this article is correct, he worked on this advanced fighter design for Fascist Spain during the War as well. In France he was viewed as a collaborator and was not welcome in France after the War. Therefore, he continued traveling and designing elsewhere in the world after 1946.

The WIKI page on Émile Dewoitine mentions his working with both Société Industrielle Pour l’Aéronautique and with Hispano Aviación. The WIKI page on Société Industrielle Pour l’Aéronautique does not mention him at all, neither does the WIKI page on Hispano Aviación. If the information from this website can be verified and cited, then all three of those other pages should be updated.

There might be more information available from books or sources in Spain, but they are probably written in Spanish. 146.88.41.106 (talk) 18:11, 2 October 2016 (UTC)

References

Use of D.520 fighters in the 1940 French Campaign (some errors)

Hello,

Interesting page, as a whole a useful contribution. I don't know everything on all D.520s but I found a few surprising errors:

QUOTE:

"(...) (After GC I/3) Four more Groupes de Chasse and three naval Escadrilles rearmed with the type before France's surrender.[34] GC II/3, GC III/3, GC III/6 and GC II/7 later completed conversion on the D.520. A naval unit, the 1er Flotille de Chasse, was also equipped with the Dewoitine. However, only GC I/3, II/7, II/6 and the naval AC 1 saw any action in the Battle of France.[22] GC III/7 converted to the D.520 too late to be involved in any action."

- As you know GC I/3 was the first fighter unit to use the D.520 in combat (on May 13, 1940, 4 victories; on May 14 they lost 2 and won 10 victories). It was tightly followed by GC II/3 on May 15 (4 first combat losses and 5 victories on May 21). The next D.520 unit was GC II/7 (formerly MS 406s, receiving D.520s from May 20 to May 29 with 3 victories on June 1st, 1 on June 2, 2 on June 5 and 5 first combat losses on June 5). GC III/3 (MS 406s before that) was fully reequipped with D.520s from May 28 to June 7 (first combat loss: 1 fighter on June 5; 3 victories on the same day, 2 more on June 6). Then came GC III/6 (Le Gloan's unit), reequipped from MS 406s to D.520s from Junbe 11 to 22. Main source: book "l'aviation de chasse française 1918-1940", by Raymond Danel and Jean Cuny. Source for victories and losses: book "Ils étaient là..." by Paul Martin (2000).

In air combat, mostly against the Italians, the Dewoitine 520s claimed 114 air victories, plus 39 probables.[36] "Mostly against the Italians" is surprising NONSENSE. Only 8 victories were won by D.520s on Italian aircraft (most of them by Le Gloan, some together with capitaine Bernache-Assolant) for the fightiung across the French-Italian border lasted for only a few days before the end on June 25. Source: book "Les pilotes de chasse français 39-45" published 1999 by Aéro-Éditions.

QUOTE: "One of the most successful D.520 pilots was Pierre Le Gloan, who shot 18 aircraft down (four Germans, seven Italian and seven British), scoring all of his kills with the D.520 Wrong again: Le Gloan won 4 "certain" victories, flying Morane 406s, on 4 German bombers or recce-AC: 2 Do 17s or similar AC during the "Phoney War" (Sept. 1939-June 9 1940) and 2 He 111s in May 1940. All his victories were officially shared with one or more other pilots according to the French victory system (one full victory was credited to all pilots having taken part in the fight), but it is highly probable that Le Gloan actually shot almost all victims alone or was instrumental in their destruction. Source: see end of preceding paragraph.

Yves Michelet (main French historian on the 1940 air fighting) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:1205:5038:5C60:914A:888B:CE6C:274 (talk) 14:45, 8 June 2020 (UTC)