Talk:Djenné

Untitled

Having lived in Djenné years ago and read on it since, I've noted that there is a wealth of misinformation on it and the region. This is not entirely surprising given the unusual (for Westerners) nature of the environment (seasonal floodplain, in effect; "tributaries" are actually defluents) and the society of the area (highly diverse ethnically and linguistically). I certainly don't claim to be an expert but have tried to improve the rendering of some of the text. --A12n 23:54, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Dating?

This article states that the city was originally founded at Djenné-Jeno in 300 CE, but the Djenné-Jeno article itself says 250 BC instead. Which of these dates is correct? Looking at the out-links, the World Heritage site says 250 BC. The outlinks from the Djenné-Jeno also say it was first settled in the 3rd Century BC, but are unclear when the settlement first became urban in scope. From the scholarly "Antiquity of Man" site it looks like Djenné-Jeno was urban starting in Phase II (40-400 D) or at least by year 400. -- 209.162.56.40 18:53, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

Adobe & Mud brick

There is a slow-moving discussion on these two articles and whether they should be merged. I personally don't see that the difference is clear enough to merit separate articles and references unless the whole discussion of earthen building is restructured (see my remarks in the discussion sections of those articles). However I would like to insist that the mention of the Great Mosque in this article have refereces to both. --A12n 23:54, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

History Channel video as a source

I've removed the inline citation to support the claim that Djenne is the oldest known town in sub-Saharan Africa. "Heaven on Earth: Islam", November 23, 2004 video documentary, History Channel. Producer/director, Stephen Rooke. Scriptwriter/host: Christy Kenneally. TV documentaries are usually unsuitable as sources of information for Wikipedia. Aa77zz (talk) 13:50, 16 February 2009 (UTC)

Sack of Ghana etc

The article contains this statement:

"The sack of the Ghana Empire by the Almoravids in 1076 allowed Djenné to surge forward as a major town in the region."

The belief that the Ghana Empire was sacked by the Almoravids has been discredited. For the lack of evidence see: Fisher, Humphery J. (1982), "Review: Early Arabic Sources and the Almoravid Conquest of Ghana – Review of Corpus of Early Arabic Sources for West African History by J. F. P. Hopkins ; N. Levtzion", Journal of African History, 23 (4): 549–560, JSTOR 182041

For the historiology see: Masonen, Pekka; Fisher, Humphrey J. (1996), "Not Quite Venus from the Waves: The Almoravid Conquest of Ghana in the Modern Historiography of Western Africa", History in Africa, 23: 197–232, JSTOR 3171941

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This text is in a note:

"Between the 11th and 13th C., Arab sources identified Djenné as the dominant commercial center of west Africa, the major terminus of the gold, salt and slave trade of the Trans-Saharan trade route."

I believe this is incorrect - there is no mention of Djenné in the Arab sources of this period. This is discussed by the McIntoshes (1981) who write: "The failure of any Arab or European source prior to the mid-fifteenth century to mention the town by name has convinced various historians of the Western Sudan that Jenne did not exist substantially prior to this time."

• McIntosh, Roderick J.; McIntosh, Susan Keech (1981), "The inland Niger delta before the empire of Mali: evidence from Jenne-jeno", Journal of African History, 22 (1), Cambridge University Press: 1–22, doi:10.1017/S0021853700018983. Also available here.

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"Djenné brief period of dominance came to an end in the 13th C., with the rise of the Mali Empire," There are no sources for this period. Aa77zz (talk) 08:56, 28 April 2011 (UTC)

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