Talk:Drake–Kendrick Lamar feud/Archive 2

Archive 1

Archive 2

Add Yuno Miles to parties on Kendrick's side

Yuno Miles (an objectively well-known rap artist) dropped a Drake diss on YouTube [1]here. He should be added to the parties. I would do it myself but I can't due to the article semi-protection. Cartt0nn (talk) 06:01, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

If you can find notable and reliable third-party sources about Yuno Miles'... contribution, feel free to link them. (P.S. does someone wanna try working on that Wiki article?) Cadenrock1 (talk) 06:34, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

The track has gone relatively viral, and I personally think that virality is enough to be mentioned, but I do not think it has any sources outside of the video itself. I do not believe that this would count as a reliable source, but someone please correct me if I'm wrong. GLORIOUSEXISTENCE (talk) 08:16, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

Virality is not enough, we want it to have been picked up by other (reliable) sources stating its impact before mentioning it. Chaotıċ Enby (talk · contribs) 15:52, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

I also cant edit the page and was about to ask this but looks like Carton has the same idea. So since we need sources are these fine?: [2] and [3]. Someone should put the info about yuno miles because on TikTok and social media, at least, yuno miles is clearly part of the feud Freedun (talk) 08:53, 24 May 2024 (UTC)

Kendrick Lamar, Kendrick Lamar, Drake, Kendrick Lamar, Drake, Drake, Kendrick Lamar, Drake. Literal bars. 2600:8803:C307:1800:D870:B4D5:1376:C2E7 (talk) 19:32, 24 May 2024 (UTC)

fr. Freedun (yap!) 19:35, 24 May 2024 (UTC)

EbonyPrince2K24

No mention of the Ebony Prince, the House of Ebony, The Mark Hotel or Christopher Alvarez? @77.249.116.246 good idea i think this should be added Freedun (yippity yap) 07:40, 26 May 2024 (UTC)

Reliable sources available? Delukiel (talk) 05:04, 28 May 2024 (UTC)

I don't think that account has any relation with the feud. Even if Kendrick did use one of their images, and the account's accusations against Drake do align with Kendrick's, it's still a separate thing from the feud. Plus, it's accusations, and WP:BLP and WP:UNDUE guidelines apply. Spinixster (trout me!) 06:02, 28 May 2024 (UTC)

do you think if i made an article about EbonyPrince2K24 it will get approved? Freedun (yippity yap) 11:17, 30 May 2024 (UTC)

It depends. If there's WP:SIGCOV for the account, and it doesn't violate WP:NSUSTAINED (which probably can only be decided after the feud has died down), it might be acceptable. Spinixster (trout me!) 04:22, 31 May 2024 (UTC)

I saw wp:BLP1e somewhere so that rule probably applieshere Freedun (yippity yap) 10:30, 31 May 2024 (UTC)

so i won't make the page for now Freedun (yippity yap) 10:31, 31 May 2024 (UTC)

alright you know what I'm going to make a page that redirects to this. i think that would make sense Freedun (yippity yap) 03:32, 3 June 2024 (UTC)

U My Everything in "Songs Involved"

Why is Sexyy Red and Drake's "U My Everything" in the songs involved in the feud box? I don't think it should be in that section because there's no lines dissing Kendrick whatsoever, other than him rapping over the BBL Drizzy beat. If anything, it should be in "Related songs".

Edit: I only bring this up because I feel that the song involved box should be the songs between Kendrick and Drake. Sandwichcipher (talk) 22:47, 27 May 2024 (UTC)

I second this. It is obviously connected to the ongoing feud because of the brief "BBL Drizzy" instrumental, but nothing more than that. (Also I agree this song should stay in the "Related songs" section.) Ragnarulv (talk) 09:02, 28 May 2024 (UTC)

it.. kinda makes sense. drake references the beef. Freedun (yippity yap) 03:34, 3 June 2024 (UTC)

Yeah, but I feel like the songs involved section should be more towards the songs where it's more directed towards each other. He didn't really direct Kendrick at all on "U My Everything", and if anything, him being on the BBL Drizzy was more a shot towards Metro instead. Sandwichcipher (talk) 03:57, 3 June 2024 (UTC)

I see what you mean i see its already moved so lets just keep it that way Freedun (yippity yap) 06:34, 4 June 2024 (UTC)

Add or not to add?

Yo y all. Made Wah Gwan Delilah. Should this be added to Related songs Freedun (yippity yap) 01:36, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

It doesn't seem related to the feud, so no. Spinixster (trout me!) 07:50, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

Kendrick's "support" of R. Kelly

Kendrick wanted to remove his catalogue not in Kelly's defense, but because Spotify was unfairly targeting black artists. Can someone change this? Kamo0606 (talk) 14:44, 8 May 2024 (UTC)

To clarify more, Kendrick was arguing about why only black artists that ended up being creeps were given so much attention enough for them to be removed on Spotify, while Spotify keeps the likes of David Bowie, Marilyn Manson, Marvin Gaye, Mick Jagger, Steven Tyler, etc. etc. so many equally creepy rock and country artists that remain. Echonioni (talk) 09:42, 16 May 2024 (UTC)

I'm not sure if there are more comments regarding this situation. This article regarding Kendrick's defense of R. Kelly and XXXTentacion states that they received a comment from Anthony "Top Dawg" Tiffith, not Kendrick himself.

https://pitchfork.com/news/kendrick-label-head-confirms-he-threatened-to-pull-music-from-spotify/

https://www.billboard.com/pro/top-dawg-warned-spotify-ceo-kendrick-lamar-others-pull-music-hate-conduct-policy/ Latter-operation-820 (talk) 17:10, 1 June 2024 (UTC)

Please fix this. Lamar did not threaten Spotify, Tiffith did. Saying that Lamar threatened Spotify is factually incorrect. 2603:8000:7F0:B1D0:B5DA:7F6:FA13:3EA1 (talk) 04:58, 16 June 2024 (UTC)

 Fixed in Special:Diff/1227356825. I clarified that Lamar threatened to remove his catalogue because he opposed Spotify's announced removals of Kelly's and XXXTentacion's music from their official playlists. I've also removed the Rap-Up article because the relevant part of the article is a cursory summary of claims attributed to linked X/Twitter posts, which cannot be used for claims about living persons per WP:BLPSPS; Wikipedia cannot claim that Lamar supported Kelly or XXXTentacion because a social media user said so.

Finally, I removed two sentences of additional information about Kelly and XXXTentacion in Special:Diff/1227357109 as undue weight, because the extra coverage was disproportionate compared to the description of Chris Brown's and Tory Lanez's domestic violence incidents in the same paragraph, which was limited to the phrase "both of whom had been arrested for domestic violence". — Newslinger talk 07:36, 5 June 2024 (UTC)

thank you! Kamo0606 (talk) 16:14, 10 June 2024 (UTC)

Kendrick did not do or say anything. It was his label that did. Saying that Kendrick was responsible here is factually incorrect. 2603:8000:7F0:B1D0:E141:1994:CDC9:313B (talk) 17:33, 16 June 2024 (UTC)

Few more celebrities in support of Kendrick / Weight / Hypocrisy section

I don't know of any reliable news source who has covered this but the following artists have supported Kendrick:

• DJ Mustard (this one is obvious)
• YG (commented support on the former's IG post)
• Pusha T (liked tweets about Kendrick winning)
• Joe Budden (thinks he won, at least)

And obviously in support of Drake:

• Akademiks
• Ish
• Mal

Weight

Onto the second thing I wanted to bring up is the weight given to the sentiment that this beef has gotten out of hand or that it reflects poorly on hip hop. My impression is that this is actually a pretty minority view, particularly in the "Verdict" section. Questlove has been mocked pretty extensively for his opinion, and given the section already says most commentators view Kendrick as the winner, I think that deserves more expansion. I don't think this means it's not worth including: on the contrary, I think it is, since Questlove is one of the greats and forefathers of the genre, but his opinion is given roughly the same weight and space as the rest of the verdict section. (Edit: this has been addressed and I think the current Verdict section is satisfactory.)

I also think we should include some views from people who think Drake won for the sake of balance.

Hypocrisy

I don't think either of the sources for that section are up to snuff (the Analysis section). 135 and 136 are just articles rehashing social media posts, the bottom of the barrel of journalism, and I don't think they are sufficient to justify the sentence they're attached to. Both articles just compile tweets to advocate their point of view. This WaPo opinion doesn't exactly reflect the same idea in the sentence but I view it as a better source.

I also want to note that personally I think that takes like the WaPo article and The Ringer's will almost assuredly be forgotten with time and won't age very well, and I don't think they reflect a great understanding of hip hop's ethos. This perspective may be completely useless to this article, but maybe someone more intelligent than me can turn that into something workable. Delukiel (talk) 08:44, 17 May 2024 (UTC)

I don't think the current verdict section is satisfactory. It still centers minority opinions and gives them undue weight. Namely, the idea that this reflected poorly on both artists and the implication that there is some level of symmetry to their shortcomings. This is purely bothsidesism/false balance. The majority of people believe Kendrick overwhelmingly won and humiliated Drake. Kendrick's credibility and character is either improved or unharmed, while the opposite is true for Drake. This is unequivocally a victory for Kendrick and a loss for Drake in terms of their career and reputation. Kendrick becoming feared and Drake becoming a laughing stock should be mentioned somewhere. The people who believe this was a mudslinging contest are also widely seen as out of touch. 2603:8000:7F0:B1D0:E141:1994:CDC9:313B (talk) 17:47, 16 June 2024 (UTC)

I do agree that the majority opinion is that Kendrick won overwhelmingly, and that it's a minority opinion that this reflects poorly on hip hop, however at the time of writing this observation was tempered by the opposing views.

If/when the section is expanded I think more is warranted, but for now, I think it's fine as is. Delukiel (talk) 19:29, 18 June 2024 (UTC)

Pharrell's song

Someone has put Pharrell's song in the History section, right after The Pop Out. I thought that section was supposed to be only related to Drake and Kendrick Lamar's feud, Pharrell has nothing to do with it. Should it be included? Spinixster (trout me!) 08:47, 17 June 2024 (UTC)

Yeah, it doesn't make sense to elaborate on Pharrell's song there (it's less connected to the feud than a few of the other related songs which only get listed in the table). That subsection should, for now, only be about the Juneteenth concert. Felida⁹⁷ (talk) 18:32, 17 June 2024 (UTC)

I'll be removing the parts about Pharrell's song for now. Spinixster (trout me!) 04:50, 18 June 2024 (UTC)

Pusha T did not diss drake in duppy freestyle

check the full song chronology table where pharells track is mentioned especially where description is added, pusha t dissed drake in a track story of adidon as a response to duppy freestyle, duppy freestyle is a song made by drake and is used to dissed kanye and pusha t

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Story_of_Adidon is the pusha t's diss toward drake 39.58.234.130 (talk) 20:47, 21 June 2024 (UTC)

Juneteenth show adds?

Dr Dre and Ty$ are already added but what about the other people who preformed. Dom Kennedy, Steve Lacy, Tyler, the Creator, Roddy Ricch, YG, Schoolboy Q, Jay Rock, Ab-Soul along with the openers; Mustard and DJ Hed ThyOfThee (talk) 19:22, 22 June 2024 (UTC)

I'll add YG since he not only was on stage but is going to appear in the NLU music video. I think the TDE artists are probably a given, though I wouldn't oppose their addition. Delukiel (talk) 15:46, 23 June 2024 (UTC)

"Parties"

I think it's most accurate to remove everyone other than Drake and Lamar from the infobox "Parties" entry.

Drake and Lamar dissed each other on their own songs (except Like That, a Future song). Including a list of single artist who has dissed Drake or Lamar since March 2024 is outside the scope of the infobox.

Every other song, by other artists, made independent of Drake/Lamar and without their cosign is only tangentially related to the two artist's beef. Those songs aren't included in the "Works" entry. Including the artists who recorded them it the "Parties" entry is inconsistent.

Risedemise (talk) 02:21, 24 June 2024 (UTC)

I undid this edit, sorry. I think you should wait for more consensus before making such a big change.

That said, I don't have a particularly strong opinion on this. The way I see it, it could be a few ways:

• Artists who directly made or contributed tracks about the beef, so Metro, Rick Ross, and Kanye on Kendrick's side for example but not YG. Maybe The Game on Drake's?
• Artists who publicly supported them, which is more or less what it is currently, but this could get unwieldy
• Removing the parties section altogether.

I think I'm most partial to the first. It keeps the list short, keeps relevant info in the infobox, and avoids it becoming unwieldly which I think is the risk of number 2. Number 3 I'm not totally opposed to but I think it sort of defeats the point of having a "parties" section to begin with, since the page already says Drake–Kendrick feud. I also would prefer us to have a quick way to say who supports who, but I'm not going to be mad or anything if it's gone. Delukiel (talk) 04:17, 24 June 2024 (UTC)

I removed it without waiting because it's better to err on the side of lacking information than including potentially incorrect information.

My concern about "Artists who directly made or contributed tracks about the beef" is I think it may imply coordination/support that didn't actually happen. To put it simply it seems like everyone is taking shots at Drake, rather than supporting Lamar, which I think the Parties entry implies.

"Artists who publicly supported them, which is more or less what it is currently". It's missing Drake's supporters. See Drake–Kendrick Lamar feud#cite_note-115. And I think this is a bad idea, because commenting support is barely contributing. And plenty of other celebrities and critics have commented, too, so why the distinction for musicians? This list would definitely be too long for the infobox. Risedemise (talk) 07:45, 24 June 2024 (UTC)

These are good points. I do think it'd probably be lopsided in favor of Kendrick even if we stick to the first one, but didn't Game release a track dissing Ross because Ross was posting on Instagram? There's one person at least.

To be honest it really just seems nobody really showed up for Drake, even though he was expecting people to, so I think it'd be accurate to that extent. But like I said I don't have a very strong opinion on this, so I'm indifferent to whatever the end result is. Delukiel (talk) 20:40, 24 June 2024 (UTC)

I also think the "since" dates may be misleading, as most of the parties listed have only released a single song related to this feud. Risedemise (talk) 07:45, 24 June 2024 (UTC)

Bbl Drizzy in songs involved?

BBL Drizzy was technically a diss targeted at drake therefore it should be under song involved. ArizonacardinalsFan (talk) 15:39, 28 June 2024 (UTC)

It's already under related works. Delukiel (talk) 20:19, 28 June 2024 (UTC)

Can it really be said that the feud is "ongoing"?

The only new content after the "heart part 6" is a music video for "not like us". It really seems like both sides are sorta done with the beef. Ahmed0112 (talk) 03:26, 7 July 2024 (UTC)

Until we have a source saying it's over, we have to assume it's ongoing. If some time from now there's still nothing, then we can alter how the dating of this feud is presented. ~ Pbritti (talk) 04:40, 7 July 2024 (UTC)

I would actually disagree with this, insofar as we already have sources say it's over (mainly from TDE). However I agree with your conclusion, because I don't think that Drake and Lamar will ever patch this up. It'll probably be ongoing forever. Delukiel (talk) 01:46, 14 July 2024 (UTC)

I would even argue the opposite, i.e. that you hardly say that the feud is over at this point (depending on how you define "feud") or that the two are "done with the beef"... Not just because it's only been two days since the music video and barely three weeks since the Pop Out concert but also because of the nature of the feud. Personally, I think this will be ongoing for a while (see other long-standing rap feuds). Although, as Pbritti said, we may alter the presentation if there's really nothing new some time from now. Felida⁹⁷ (talk) 15:32, 7 July 2024 (UTC)

i have listened to the song multiple times and I belive that the beef will be ongoing after the song drakes career is also pretty much over even though the two will probably not say anything to fix it i think it could also still end so i'm not sure what to think lets see URGURLNELE (talk) 18:42, 6 September 2024 (UTC)

There may be something to gleam from Kendrick's Super Bowl announcement. Drake had posted something in his Instagram a while back saying "We will win game two." and in Kendrick's Super Bowl announcement, he says "There's only one opportunity to win a championship. No round twos." Which seems to suggest that Drake wants to go another round, but Kendrick is done. CFijWPG (talk) 12:55, 16 September 2024 (UTC)

Yuno Miles intervention?

Yuno Miles created what is probably the most famous verse on the BBL Drizzy beat, even if it was of a comedic nature. Should his freestyle be at least mentioned under the section about BBL Drizzy? TheBigGuyBillyBob (talk) 13:50, 9 July 2024 (UTC)

If there are no reliable sources, it should not be included. See WP:RELIABLE. Spinixster (trout me!) 08:24, 10 July 2024 (UTC)

What qualifies as a reliable source? And what would it be a source for? TheBigGuyBillyBob (talk) 18:09, 10 July 2024 (UTC)

I've already linked the relevant page explaining reliable sources. For a list of it, see WP:RSP. The source should mention Yuno Miles's BBL Drizzy verse. Spinixster (trout me!) 06:41, 13 July 2024 (UTC)

What i'm supposed to source, I

guess, was really what I should have asked. 24.214.75.60 (talk) 01:04, 26 July 2024 (UTC)