Talk:Du, o schönes Weltgebäude

Note a

Is this your German translation or some obscure old German? There are some errors: jenseits, folgenden Strophen, beruft sich auf Dichter. Grimes2 (talk) 14:52, 9 May 2022 (UTC)

Pinging Mathsci. TSventon (talk) 15:41, 9 May 2022 (UTC)

@Grimes2: Gerda's English translations of "antic" and "decorative" were incorrect; and she pleaded for help on my user talk page. The translations in the footnote are not word-by-word translations. Jenseits - "the hereafter" is what happens after "Death", i.e. "heaven", "salvation", etc, exactly as described in the hymn and a large part of the content in BWV 56. For stanzas 2, 3, 4, etc, these are stanzas following the first; or alternatively the remaining stanzas. Only the first and fifth stanza (with their English translations) occur in the article; and there is commentary on the fourth, where the phrase "ancient figurative imagery" is used (a transferred epithet). The phrase "Dabei ruft der belesene Dichter auch die Bilderwelt antiker Dichte" appears in the WP:RS but not "beruft sich auf Dichter". Have you checked the original German?

The article had several errors due to Gerda Arendt, including all image and audio files. In English books or music magazines, Cantata 56 is usually referred to as the "Kreuzstab cantata" (in German, "Kreuzstabkantate"). I haven't seen "cross-staff cantata" anywhere, except in the title of some vocal scores or parts. The DYK should more accurately refer to "Kreuzstab cantata", instead of a concocted title. Mathsci (talk) 16:23, 9 May 2022 (UTC)

Dichte means density, Dichter means poet. both possible. Where can I find the German original? Grimes2 (talk) 16:30, 9 May 2022 (UTC)

It's the Pöhlmann ref, and it says "Dichtung" (poetry), not "Dichte" (density), which is now in the article. I believe that the ref should be added to the footnote but was reverted. Rehearsal tonight, please solve it without me. - For cross-staff vs. Kreuzstab in the hook: I don't expect our general readership to understand without help what Kreuzstab is, and believe an English translation (which doesn't claim to be any title, just a lower-case translation) may serve those. If you don't agree there's WP:ERRORS, not this talk page. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:49, 9 May 2022 (UTC)

Here the original: "Die Freuden dieser Welt bedeuten für den Dichter, der sich nach dem Jenseits sehnt, nichts. Die folgenden Strophen variieren diesen Gedanken unablässig. Dabei ruft der belesene Dichter auch die Bilderwelt antiker Dichtung zur Hilfe, wie man schon in der vierten Strophe bemerkt:" Note: folgenden Strophen. Grimes2 (talk) 17:06, 9 May 2022 (UTC)

Already corrected a long time back. Thus Dichtung, so poetry. It was rendered as poetic or figurative. It is the third stanza that is mentioned, not the fourth (so the reference had a mistake).

Andre mögen durch die Wellen

und durch Wind und Klippen gehn,

ihren Handel zu bestellen,

und da Sturm und Not bestehn;

ich will auf des Glaubens Schwingen

aufwärts in den Himmel dringen,

ewig da bei dir zu sein,

allerschönstes Jesulein!

In Catherine Winkworth's English rendition this is

Others dare the treacherous wave,

Hidden rock and shifting wind—

Storm and danger let them brave,

Earthly good or wealth to find;

Faith shall wing my upward flight

Far above yon starry height,

Till I find myself with Thee,

Jesus, dearest Friend to me!

Although the half sentence suggests passing allusions to classical mythology (Scylla, Charybdis, etc), the hymn is firmly rooted in Lutheran pietism. This passing mention is WP:UNDUE at the moment, unless mentioned in greater detail by another comnentator. Mathsci (talk) 17:31, 9 May 2022 (UTC)

References