Talk:Duchy of Estonia (1561–1721)

Duchy of Estonia

Hi Domino theory,

I've been thinking about the move you made for some time, just that the reason I haven't made a move because the Danish dominion, currently named Danish Estonia was also Duchy of Estonia. So I just wonder how should we proceed with this, Should we call these for example Duchy of Estonia (Denmark) and Duchy of Estonia (Sweden) and make Duchy of Estonia into a disamb page or? Andy ideas welcome! Thanks!--Termer (talk) 23:13, 24 August 2008 (UTC)

Both Estonia and Livonia were duchies under Swedish control, and I agree that it is appropriate to use that terminology in the title of the article. Working with both articles I recognized that in the case of Livonia there was an immidiate need to solve the disambiguation issue, and as you diligently point out there is need to establish a working disambiguation here too. I suggest that we use the same system for the disambiguation as in the case with Livonia, with was contemporaneous as well as geographically adjacent. One reason for choosing years over countries was, apart from imposing less bias to the article name, to maintain some flexibility in regards to the situation that there are already no less than five articles relating to Polish Livonia. Apart from that Danish and Swedish Estonia will work as redirects, which will make it easy to find the articles. -- Domino theory (talk) 20:05, 25 August 2008 (UTC)

sounds good to me!--Termer (talk) 21:56, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

PS. I've only found 3 articles about Polish Livonia? Is there 2 more?--Termer (talk) 22:03, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

Actually there are three more; each of the three voivodships that Polish Livonia was subdivided into in 1598. The remainder of Polish Livonia continued as Inflanty, but the Principality of Inflanty and Inflanty Voivodeship are one and the same as you have pointed out. I think there might also be a question in what sense the Polish Duchy of Livonia functioned after 1598, when the three voivodships were established. The Polish Wikipedia has articles on each of the voivodships but there doesn't seem to be one corresponding to the duchy after the voivodships was established.

Great work btw on finding a map here! I was also thinking that the appropriate coats of arms should be used. While the Swedish coat of arms would be used for king's realm as a whole, each of the possesion had its own achievement of arms. I believe that Estonia used the same as the current, but Livonia used the griffin with a sword and I have seen a coat of arms for Ingria. -- Domino theory (talk) 08:23, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

Ambiguity?

I am unclear on how the simple title "Duchy of Estonia" is ambiguous? Srnec (talk) 04:02, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

because there has been 2 Duchies of Estonia in history. the first one was the duchy of the Danish Kingdom in the 13-14 century. And the other-one was a dominion of Swedish Empire in the 16-18 cantury.--Termer (talk) 22:00, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

We need an article on the other one. Srnec (talk) 19:31, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

It's there , just that it's still called Danish Estonia and would need to be renamed at one point since Duchy of Estonia was the official name of the place at the time--Termer (talk) 20:41, 19 October 2008 (UTC)

It seems that Swedish Estonia would be still the preferred title for this article see: Talk:Duchy_of_Livonia_(1629–1721)--Termer (talk) 16:00, 21 October 2008 (UTC)

OK, renaming at least this article back to descriptive "Swedish Estonia" was not justified. During the Swedish era the country was called "Duchy of Estland" [1]. And there are sourced that use Latin spelling "Duchy of Estonia" 1561. [2]. Duchy of Estonia, formally formed in 1561 on the basis of Swedish-controlled North Estonia [3]--Termer (talk) 21:55, 31 October 2008 (UTC)

Military section

What is the purpose of this unsourced section? It's only a long list of red links, with no proper information. I suggest that it should be removed unless reworked substantially.

Yakikaki (talk) 19:52, 28 September 2013 (UTC)

Ok, since there have been no objections I'm removing this section as it seems to fulfil no real purpose. Yakikaki (talk) 19:46, 10 October 2013 (UTC)

Wrong flag

The flag is the flag of the Swedish armed forces nothing else. Zzalpha (talk) 04:46, 12 February 2023 (UTC)

So which one was used for this territory during the time period? TylerBurden (talk) 15:29, 13 February 2023 (UTC)