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Talk:Eggcorn/Archive 6

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Latest comment: 1 year ago by Cnilep in topic Memmott 2015 user-generated content?
Archive 1←Archive 4Archive 5Archive 6

Debate / defend / reject / submit examples here (old)

Latest comment: 8 years ago45 comments32 people in discussion

This topic is particularly necessary to clarify the relatively new topic of eggcorns.

  • This is totally "original research" and thus unsuited for inclusion in the article, but for over 40 years it's given me the occasional chuckle. I was going to help a friend drive from Minneapolis to D.C. He was entering the Army, and I was going to catch the D.C. to NYC train. We left Minneapolis, to spend the night at his parents' home in rural Minnesota, and the next morning we would set out for the East coast, and drive straight through, sharing the driving. That evening, at dinner, his mother repeatedly referred to the asparagus as "aspara grass"! I bit my tongue the first time I heard it, thinking I must have misheard her. But by the time we were well into the meal, and having heard it repeatedly, I knew that for whatever reason, that was what she truly believed to be the name of the vegetable. Best guess is that she believed it actually was a type of grass, and then concluded that it must have been the "aspara" variety. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.234.98.181 (talk) 08:29, 25 June 2016 (UTC)
  • Sixty-five roses instead of cystic fibrosis Moochigeh (talk) 03:43, 18 April 2015 (UTC)
  • Mythconception instead of misconception — Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.72.151.49 (talk) 09:06, 30 September 2012 (UTC)
I don't think this is an eggcorn as much as it is a simple misspelling. For a word misusage to be an eggcorn, the incorrect wording has to have something to do with the actual wording. What does "purging" have to do with "perjuring"?Acire93 (talk) 17:14, 4 June 2014 (UTC)
Again, I don't think this is an eggcorn as much as it is a simple misspelling. What does "peak" have to do with "peek"?Acire93 (talk) 17:14, 4 June 2014 (UTC)
  • In season 7, episode 8 of Friends, the character Joey causes amusement by using the phrase "moo point" for "moot point." When questioned, he explains the idiosyncratic logic behind his eggcorn: "It's like a cow's opinion: it's just doesn't matter. It's moo."<ref>{{cite web|url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ifdqEmlx-I|title=Friends - moo point|publisher=YouTube|accessdate=2013-03-27}}</ref>
Added by IP 115.87.204.32 27 March 2013. Moved here by Cnilep (talk) 02:06, 28 March 2013 (UTC)
This is just a malapropism.Acire93 (talk) 17:14, 4 June 2014 (UTC)
And it only works with American pronunciation. It makes no sense in UK or Australian pronunciation. HiLo48 (talk) 05:45, 31 August 2014 (UTC)
  • yay or nay insted of yea or nay<ref>{{cite web |url=http://english.stackexchange.com/questions/817/is-yay-or-nay-an-acceptable-alternative-to-yea-or-nay |title=Is 'yay or nay' an acceptable alternative to 'yea or nay?' |publisher=English Language & Usage |accessdate=2013-08-08 }}</ref>
Added by User:Antiaverage (talk) 8 August 2013. Moved here by Cnilep (talk) 00:15, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
  • "the pot calling the kettle back" instead of "The pot calling the kettle black"<ref>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_pot_calling_the_kettle_black</ref>
  • "damp squid" instead of "Damp squib"<ref>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Damp_squib</ref>
Two addition from 86.19.169.154, moved here by Cnilep (talk) 00:54, 7 November 2013 (UTC)
  • Step foot instead of set foot <ref>{{cite web|last=Howard|first=Ross|title=The Eggcornin' Bob Dylan|url=https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/alt.usage.english/pXM5SEMtuKk/WaA9j6ra4SkJ|work=alt.usage.english|accessdate=14 December 2013}}</ref> <ref>{{cite web|title=The Eggcorn Database|url=http://eggcorns.lascribe.net/english/101/step-foot/|accessdate=14 December 2013}}</ref> TypoBoy (talk) 05:15, 14 December 2013 (UTC)
  • "Sliding pond," which I first heard in the 1970's in a Brooklyn playground when a mother told her child to " go on the sliding pond.". I was perplexed until I saw the correct usage as follows: which should be " slide upon." Seen in Constance Garnet translation of "War and Peace." (User: Edwardtemple) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Edwardtemple (talk • contribs) 14:54, 16 March 2014 (UTC)
I grew up in Queens in the 1960s, and we called it a sliding pond, too. I haven't heard the term in years! Looking at the definition of eggcorn in the article, I'm not sure this qualifies. Whereas it is an idiosyncratic substitution, it's not clear what it's a substitution for. See this blog.[1]. Since most people outside of New York City just call it a slide, I don't think this qualifies as an eggcorn. Paulmlieberman (talk) 18:26, 21 September 2014 (UTC)

Added by 219.92.166.243 at 07:34, 2 May 2014; moved here by Cnilep (talk) 07:54, 2 May 2014 (UTC)

I feel like this one should be added; I've heard it plenty and it actually is an eggcorn and not a malapropism (unlike a lot of the examples given above)Acire93 (talk) 17:14, 4 June 2014 (UTC)

Darrell Duane 07:27, 29 June 2014 (UTC)

  • would of instead of would've

75.84.83.45 (talk) 05:38, 31 August 2014 (UTC)

  • 'Penn State Nifty Lions' instead of 'Penn State Nittany Lions'

guest user — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.97.94.221 (talk) 19:46, 18 September 2014 (UTC)

  • Cutting the mustard instead of cutting the muster. This is very common. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Menme (talk • contribs) 08:34, 15 October 2014
I find this one fascinating, as I've often wondered what on earth mustard would be cut for, and why cutting is even necessary. However, I don't think it's an eggcorn. I think it fits more in the category of mondegreen; if mustard was originally muster (and there are contradictory origin stories for this phrase), then the substitution is really based on a mishearing, just like wrapped up in a douche for revved up like a deuce. Paulmlieberman (talk) 13:02, 16 October 2014 (UTC)
  • peak one's interest instead of pique one's interest.
  • taken for granite instead of taken for granted. An ex of mine used to use this. It drove me nuts. Of course, she meant that something which was granite was un-moving, constant, and solid. If one could take something for granite, then it was a sure thing. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 73.159.235.146 (talk) 03:21, 16 July 2016 (UTC)
  • misconduct in a public office instead of misconduct in public office invites visions of public sex on the town hall reception desk, rather than crime by a public official. It is endemic on the BBC (British Broadcasting Corporation) nowadays.
  • one foul swoop instead of one fell swoop - Divebombing cockerel?
  • unchartered territory instead of uncharted territory - another BBC speciality, bringing to mind the BBC's Royal Charter, one of which's stipulations is that the BBC should 'educate' the populace.

Add a List instead of / in addition to the examples

Latest comment: 12 years ago2 comments2 people in discussion

Having the examples is nice, but I also think a list of these would be welcome, especially for people wondering which form is the correct form of a word. --Harikawashi (talk) 08:16, 12 October 2012 (UTC)

There are currently links to two lists of eggcorns in the External links section. A new stand alone list on Wikipedia might be created subject to policies on notability and verifiability, as well as the standards described at Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Stand-alone lists. Cnilep (talk) 02:10, 13 October 2012 (UTC)

Moving from here to the article

Latest comment: 10 years ago4 comments4 people in discussion

At what point are items deemed important enough to move to the main article? We can't just keep a list on the talk page without having some sort of process for moving qualified candidates to the article, otherwise they remain here forever. Sp!ke (talk) 14:14, 3 July 2013 (UTC)

Much as there is no deadline, there is no hard and fast rule for when or why to change the examples in the article. Note, by the way, that the examples are not "important enough" to be included; they are illustrative of the phenomenon. There is a suggestion, above, to create a stand-alone list, which presumably would include all notable (not quite the same thing as "important") examples meeting its criteria for inclusion.
In practice, most example languish here until the list gets too long and is moved to a talk archive. The last example added to the article was preying mantis in February 2012. Preying mantis had actually been in the article until December 2011. Before that expatriot was added in July 2010. These were added because editors discussed them on this page and decided they were better examples than rot iron and old-timer's disease, respectively. Cnilep (talk) 01:53, 4 July 2013 (UTC)

I favor moving the "for all intensive purposes" example to the page now. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Xplodotron (talk • contribs) 18:53, 23 October 2013 (UTC)

I agreeAcire93 (talk) 17:14, 4 June 2014 (UTC)


Individuals Known for Eggcorns Section

Latest comment: 9 years ago4 comments4 people in discussion

I think it would be nice to add a section where we discuss (or at least list) people (real people and fictional characters) who are known for their eggcorns. One example that comes to mind is Ricky from Trailer Park Boys, whose eggcorns and malapropisms have been nicknamed "Rickyisms" by fans. Rickyisms include "escape goat" for scapegoat, "incubaker" for incubator, "Juniper" for Jupiter, "Vacational School" for vocational school, and "Survival of the Fitness" for survival of the fittest.

What do people think of the idea of including a section of this sort? Or is it more that when someone's plays on words achieve that level of notability it warrants a separate entry? For example, we of course have an entry for Spoonerisms. Probably nobody else will ever achieve the notability of Spooner in this respect, but there are some others who are also famous for plays on words, and I am thinking that for those who are particularly known for their eggcorns, it might be nice to note such things in the eggcorn article. Thoughts? Tamarleigh (talk) 05:40, 19 December 2013 (UTC)

No objection in principle, but I'd be surprised if there were enough such individuals to merit a separate section. Based on the examples you've given, it looks like most Rickyisms aren't eggcorns. (Only one of the five examples, "incubaker", looks like an eggcorn to me.) Do you know of any reliable sources that link Ricky to eggcorns? The show's producer says something about him in this video, but my internet isn't working well enough for me to see it. Adrian J. Hunter(talk•contribs) 11:41, 19 December 2013 (UTC)
Here's my transcription of producers Barrie Dunn and Mike Volpe's remarks from the video Adrian J. Hunter linked to. (I may have missed some words, but this is roughly accurate.)
Dunn: We call them Rickyisms because these things are things that Ricky says, or mistakes. We call them 'Rickyisms', but it's all these phrases or expressions that Ricky comes out with that totally changes [sic] the original meaning. Actually, the meaning is better than the original.
Volpe: Oh, it's- you understand the meaning.
Dunn: He takes words and he, and he uses them wrong.
They call the words "Rickyisms" and "mistakes", but not "eggcorns". Cnilep (talk) 03:27, 20 December 2013 (UTC)

I never knew this had its own term. I always just called it ignorance and butchering the English language. I will say I've never heard a soul say "mating name" instead of "maiden name" though. --219.89.83.234 (talk) 21:46, 31 July 2015 (UTC)

Latest comment: 7 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

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Changes come slowly; don't chomp on the bit!

Latest comment: 7 years ago2 comments2 people in discussion

Somebody recently added "chomp on the bit" as an eggcorn for "champ on the bit". It was reverted, and I heartily agree. An eggcorn typically adds a bit of information, or humor, or both to the meaning of the original. The phrase "chomp on the bit", as a variation of "champ on the bit", does neither. It is a result of a shift in English. The term "champ" meaning "to bit or chew noisily" has become antiquated and rarely used, and has been replaced by "chomp". See [1] for more. Paulmlieberman (talk) 13:59, 3 October 2016 (UTC)

An eggcorn I encountered in the diaries of the mass-murderer Fred West: "car of van" for "caravan". Nuttyskin (talk) 05:02, 4 April 2017 (UTC) Nuttyskin (talk) 05:02, 4 April 2017 (UTC)

Proposed additions November 2019

Latest comment: 5 years ago4 comments3 people in discussion

Out of the previous list, some don't really seem like eggcorns, or likely mistakes, but I've definitely seen "beckon call" in print multiple times. Recommend adding it.

I'd also like to suggest adding "Phoenician blinds" for "Venetian blinds". I know perfectly well that they're "Venetian", but for some reason I sometimes hear "Phoenician" when people mention them—and it turns out that people have been making that mistake since at least 1893: here, in the Ohio Educational Monthly, vol. XLII, Samuel Findley, Akron, Ohio, and collected in Marshall Brown's Bulls and Blunders, Lakeside Press, Chicago (1893), repeated in Humour of Bulls and Blunders, University Press, Cambridge, Massachusetts (1906), among others; here it is in Tom Robbins' novel, Skinny Legs and All, Bantam (1990), and Richard Lederer's The Revenge of Anguished English, Macmillan (2007). P Aculeius (talk) 23:12, 18 November 2019 (UTC)

Thanks P Aculeius, but both examples sound like regular malapropisms rather than eggcorns. Please see Talk:Eggcorn/Archive_4#Proposal_to_radically_reduce_the_number_of_examples for why it's best if we stick with clear, unambiguous examples. Adrian J. Hunter(talk•contribs) 23:52, 18 November 2019 (UTC)
According to this article, a malapropism differs from an eggcorn in that it creates a nonsensical phrase, while an eggcorn exhibits creativity, logic, or ignorance... how is either of the suggestions nonsensical? "Beckon" is derived from the same root as "beck", and has a similar meaning, so it makes perfect sense as a substitution for the similar-sounding "beck and" in the phrase "beck and call", although it arises from ignorance of the idiom. It's a textbook example of an eggcorn. Similarly, the phrase "Phoenician blinds" isn't nonsensical; it's the substitution of one demonym for another arising from ignorance, but it makes just as much sense—it's simply unidiomatic. They're certainly better examples than "mating name" or "spurt of the moment", since "maiden" and "spur" are familiar words in everyday use, and much less likely to confuse people than "beck" or the very different cultures of Venice and Phoenicia—whose descriptive adjectives just happen to sound very much alike. And while "preying mantis" makes a lot of sense, it's as likely to arise as a spelling mistake as from a misunderstanding between whether the mantis is named for its posture or its behaviour. If you want "clear and unambiguous" examples, these are the ones you want. P Aculeius (talk) 00:44, 19 November 2019 (UTC)

The two following examples were added by User:McRousers on 30 November 2019, and removed by User:Cnilep on 2 December.

  • baited breath instead of bated breath
  • off one's own back instead of off one's own bat

Note that "baited breath" appears more than once in the talk archives; there has never been consensus to add it. Cnilep (talk) 08:18, 2 December 2019 (UTC)

True examples of eggcorns

Latest comment: 4 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

My daughter once worked with a man who used lots of eggcorns. (And had no idea they were incorrect) Such as: Go through something with a fine toothcomb He didn't batter an eyelid Well have to batter down the hatches They were calm and collective about the situation — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2.24.62.92 (talk) 08:29, 1 March 2020 (UTC)

Other Examples of Eggcorns?

Latest comment: 4 years ago2 comments2 people in discussion

1. Nip it in the butt (bud) - since there are fewer people growing plants 2. Go for the juggler (jugular) - juggler works best when those you are targeting are clowns! 3. Wet your appetite (whet) - hopefully with a nice drink :) --Althecomputergal (talk) 15:28, 16 June 2020 (UTC)

Actually, none of these are eggcorns. They fail the test "The new phrase introduces a meaning that is different from the original but plausible in the same context". Paulmlieberman (talk) 02:41, 17 June 2020 (UTC)

Proposed example

Latest comment: 4 years ago6 comments5 people in discussion
  1. ^ "The Grammarphobia Blog: Slip sliding away". Retrieved 21 Sep 2014. {{cite web}}: line feed character in |title= at position 25 (help)
  2. ^ https://stancarey.wordpress.com/2012/08/26/why-people-misspell-just-deserts/
  3. ^ "Bone Apple Tea". Know Your Meme. 2018-07-03.
Added to the article by User:Robdawg344 04:06, 7 May 2018‎. Moved to talk page by Cnilep (talk) 01:19, 8 May 2018 (UTC)
I support the addition of 'Bone apple tea' as it is particularly famous. Jamgoodman (talk) 19:13, 31 July 2019 (UTC)
I also support the addition of 'Bone apple tea'. It is famous and illustrates the eggcorn concept fairly well. Chrisma0 (talk) 19:12, 23 July 2020 (UTC)
I believe the addition of 'Bone apple tea' would be useful. There is a redirect here and it is a humorous phrase that many younger people might know. DIS (talk) 19:12, 23 July 2020 (UTC)
Added to the article 21:31, 20 July 2018‎ by User:Hferlauto. Moved to talk page by Cnilep (talk) 23:41, 20 July 2018 (UTC)

Psychology Today

Latest comment: 4 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

The URL of the Psychology Today article cited here has been excluded from the Wayback Machine. Should we remove the links entirely? PT is a magazine, so the article is probably available offline anyway. Glades12 (talk) 10:23, 27 July 2020 (UTC)

Sole mate

Latest comment: 4 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

A quick Twitter search will show lots of daily usages of “sole mate” instead of “soulmate.” Some are jokey but many appear to be earnest mistakes. It’s an eggcorn in the context of a monogamous relationship - one’s soulmate can also be the only one with whom they are mated. Eg https://twitter.com/_nickie/status/1291091627365339136 X883 (talk) 22:05, 5 August 2020 (UTC)

Proposed examples

Latest comment: 4 years ago10 comments10 people in discussion
  • abject lesson (object lesson)
  • all and all (all in all)
  • another thing coming (another think coming)
  • beckon call (beck and call)
  • biting my time (biding my time)
  • bold-face lie (bald-face lie)
  • butt naked (buck naked)
  • chomp at the bit (champ at the bit)
  • day in age (day and age)
  • deep-seeded (deep-seated)
  • doggy-dog world (dog-eat-dog world)
  • duck tape (duct tape) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 131.106.56.153 (talk) 19:46, 6 August 2020 (UTC)
  • jerry-rigged (jury-rigged)
  • pass mustard (pass muster)
  • Old-Timers' Disease (Alzheimer's Disease)
  • one in the same (one and the same)
  • should of (should have)?
  • take it for granite (take it for granted)
  • towing the line (toeing the line)
  • worse comes to worse (worse comes to worst) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 73.66.142.147 (talk) 23:16, 19 September 2019 (UTC)

Htroberts (talk) 17:27, 17 July 2019 (UTC)

I support the addition of "Welsh rarebit" and "doggy-dog world" but few other examples you've listed are very common. Jamgoodman (talk) 19:15, 31 July 2019 (UTC)
I would like to see at least "doggy-dog world" be included. It's very common and exemplifies the idea very well, imho. It's also the title of a Snoop Dogg single: Doggy_Dogg_World. Here's a grammarist.com entry on it: https://grammarist.com/eggcorns/doggy-dog-dog-eat-dog/. If there are no objections I would add it.Chrisma0 (talk) 19:10, 23 July 2020 (UTC)

"Bone Apple Tea" Redirect

Latest comment: 3 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

Bone Apple Tea should not be redirected here, as the faulty phrases don't have the same meaning. Instead it should be redirected to Malapropism. --Mrmariomaster (talk) 15:24, 2 March 2021 (UTC)

"Bone Apple Tea" listed at Redirects for discussion

Latest comment: 3 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

  A discussion is taking place to address the redirect Bone Apple Tea. The discussion will occur at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2021 March 3#Bone Apple Tea until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. Cnilep (talk) 23:32, 3 March 2021 (UTC)

Eggcorn vs. Mondegreen

Latest comment: 3 years ago6 comments5 people in discussion

The article seems to imply that eggcorns are different from mondegreens in some important but unstated way. As far as I can tell they are different words for the same phenomenon, which is fine. Is there any real well sourced linguistic distinction or can we just say that both Geoffrey Pullum and Sylvia Wright both independently noticed the phenomenon and each gave it a different name? Nolandda (talk) 22:27, 31 May 2017 (UTC)

Yes, there is a difference. An eggcorn uses words that sound similar (and have not, as with mondegreens, been misheard) to words or phrases, and have a meaning that is similar to the original term. Example: old-timer's disease for Alzheimer's Disease. A mondegreen, such as wrapped up like a douche, has nothing to do with the original revved up like a deuce. Paulmlieberman (talk) 14:03, 1 June 2017 (UTC)
However, like mondegreens, an eggcorn often arises when a word or expression has been communicated verbally. It may then pass into common currency in a written medium, typically the Internet. Witness all of the sudden and a whole nother. Nuttyskin (talk) 15:16, 6 July 2017 (UTC)
These are all interesting hypotheses about the distinction between the terms. Is there any academic or other authority we can reference to clarify the true difference (assuming one exists). Nolandda (talk) 18:28, 24 August 2017 (UTC)
One place to start might be here, including LanguageLog link. - phi (talk) 18:16, 4 September 2017 (UTC)
Check it out. CapnZapp (talk) 11:42, 14 March 2021 (UTC)

New section for suggestions

Latest comment: 3 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

I noticed the edit notice (that you see when attempting to edit the article) pointed to a talk section that had been archived. To fix this I renamed the old archived section, and started a new section with the name used by the edit notice (that I can't edit). It is below. Furthermore I implemented automatic archiving, and to that end, have pinned this new suggestion section so that it won't be archived by the bot (and hopefully not by human editors either). Cheers CapnZapp (talk) 12:04, 14 March 2021 (UTC)

Edit to lede

Latest comment: 1 year ago1 comment1 person in discussion

Hello, I was editing the lede to replace one of the given examples with the eponymous one, so that it would be explained in a preview (without needing to read the whole article). I accidentally submitted the change before putting an edit summary. Please consider unreverting the change. Cerulean Depths (talk) 00:29, 16 December 2022 (UTC)

Memmott 2015 user-generated content?

Latest comment: 1 year ago4 comments3 people in discussion

Several items in the article currently are cited to a 2015 NPR "Two-Way" post by Mark Memmott. According to the piece, "On Saturday, we asked folks to send us examples of the "eggcorns" they love or hate. [...] we've put together a list of the 100 that were either mentioned often or just made us smile."

This strikes me as something close to the user-generated content that is usually unacceptable. Unlike, say, Reddit or (the site previously known as) Twitter, Memmott and whoever else "we" refers to probably exercised some editorial judgement over the list. But they claim no expertise on the subject, and included examples that made them smile. It seems to me that eighteen examples is more than enough to illustrate the point, so that removing those five more won't negatively effect the article. Cnilep (talk) 06:58, 4 August 2023 (UTC)

Yes, agreed. Eighteen examples is indeed plenty. MichaelMaggs (talk) 09:11, 4 August 2023 (UTC)
They also include examples which don't seem to be eggcorns at all, like (from just the first page) agreeance and callapitter. The source seems to fail WP:RSEDITORIAL for linguistics. Belbury (talk) 11:07, 4 August 2023 (UTC)
I have removed them. Cnilep (talk) 05:38, 29 August 2023 (UTC)
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